Well there’s always Final Fantasy. And indie gamedev. 😉
Taffy
Final Fantasy is absolutely a good topic. If you don’t know what a BluMagee is, I recommend looking into ’em. It’s like Mega Man except as a fabulously dressed wizard.
Speaking of creatures and powers and games, Halloween is a little over a month away, and I could use all the help I can get in making the DoA game I have planned!
Taffy
Can’t make any promises but who knows whither the wind may blow.
That’s truly a mood, but I like keeping up on Ana’s commentary, so I gotta scroll down to that at least. It’s like alternative alt text for me at this point
And I guess Booster reads pretty fast if they were able to give feedback from reading a story less than 10 minutes old. I wonder how many words Amber pushes out in the time it takes to scrub a memory card?
It’s not just the time to scrub a memory card, but also find and cleanse the online backup. Depending on how sophisticated Booster’s service’s security is, and how zealously Amber opted to go after the additional copies Booster made of it in the meantime, I could imagine this fan fiction may have even made it up to a few thousand words.
That remains to be seen. I haven’t read her work. I do know from the briefest of snippets that she’s a fan of meat based innuendo like “marinate” and “sirloin”. That’s amateur hour smut writing to me.
Taffy
Now I’m curious what sort of prose you (and possibly others) prefer from your smut. Personally, I’m fond of excessive simile and irreverent/casual descriptions of dirty deeds. A conversational tone helps take away some of the “mystique”, if that makes sense.
I… don’t think ‘straight’ is the correct explanation here.
Also, I think it’s very simple not to want to date Booster for basically admitting they’re attracted to messed up people and also kinda wanting to photograph you all day.
Autogatos
I have no idea if this is an accurate read but I feel like somehow Amber would actually be into them more due to that interaction. Would feed her “I hate myself and must be punished/don’t deserve good things” complex to be with someone she knows is specifically attracted to messed up people.
Whether that would be *healthy* is a whole other story. But considering her last relationship was with the twin of her “nemesis”… and who knows, maybe a psych major would be a good match for someone with as many mental demons as Amber has. Booster is pretty…blunt, straightforward, and analytical and that can actually be a helpful balance for a partner who tends to spiral.
And Amber at least seems willing to call Booster out on their occasionally problematic behavior and probably finds their analysis of her mental state less bothersome than a lot of people would since she’s very very aware she has issues and probably thinks worse of herself than Booster would of her, so anything they say wouldn’t exactly wound her.
seregiel
Booster might be unique in being able to understand the dualness that is Amber beyond just a clinical/observation basis too. Anecdotally, self-affirmation of genderfluidity seems to come about after experimenting with both “classic western” societal norms and expectations of gender roles, so Booster might have felt a little split in two as well. Plus, he is naturally adept at accepting people’s pronouns and most likely wouldn’t make a big deal of which side is presenting.
Autogatos
Ohh that’s another interesting point! I didn’t even think of that.
(And yeah anecdotally that matches my experience as well)
Ah, I see! It’s a very popular anime/manga series that’s really good. Specifically, the second part’s main character Joseph has a tendency to predict the next thing the guy he’s fighting will say, and then they’ll say it and then they’ll make a shocked face/noise.
Needfuldoer
It’s called a yeet-cute.
Taffy
I very much enjoy this wordplay.
Nova
Well this is a delight, thank you. I’ll be stealing it.
You’ll have to excuse any typos or spelling errors, trees are having wild sex in my neighborhood and I’m in the splash radius, which means I can’t see well and having to depend on touch typing on my laptop. I don’t see any red squiggles under any words so maybe I got it right.
Bicycle Bill
Trees can’t have sex!! They’re members of the kingdom Plantae which encompasses all plants, and reproduce through pollen coming in contact with the stigma of another plant.
Unless, of course, they are trans-plants….
BarerMender
As Ruth will testify
Taffy
If anything, she’s the comic’s #1 advocate of combining the two, especially as a flirting method!
Booster isn’t a girl so her being straight isn’t really relevant.
