Joe has confirmed turned face to the DOA universe.
Mattyos
Joe is basically Finn Balor isn’t he?
Walky_Talky
Ooooh, I wanna see fanart of Demon Joe.
Hatman
considering who he’s feuding with, that made me do a double take.
Mr. Random
He uses sex as an ice breaker, but he does have set standards.
He seems to think of himself as a “joy-giver”.
So by doing the do with as many women as possible, he’s making a lot of people happy.
I do think he has good intentions, but doesn’t or doesn’t want to think of the emotional implications that he leaves behind for the women who want more.
Mav
His problem seemed to be that he comes on too strong, no? Like I think with his date with Joyce, neither of them really communicated properly. But for the most part he seems really up front to the point where it’s uncomfortable to women who don’t want his advances or feel that it’s too much. I could be remembering badly, it’s been a while since i’ve seen him in action.
Hey, women can want guilt-free casual sex as much as men and Joe always makes it clear what he’s interested in. Part of the reason Joyce and he had such a problem.
Mav
That’s what I was thinking. Joe can be inappropriate, but he’s only interested in having a good time with women who want to have a good time with him (in the same sense) and there’s nothing wrong with that. I agree that to imply that he’s emotionally damaging the women he sleeps with could be interpreted as denying the desires of the women who want to sleep with him.
Mr. Random
Oh, that’s not what I meant.
I meant that some people attach a lot of emotional meaning to sex, and not all of Joe’s partners are going to have the same views as he does.
In broader strokes, not all of his partners will have Roz’s disposition. Some of them may have been looking for more.
What I was trying to convey is that Joe doesn’t seem to think about that too deeply. He has standard rules for making sure that it IS going to help someone though.
What I mean by all this is that I think that Joe believes that texting Joyce in this way is helpful and will make someone happier in the long run.
And Joe is all about that.
Wolfbeckett
“Some of them may have been looking for more.
What I was trying to convey is that Joe doesn’t seem to think about that too deeply.”
And nor should he have to. From what we’ve seen, Joe makes it perfectly clear what he’s looking for before he sleeps with a woman. He sets the boundaries ahead of time. If they end up wanting something outside the boundaries he set, that’s on them. They have moral agency.
While, I’m the one to be really down on Joe, I see this as a major positive sign. If he can see the humanity and build a stronger personal friendship with the person he’s just been sexually harassing, maybe this can be the impetus he needs to improve in general and become a sexually confident dude instead of the weird creeper he is now.
And this will also let him deal with the emotions surrounding the breakup of his own parents and become less resistant to the existence of emotions in his space as that is proving toxic to his friendship with Danny.
Plus, it’s about time for him to grow and become more complex with the rest of the cast before he was left behind entirely.
Orion Fury
So who’s next then, Mike?
Kris
Mike doesn’t need character development. He’s already a perfect asshole.
Why not? He’s already getting close to no screen time because every one else’s development is leaving him behind, so some complexity might do him good. I’m definitely a fan of characters I hate making me hate them less by maturing and growing as people.
Heh, maybe. But there’s so much story potential in her being an amazing foil to the other characters that I don’t see it happening any time soon. But I definitely wouldn’t mind a redemption arc sometime in the future after her potential has been more fully mined.
I think it’ll be a different type of maturation, more surrounding the rejection of toxic masculinity (fingers crossed), especially since the path he was on, the only real development that was seeming likely was having a plotline where Joe realizes that only having a “no means no” outlook on sexual encounters is a great way to trip into pushing past someone’s boundaries and sexually assaulting them.
So anything that lessens his bro-y toxic masculinity in that manner is nothing but a good thing in my eyes.
I think Joe is interesting because he’s come to college to not have to worry about complex deep soul searching but just relax as well as let his hair down. It’s an interesting and not wrong contrast.
anonymsly
There are other things that will need to change as well for Joe’s relationship with Danny to become less toxic. For example, Danny will have to be more direct, and ask the questions he really needs answered. Joe has indicated that he’s willing to have the emotional conversations and provide support, if Danny will actually say that’s what Danny needs.
So I don’t actually foresee their friendship improving no matter how much Joe improves. Danny is not an open/direct person.
(Which is incidentally, I feel, why Joe has been fairly successfully having a 24-hour emotions-in-Joe’s-space conversation with Joyce: she’s been direct enough that he knows what kind of conversation they’re having, instead of saying one thing and meaning something else.)
BigGuy
What? Joe’s consistently been one of the more complex characters in DoA despite (or perhaps because of) his comparative lack of screen time.
You may not have noticed, but even though Joe’s been used as a punch line pretty often, a lot of it is really telling about why he acts the way he does.