Taffy
Does “straight” still apply to nonbinary folks? Like, if I dated a self-declared straight woman before she Knew The Truth, would she potentially need to consider reclassifying herself?
Nono
Labels aren’t a strict category, anyway. There’s a reason the Kinsey scale exists.
You can have a type, but attraction doesn’t always follow those rules.
Taffy
This is very true. Sometimes though, I like to pose a hypothetical with the idea of seeing through the fiction’s reality.
Yeah i don’t really like the Kinsey scale, ’cause it’s binary nature indirectly excludes enbies like me ?
Autogatos
Yeah, I was thinking it needs another axis for the person’s own gender ID maybe, but that still excludes people who are ace.
In general it’s a tough thing to map on a chart/scale and actually cover the full spectrum of variations. In terms of identity there’s the person’s sex, gender identity, and gender presentation. And in terms of attraction you have to factor in degree of attraction, gender(s) a person is attracted to, AND gender presentation (the spectrum of “feminine – androgynous – masculine” traits, which also may vary by culture and even time period).
Leorale
Nonbinary/genderfluid AFAB here, married to a Kinsey-zero straight fellow, whom I was dating before I knew. He didn’t stop being straight, even though he ended up with a spouse rather than a wife. Basically I’m femme-y enough to trick his very binary lizard-brain, while his human brain respects my identity. Works for us.
Cal
I honestly don’t think there needs to be a scale at all. Gender and sexuality is complex and I hate that people feel a need to categorize everything
Leorale
Words and scales are useful to quickly express ideas to ourselves and others.
We know they’re broad brush strokes, and that probably nobody will completely fit the category.
Can you think of any situations where it’s nice to have a real quick way of saying / searching for a particular broad brushstroke of gender or sexuality?
Autogatos
@Leorale: yup that is my scenario with my spouse as well.
@Cal: as far as trying to completely define/map this stuff, I agree. A scale does not adequately capture the complexity. Gender and sexuality are straightforward for some but confusing and complex for others. But yeah like Leorale said, I feel like they have a use in very specific scenarios/conversations just as models to convey certain specific ideas easily and quickly, even if they wouldn’t necessarily work for everyone and every scenario.
And our brains just love categorization. Seems to be a key way they work, considering how often we try to label/categorize things that don’t necessarily actually fit into clear, distinct, separate boxes: sexuality and gender obvs, also another good example is the idea of a species. Species are boxes/labels we made up for our own convenience because our brain needs them for communication and understanding, despite the fact that it’s an oversimplified and not entirely accurate way of looking at biodiversity (life/evolution is a long branching spectrum that doesn’t actually have distinct borders and that becomes obvious when studying it in depth, but in casual conversation it is still helpful to be able to say “this is a dog, this is a wolf, this is a coyote.”
Autogatos
Yeah, sexuality (and gender) are complicated. And less clear cut for some than others. Labels are an attempt to make sense of it all but they have their own limits and, as Danny is an excellent example of, they can drift or people can have new realizations over time. And for some people, actual gender is less important.
It’s also helpful to remember that in addition to sex, gender, and sexuality all being separate, gender *presentation* is not necessarily linked with gender identity. Booster is nb identity-wise, but presentation-wise they lean a bit more masculine-androgynous with more subtle feminine traits.
I don’t see Amber being attracted to a woman or a NB person who presents more hyper feminine, but being attracted to Booster doesn’t seem outside the realm of possibility, regardless of their gender, IF Amber’s attraction is based more on presentation than gender itself. Or not, entirely depends on what Willis wants to do obviously, lol.
I’m bi but more often attracted to masculine or androgynous gender presentation than very feminine so it’s possible that’s clouding my reading of this, and I can’t remember if she stated it explicitly, but I got the impression Amber at least considers Booster to be someone who is physically attractive. If I were in this cartoon world I certainly would. 😉
Leorale
Oh, I see, you mean if you were dating a straight woman and then later she found out you weren’t a fellow after all? She wouldn’t have to reclassify herself unless she wanted to; she thought you were a man, and her brain treated you accordingly.