Isn’t is a little significant that Joe is *just like his dad*?
Bad Monkey
And specifically says he wishes he could say his dad was only like that AFTER the divorce. Yup. There’s depth no one’s really explored yet.
Haven
Joe’s actually been one of the more consistently decent characters, despite having a one-track mind. (Heck, if anything Joyce is the one who should be trying to make amends with him for, you know, punching him in the face.)
I think I called it in the comments. The possibility of a connection between them . . . but not this particular texting spree. WOW! Willis, fatherhood has not gotten in your way—you are still the maestro!
I think it was apx 10% of the commenters. Though I wonder when the theory started and when this was made.
AndieStardust
The theory was going around from the first time we see her texting someone. Then it seemed to lose traction when dorothy responded to one of her texts.
Are you sure we ever saw Dorothy responding? I could not track that down. We know that Joyce texted her during the gun episode, but did we ever see an answer?
Same here. I saw a bunch of people saying it was gonna be Joe, and I just didn’t think they’d reach a point of doing anything more than begrudgingly tolerating each other.
Joyce’s hatred of Joe has always been a classic case of ‘methinks the lady doth protest too much’. Yes, he’s a horndog, but he’s always been upfront about it, and treated Joyce like a perfect gentleman during their date (even walked her back to her room, even after they’d fought). Now that Joyce’s standards are changing, Joe is one of the first people she’d rethink her stance on.
Eyebrow
Joe is an island of unchanging straightforwardness in a sea of newly-revealed shadowy motivations.
He’s also an island of dependably straight in a sea of newly-revealed mysterious sexual orientations, though Joyce won’t be aware of all of that yet.
I mostly didn’t think it’d be Joe because he’s been not-so-great at offering comfort/advice to Danny and Joyce, while pretty open with her feelings, seems more reluctant to actually discuss negative aspects of her life with people she doesn’t know/trust. Especially since, if she just wanted to talk to someone with parent issues, she could have gone to Ethan.
And I’d say that, while Joe is overall probably a decent guy, his forwardness was not his only issue with Joyce. He openly mocked her beliefs and could get pretty disrespectful.
Joe is someone she knows that has experiences parental marital strife before. She may not like him at first, but she is familiar with him in that they have something in common. He’s also not connected to any of her situation in any way.
Mike is a no, for obvious reasons,
She and Dorothy are kind of awkward right now, and Dorothy is one of the reasons she has tensions with her parents.
Walky isn’t the type to talk about deep feelings, would probably make inappropriate jokes.
Sal just isn’t available, she’s a loner and is part of Amber’s arc right now.
Sarah is way too judgmental, even if she’s right about most things.
We know that it wasn’t Dina because Becky asked to talk to her.
478 thoughts on “Bloc”
Edhead
I’m not sure I like this….
Edhead
Joe thinks with his penis… but at least he thinks.
I’ll trust him for now.
Edhead
Yep.
Joe has confirmed turned face to the DOA universe.
Mattyos
Joe is basically Finn Balor isn’t he?
Walky_Talky
Ooooh, I wanna see fanart of Demon Joe.
Hatman
considering who he’s feuding with, that made me do a double take.
Mr. Random
He uses sex as an ice breaker, but he does have set standards.
He seems to think of himself as a “joy-giver”.
So by doing the do with as many women as possible, he’s making a lot of people happy.
I do think he has good intentions, but doesn’t or doesn’t want to think of the emotional implications that he leaves behind for the women who want more.
Mav
His problem seemed to be that he comes on too strong, no? Like I think with his date with Joyce, neither of them really communicated properly. But for the most part he seems really up front to the point where it’s uncomfortable to women who don’t want his advances or feel that it’s too much. I could be remembering badly, it’s been a while since i’ve seen him in action.
Charles Phipps
Hey, women can want guilt-free casual sex as much as men and Joe always makes it clear what he’s interested in. Part of the reason Joyce and he had such a problem.
Mav
That’s what I was thinking. Joe can be inappropriate, but he’s only interested in having a good time with women who want to have a good time with him (in the same sense) and there’s nothing wrong with that. I agree that to imply that he’s emotionally damaging the women he sleeps with could be interpreted as denying the desires of the women who want to sleep with him.
Mr. Random
Oh, that’s not what I meant.
I meant that some people attach a lot of emotional meaning to sex, and not all of Joe’s partners are going to have the same views as he does.
In broader strokes, not all of his partners will have Roz’s disposition. Some of them may have been looking for more.
What I was trying to convey is that Joe doesn’t seem to think about that too deeply. He has standard rules for making sure that it IS going to help someone though.
What I mean by all this is that I think that Joe believes that texting Joyce in this way is helpful and will make someone happier in the long run.
And Joe is all about that.
Wolfbeckett
“Some of them may have been looking for more.
What I was trying to convey is that Joe doesn’t seem to think about that too deeply.”
And nor should he have to. From what we’ve seen, Joe makes it perfectly clear what he’s looking for before he sleeps with a woman. He sets the boundaries ahead of time. If they end up wanting something outside the boundaries he set, that’s on them. They have moral agency.
JohnInCA
I’d like to point at “casual bang” from Book 2: http://www.dumbingofage.com/2012/comic/book-2/02-choosing-my-religion/casualbang/
As Joe says, “I’m the one who doesn’t respect women when you’re the due who thinks he knows better than the girl about whether she wants to have sex.”
GenericGuestName
http://www.leasticoulddo.com/comic/20061222/ If you read LICD that is.
And if you don’t, you should. Shame on you.
Lumpy Frogsnuggler
I used to read LICD. Stopped because I got sick of the dudebro Marty Stu wish-fulfillment fantasy.
Carolyn
Actually, Rayne is a pretty awful human being, so I don’t think this comparison works.
N0083rP00F
I had forgotten about LICD – aaaand all caught up – I think I’ll put it on hiatus for another year, or so, again.
I like the weekend kid vision ones better. At least he did touch on the progress of all those projects story arcs that just stopped.
Needfuldoer
See also: Roz
MrSpkr
I can respect that
Cerberus
While, I’m the one to be really down on Joe, I see this as a major positive sign. If he can see the humanity and build a stronger personal friendship with the person he’s just been sexually harassing, maybe this can be the impetus he needs to improve in general and become a sexually confident dude instead of the weird creeper he is now.
And this will also let him deal with the emotions surrounding the breakup of his own parents and become less resistant to the existence of emotions in his space as that is proving toxic to his friendship with Danny.
Plus, it’s about time for him to grow and become more complex with the rest of the cast before he was left behind entirely.
Orion Fury
So who’s next then, Mike?
Kris
Mike doesn’t need character development. He’s already a perfect asshole.
Cerberus
Why not? He’s already getting close to no screen time because every one else’s development is leaving him behind, so some complexity might do him good. I’m definitely a fan of characters I hate making me hate them less by maturing and growing as people.
Kris
Sooo….Mary actually has a chance then?
Cerberus
Heh, maybe. But there’s so much story potential in her being an amazing foil to the other characters that I don’t see it happening any time soon. But I definitely wouldn’t mind a redemption arc sometime in the future after her potential has been more fully mined.
trlkly
Yeah, but can Willis do it without RedemptionEqualsDeath (TVtropes link)?
Some1
@Cerberus
Characters can pull heel face turns and still remain foils!
See Vegeta, Zuko, Magus, Peridot, Dinobot, Venom, Scar Etc.
modulusshift
I think he might not this go around because he was pretty well filled out in Shortpacked and I’m not sure how he’d be much different now.
Cerberus
I think it’ll be a different type of maturation, more surrounding the rejection of toxic masculinity (fingers crossed), especially since the path he was on, the only real development that was seeming likely was having a plotline where Joe realizes that only having a “no means no” outlook on sexual encounters is a great way to trip into pushing past someone’s boundaries and sexually assaulting them.
So anything that lessens his bro-y toxic masculinity in that manner is nothing but a good thing in my eyes.
DarkoNeko
But Mike needs company !
Mav
Yes to Joe becoming more complex.
Shiro
I sure hope so. Dudebro needs a second track in his mind-highway.
Charles Phipps
I think Joe is interesting because he’s come to college to not have to worry about complex deep soul searching but just relax as well as let his hair down. It’s an interesting and not wrong contrast.
anonymsly
There are other things that will need to change as well for Joe’s relationship with Danny to become less toxic. For example, Danny will have to be more direct, and ask the questions he really needs answered. Joe has indicated that he’s willing to have the emotional conversations and provide support, if Danny will actually say that’s what Danny needs.
So I don’t actually foresee their friendship improving no matter how much Joe improves. Danny is not an open/direct person.
(Which is incidentally, I feel, why Joe has been fairly successfully having a 24-hour emotions-in-Joe’s-space conversation with Joyce: she’s been direct enough that he knows what kind of conversation they’re having, instead of saying one thing and meaning something else.)
BigGuy
What? Joe’s consistently been one of the more complex characters in DoA despite (or perhaps because of) his comparative lack of screen time.
You may not have noticed, but even though Joe’s been used as a punch line pretty often, a lot of it is really telling about why he acts the way he does.
Isn’t is a little significant that Joe is *just like his dad*?