If she found out you were nonbinary and was like “ooh, hawt”, then the Kinsey scale may no longer contain her might.
Leorale
(Comment nesting. Both my comments were replies to @Taffy.)
UrsulaDavina
Sexuality and Gender are not one in the same one’s sexuality does not necessarily correspond with one’s gender identity.
Taffy
We’re in agreement. Also, I’ve only just noticed that your gravatar is of the Cybernetic Ghost of Christmas Past from the Future, which is neat.
UrsulaDavina
Thousands of years ago when the planet was just a frozen waste…I didn’t fully read the thread so I think misunderstood the fourm but I am going to conclude that what was stated above that the ” kinsey scale exists and that attraction doesn’t always follow the rules”
EA West
I started dating my now-spouse when we were teens. At the time I thought of myself as a cisfemale, but now I identify as non-binary. He still considers himself a straight ally rather than queer, because I’m cispassing, so he suffers no privilege loss by being married to me. In the future, if I go through with some gender affirming surgery, he may reevaluate his decision to identify as straight.
Viktoria
I know at least 1 nonbinary person who would consider it misgendering for someone to state that they’re attracted to my nonbinary friend while identifying as straight(or gay). They’re not a guy or a girl, so if you’re attracted to my friend, you’re not attracted to only one gender.
Taffy
I wonder how much of that requires prior knowledge. Without being Informed, I think we could argue that a woman would still be straight if she thought I was hot, but might not be if I told her my pronouns and she accepted that information. Like Nono said, it’s a loose definition anyhow, but your friend still has an interesting (and valid!) viewpoint.
Wack'd
I think what’s important isn’t so much whether “straight” is a label with a strict and unyielding definition–such things are simply antithetical to how queerness works–so much as whether Booster would be comfortable dating someone who identified as straight. They’ve already thrown a little shade on the idea that a gay man might be interested in them, and I suspect Booster wouldn’t be interested in a relationship where their partner identifies in such a way that might imply that Booster is a man (or near enough.)
Carms
*laughs in be-partnered ace*
like, three people get to be in overtly identity-affirming relationships. The rest of us fuckers hafta get our affirmations from sources other than the once-over impressions of randos.
Got cold shouldered out of a queer convention meetup cos my partner and I, both queer, looked too straight. so.
Wack'd
I don’t think Booster’s concern is that random passerbys might assume that they’re a dude. Like, if you’re non-binary, passive misgendering just comes with the territory. No, I think the concern is that they don’t wanna be in a relationship where they’ll worry their partner, who is usually dude-inclined, sees them as “close enough.”
Autogatos
It would really depend on the person I think, and their particular relationship with their gender. For some nb people, being seen as androgynous is important. For others, it’s not. For some, being nb is about feeling somewhere in “the middle” of the male to female spectrum. For others, it’s a feeling of being a distinct, 3rd gender. But for some, it’s just a lack of clear gender identity or attachment to a gender identity: Malaya expressed some feelings like this earlier in the comic if I recall, with her “I dunno how to argue with all of this” strip and her “she/they/whatever” line in another strip. Another good example would be Jim from OFMD. When asked if they’re a woman they did not reply with a clear “no” but more of a noncommittal “I guess, I dunno” indicating gender just wasn’t something that registers for them.
Someone who falls into that 3rd category (speaking from personal experience here) may not necessarily care how they’re perceived and may not have an issue with someone who is typically only attracted to 1 gender being attracted to them on the basis that their gender presentation aligns closely enough with that person’s orientation.
But for someone in one of the first 2 groups I mentioned above, it probably matters more and in those cases I can see the idea of someone who is exclusively attracted to one gender being uncomfortable/dysphoric.
I’d guess Booster probably falls into one of the first 2, considering they specifically use “they/them” pronouns. So I suppose it might be possible they would not be okay with a straight woman being attracted to them unless it comes with her realizing she is actually bi.