Bad Monkey
And specifically says he wishes he could say his dad was only like that AFTER the divorce. Yup. There’s depth no one’s really explored yet.
Haven
Joe’s actually been one of the more consistently decent characters, despite having a one-track mind. (Heck, if anything Joyce is the one who should be trying to make amends with him for, you know, punching him in the face.)
Roborat
At least he doesn’t text with it.
SmilingNid
I called it.
Znayx
Yeah, lots of people called it, and I like where it’s going. I just hope it doesn’t betray me.
Deanatay
Hee hee! The Joece ship, long thought lost at sea, finally limps into port for repairs and to take on supplies – and passengers! All aboard!!
Doctor_Who
Don’t worry, I fixed it.
Pastafarian
“Is this Glassco’s?
NO! THIS IS JOE!”
Carolyn
Well, at least Patrick would listen kindly to Joyce’s problems. Too bad he’d probably give her godawful advice.
AHR
Oooh I called this in my head
saltchocolate
I think I called it in the comments. The possibility of a connection between them . . . but not this particular texting spree. WOW! Willis, fatherhood has not gotten in your way—you are still the maestro!
Orion Fury
I think it was apx 10% of the commenters. Though I wonder when the theory started and when this was made.
AndieStardust
The theory was going around from the first time we see her texting someone. Then it seemed to lose traction when dorothy responded to one of her texts.
fudo81
Are you sure we ever saw Dorothy responding? I could not track that down. We know that Joyce texted her during the gun episode, but did we ever see an answer?
Amazi-Stool
Pretty sure AndyStardust is refering to this strip.
Dorothy says she’s “checking in with Joyce” which may or may not include responding.
Mr Ak
I think a few of us may have. If it’s being withheld from the audience for a reveal, who else is it going to be?
Mr. Tropes
CALLLLLED IIIIIIT
MatthewTheLucky
Called it.
Porto
WOT
I
WOT
Lolly
*GASP*
TheAnonymousGuy
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5JSCbEKsguQ
AeroQC
This one’s better.
Willoughby Chase
Very funny.
Soundwave
whut
Firedaws
Seconded
Bendy
WHO CALLED THIS WEEKS AGO OMG
Dara
I was trying to remember that too. Nice call, whoever you were. Well done.
Cephalo the Pod
I sorta did. For me it was between Joe and Dorothy.
caesaria82
Everybody! (except me apparently, I didn’t think this’d be it at all, idk why lol)
AniDanny
Same here. I saw a bunch of people saying it was gonna be Joe, and I just didn’t think they’d reach a point of doing anything more than begrudgingly tolerating each other.
Deanatay
Joyce’s hatred of Joe has always been a classic case of ‘methinks the lady doth protest too much’. Yes, he’s a horndog, but he’s always been upfront about it, and treated Joyce like a perfect gentleman during their date (even walked her back to her room, even after they’d fought). Now that Joyce’s standards are changing, Joe is one of the first people she’d rethink her stance on.
Eyebrow
Joe is an island of unchanging straightforwardness in a sea of newly-revealed shadowy motivations.
He’s also an island of dependably straight in a sea of newly-revealed mysterious sexual orientations, though Joyce won’t be aware of all of that yet.
Kitty
I mostly didn’t think it’d be Joe because he’s been not-so-great at offering comfort/advice to Danny and Joyce, while pretty open with her feelings, seems more reluctant to actually discuss negative aspects of her life with people she doesn’t know/trust. Especially since, if she just wanted to talk to someone with parent issues, she could have gone to Ethan.
And I’d say that, while Joe is overall probably a decent guy, his forwardness was not his only issue with Joyce. He openly mocked her beliefs and could get pretty disrespectful.
Jake
ok, but why? why was Joe the one so many people immediately jumped to?
Mav
Joe is someone she knows that has experiences parental marital strife before. She may not like him at first, but she is familiar with him in that they have something in common. He’s also not connected to any of her situation in any way.
Mike is a no, for obvious reasons,
She and Dorothy are kind of awkward right now, and Dorothy is one of the reasons she has tensions with her parents.
Walky isn’t the type to talk about deep feelings, would probably make inappropriate jokes.
Sal just isn’t available, she’s a loner and is part of Amber’s arc right now.
Sarah is way too judgmental, even if she’s right about most things.
We know that it wasn’t Dina because Becky asked to talk to her.
Jason
Because we saw her texting with him in class a day or two ago in-universe.
Suchipi
Yeah, this. I’m not at all surprised.
Conuly
Which was when IRL, half a year ago?
Amazi-Stool
January 11. 2016, just to avoid ambiguities!
Showler