It’s notable that there was some pushback on the idea that Booster isn’t masc in the comments, seeming entirely rooted in the fact that Booster has kind of a boxy build, short hair, and dorms with a dude. It would be wild to assume Booster isn’t aware of how they’re gendered by others–achem. So my read of it is that Booster does not want to be perceived as masc-presenting, and part of that is not wanting to date people who’re theoretically solely into men. Framing it as something Ethan might not be into is just them not wanting the experience of finding out whether Ethan is into it.
Granted, that’s speculation on my part, and we’ll see how this plays out.
Autogatos
No I agree that is a totally plausible, and very likely accurate read of the situation based on how Booster has replied to stuff before.
I was just speaking generally about the topic. But agree that in my above examples it seems less likely that Booster falls into category 3 (indifferent about how their gender is perceived) and therefore much more likely to be bothered by someone being attracted to them if that person is attracted to strictly one gender.
v.gay.person
I know folks like that, too. IMO how we experience attraction is just as personal as gender and the language we use to describe that experience is our own. It doesn’t have to be strict, and historically the meaning of orientation categories has changed a lot and will continue to, just like how we experience attraction can change at different points in our life regardless of how we generally see ourselves.
I’m nonbinary and queer lesbian. I’m still a lesbian when I get turned on by cross dressers or trans men or when I have sex with men because I’m primarily 99% of the time attracted to women and femininity and only want to be in relationships with people who have traits closely associated with femininity. I’m not attracted to men as a gender. I also call myself vegan, even though I’ll eat and drink animal products when I visit friends’ farms because it’s ethically sourced because it doesn’t sit right with me to tell people I’m vegetarian but won’t eat /their/ non-vegan food.
pig
Huh. To me, “straight woman” implies “only attracted to men” rather than “not attracted to women,” which I infer is your operating definition. This is an interesting difference in definition.
That said, my husband is straight and still married me after I came out as nonbinary, so…. Yeah, binary categories get weird around nonbinary people.
318 thoughts on “Cleansed”
Taffy
I predict no controversies or arguments tonight, only good vibes and clean air.
Thag Simmons
we are notoriously calm and normal about these things, after all
Taffy
Just an exceptionally chill crowd all ’round, especially when it comes to interpersonal interactions.
Yet_One_More_Idiot
We never have any occasion to curse anybody, especially the illustrious author and illustrator! 🙂
seregiel
*whispers* Damn you Willis…
Schpoonman
I’m checking comments at 11:08 pm my time and never clicking on this page again, except perhaps as part of a re-read.
The Wellerman
Then I should play some appropriate music ?
*plays “Abracadabra” by Steve Miller Band on hacked muzak*
Opus the Poet
“Gonna reach out and grabya”
zip
really really really really glad this is the top comment. im not going to scroll any further down
Taffy
What, and miss out on all our very positive discussions and friendly exchanges?
The Wellerman
Well there’s always Final Fantasy. And indie gamedev. 😉
Taffy
Final Fantasy is absolutely a good topic. If you don’t know what a BluMagee is, I recommend looking into ’em. It’s like Mega Man except as a fabulously dressed wizard.
Taffy
… Blue Mage. Fuck this phone.
The Wellerman
Well I be an Abracadabra, Blue Mages rock! ?
Speaking of creatures and powers and games, Halloween is a little over a month away, and I could use all the help I can get in making the DoA game I have planned!
Taffy
Can’t make any promises but who knows whither the wind may blow.
The Wellerman
?
Kazuma Taichi
That’s truly a mood, but I like keeping up on Ana’s commentary, so I gotta scroll down to that at least. It’s like alternative alt text for me at this point
Sirksome
Amber works quick. Great for a novice writer. Very quick turnaround.
Sirksome
And I guess Booster reads pretty fast if they were able to give feedback from reading a story less than 10 minutes old. I wonder how many words Amber pushes out in the time it takes to scrub a memory card?
Uly
Depends on how long the story is. Like, if it’s a strict 100-words-only drabble, that’s only about 45 seconds of reading.
Some Ed
It’s not just the time to scrub a memory card, but also find and cleanse the online backup. Depending on how sophisticated Booster’s service’s security is, and how zealously Amber opted to go after the additional copies Booster made of it in the meantime, I could imagine this fan fiction may have even made it up to a few thousand words.
Nono
Considering that she’s been writing fan fiction since high school, I think Amber’s probably past ‘novice’.
Sirksome
That remains to be seen. I haven’t read her work. I do know from the briefest of snippets that she’s a fan of meat based innuendo like “marinate” and “sirloin”. That’s amateur hour smut writing to me.
Taffy
Now I’m curious what sort of prose you (and possibly others) prefer from your smut. Personally, I’m fond of excessive simile and irreverent/casual descriptions of dirty deeds. A conversational tone helps take away some of the “mystique”, if that makes sense.
Wack'd
Anything written before 21 is juvenilia, frankly.
Caro
honestly, i love them as a frenemies duo
TulipKitten
I’m wondering if they’re going for more than friends? Booster has been hitting on Amber for quite a few strips. But I think Amber’s straight.
Nono
I… don’t think ‘straight’ is the correct explanation here.
Also, I think it’s very simple not to want to date Booster for basically admitting they’re attracted to messed up people and also kinda wanting to photograph you all day.
Autogatos
I have no idea if this is an accurate read but I feel like somehow Amber would actually be into them more due to that interaction. Would feed her “I hate myself and must be punished/don’t deserve good things” complex to be with someone she knows is specifically attracted to messed up people.
Whether that would be *healthy* is a whole other story. But considering her last relationship was with the twin of her “nemesis”… and who knows, maybe a psych major would be a good match for someone with as many mental demons as Amber has. Booster is pretty…blunt, straightforward, and analytical and that can actually be a helpful balance for a partner who tends to spiral.
And Amber at least seems willing to call Booster out on their occasionally problematic behavior and probably finds their analysis of her mental state less bothersome than a lot of people would since she’s very very aware she has issues and probably thinks worse of herself than Booster would of her, so anything they say wouldn’t exactly wound her.
seregiel
Booster might be unique in being able to understand the dualness that is Amber beyond just a clinical/observation basis too. Anecdotally, self-affirmation of genderfluidity seems to come about after experimenting with both “classic western” societal norms and expectations of gender roles, so Booster might have felt a little split in two as well. Plus, he is naturally adept at accepting people’s pronouns and most likely wouldn’t make a big deal of which side is presenting.
Autogatos
Ohh that’s another interesting point! I didn’t even think of that.
(And yeah anecdotally that matches my experience as well)
Sav
Are they actually into her? Given today’s strip, they could have just been goading her.
Taffy
Could be both, tbh. Finding somebody hot and antagonising them needn’t be mutually exclusive.
Jamie
Next you’re going to tell me that some boys throw toys at the heads of girls they like.
Taffy
Some boys throw toys at the heads of girls they like.
…
HUH?!
Bicycle Bill
From twelve years ago (or about five and a half months ago DoA time)…
https://www.dumbingofage.com/comics/2010-11-22-throw.png
Taffy
(I was making a JoJo reference.)
Bicycle Bill
Have no idea who or what this is.
Taffy
Ah, I see! It’s a very popular anime/manga series that’s really good. Specifically, the second part’s main character Joseph has a tendency to predict the next thing the guy he’s fighting will say, and then they’ll say it and then they’ll make a shocked face/noise.
Needfuldoer
It’s called a yeet-cute.
Taffy
I very much enjoy this wordplay.
Nova
Well this is a delight, thank you. I’ll be stealing it.
Autogatos
This pun wins the comments section today.
Opus the Poet
That is a thing that happens in this universe.
You’ll have to excuse any typos or spelling errors, trees are having wild sex in my neighborhood and I’m in the splash radius, which means I can’t see well and having to depend on touch typing on my laptop. I don’t see any red squiggles under any words so maybe I got it right.
Bicycle Bill
Trees can’t have sex!! They’re members of the kingdom Plantae which encompasses all plants, and reproduce through pollen coming in contact with the stigma of another plant.
Unless, of course, they are trans-plants….
BarerMender
As Ruth will testify
Taffy
If anything, she’s the comic’s #1 advocate of combining the two, especially as a flirting method!
Proxiehunter
Booster isn’t a girl so her being straight isn’t really relevant.
Taffy
Does “straight” still apply to nonbinary folks? Like, if I dated a self-declared straight woman before she Knew The Truth, would she potentially need to consider reclassifying herself?
Nono
Labels aren’t a strict category, anyway. There’s a reason the Kinsey scale exists.
You can have a type, but attraction doesn’t always follow those rules.
Taffy
This is very true. Sometimes though, I like to pose a hypothetical with the idea of seeing through the fiction’s reality.
The Wellerman
Yeah i don’t really like the Kinsey scale, ’cause it’s binary nature indirectly excludes enbies like me ?
Autogatos
Yeah, I was thinking it needs another axis for the person’s own gender ID maybe, but that still excludes people who are ace.
In general it’s a tough thing to map on a chart/scale and actually cover the full spectrum of variations. In terms of identity there’s the person’s sex, gender identity, and gender presentation. And in terms of attraction you have to factor in degree of attraction, gender(s) a person is attracted to, AND gender presentation (the spectrum of “feminine – androgynous – masculine” traits, which also may vary by culture and even time period).
Leorale
Nonbinary/genderfluid AFAB here, married to a Kinsey-zero straight fellow, whom I was dating before I knew. He didn’t stop being straight, even though he ended up with a spouse rather than a wife. Basically I’m femme-y enough to trick his very binary lizard-brain, while his human brain respects my identity. Works for us.
Cal
I honestly don’t think there needs to be a scale at all. Gender and sexuality is complex and I hate that people feel a need to categorize everything
Leorale
Words and scales are useful to quickly express ideas to ourselves and others.
We know they’re broad brush strokes, and that probably nobody will completely fit the category.
Can you think of any situations where it’s nice to have a real quick way of saying / searching for a particular broad brushstroke of gender or sexuality?
Autogatos
@Leorale: yup that is my scenario with my spouse as well.
@Cal: as far as trying to completely define/map this stuff, I agree. A scale does not adequately capture the complexity. Gender and sexuality are straightforward for some but confusing and complex for others. But yeah like Leorale said, I feel like they have a use in very specific scenarios/conversations just as models to convey certain specific ideas easily and quickly, even if they wouldn’t necessarily work for everyone and every scenario.
And our brains just love categorization. Seems to be a key way they work, considering how often we try to label/categorize things that don’t necessarily actually fit into clear, distinct, separate boxes: sexuality and gender obvs, also another good example is the idea of a species. Species are boxes/labels we made up for our own convenience because our brain needs them for communication and understanding, despite the fact that it’s an oversimplified and not entirely accurate way of looking at biodiversity (life/evolution is a long branching spectrum that doesn’t actually have distinct borders and that becomes obvious when studying it in depth, but in casual conversation it is still helpful to be able to say “this is a dog, this is a wolf, this is a coyote.”
Autogatos
Yeah, sexuality (and gender) are complicated. And less clear cut for some than others. Labels are an attempt to make sense of it all but they have their own limits and, as Danny is an excellent example of, they can drift or people can have new realizations over time. And for some people, actual gender is less important.
It’s also helpful to remember that in addition to sex, gender, and sexuality all being separate, gender *presentation* is not necessarily linked with gender identity. Booster is nb identity-wise, but presentation-wise they lean a bit more masculine-androgynous with more subtle feminine traits.
I don’t see Amber being attracted to a woman or a NB person who presents more hyper feminine, but being attracted to Booster doesn’t seem outside the realm of possibility, regardless of their gender, IF Amber’s attraction is based more on presentation than gender itself. Or not, entirely depends on what Willis wants to do obviously, lol.
I’m bi but more often attracted to masculine or androgynous gender presentation than very feminine so it’s possible that’s clouding my reading of this, and I can’t remember if she stated it explicitly, but I got the impression Amber at least considers Booster to be someone who is physically attractive. If I were in this cartoon world I certainly would. 😉
Leorale
Oh, I see, you mean if you were dating a straight woman and then later she found out you weren’t a fellow after all? She wouldn’t have to reclassify herself unless she wanted to; she thought you were a man, and her brain treated you accordingly.
If she found out you were nonbinary and was like “ooh, hawt”, then the Kinsey scale may no longer contain her might.
Leorale
(Comment nesting. Both my comments were replies to @Taffy.)
UrsulaDavina
Sexuality and Gender are not one in the same one’s sexuality does not necessarily correspond with one’s gender identity.
Taffy
We’re in agreement. Also, I’ve only just noticed that your gravatar is of the Cybernetic Ghost of Christmas Past from the Future, which is neat.
UrsulaDavina
Thousands of years ago when the planet was just a frozen waste…I didn’t fully read the thread so I think misunderstood the fourm but I am going to conclude that what was stated above that the ” kinsey scale exists and that attraction doesn’t always follow the rules”
EA West
I started dating my now-spouse when we were teens. At the time I thought of myself as a cisfemale, but now I identify as non-binary. He still considers himself a straight ally rather than queer, because I’m cispassing, so he suffers no privilege loss by being married to me. In the future, if I go through with some gender affirming surgery, he may reevaluate his decision to identify as straight.
Viktoria
I know at least 1 nonbinary person who would consider it misgendering for someone to state that they’re attracted to my nonbinary friend while identifying as straight(or gay). They’re not a guy or a girl, so if you’re attracted to my friend, you’re not attracted to only one gender.
Taffy
I wonder how much of that requires prior knowledge. Without being Informed, I think we could argue that a woman would still be straight if she thought I was hot, but might not be if I told her my pronouns and she accepted that information. Like Nono said, it’s a loose definition anyhow, but your friend still has an interesting (and valid!) viewpoint.
Wack'd
I think what’s important isn’t so much whether “straight” is a label with a strict and unyielding definition–such things are simply antithetical to how queerness works–so much as whether Booster would be comfortable dating someone who identified as straight. They’ve already thrown a little shade on the idea that a gay man might be interested in them, and I suspect Booster wouldn’t be interested in a relationship where their partner identifies in such a way that might imply that Booster is a man (or near enough.)
Carms
*laughs in be-partnered ace*
like, three people get to be in overtly identity-affirming relationships. The rest of us fuckers hafta get our affirmations from sources other than the once-over impressions of randos.
Got cold shouldered out of a queer convention meetup cos my partner and I, both queer, looked too straight. so.
Wack'd
I don’t think Booster’s concern is that random passerbys might assume that they’re a dude. Like, if you’re non-binary, passive misgendering just comes with the territory. No, I think the concern is that they don’t wanna be in a relationship where they’ll worry their partner, who is usually dude-inclined, sees them as “close enough.”
Autogatos
It would really depend on the person I think, and their particular relationship with their gender. For some nb people, being seen as androgynous is important. For others, it’s not. For some, being nb is about feeling somewhere in “the middle” of the male to female spectrum. For others, it’s a feeling of being a distinct, 3rd gender. But for some, it’s just a lack of clear gender identity or attachment to a gender identity: Malaya expressed some feelings like this earlier in the comic if I recall, with her “I dunno how to argue with all of this” strip and her “she/they/whatever” line in another strip. Another good example would be Jim from OFMD. When asked if they’re a woman they did not reply with a clear “no” but more of a noncommittal “I guess, I dunno” indicating gender just wasn’t something that registers for them.
Someone who falls into that 3rd category (speaking from personal experience here) may not necessarily care how they’re perceived and may not have an issue with someone who is typically only attracted to 1 gender being attracted to them on the basis that their gender presentation aligns closely enough with that person’s orientation.
But for someone in one of the first 2 groups I mentioned above, it probably matters more and in those cases I can see the idea of someone who is exclusively attracted to one gender being uncomfortable/dysphoric.
I’d guess Booster probably falls into one of the first 2, considering they specifically use “they/them” pronouns. So I suppose it might be possible they would not be okay with a straight woman being attracted to them unless it comes with her realizing she is actually bi.
Wack'd
I wanna be clear, I’m not making broad generalizations here (at least, not on purpose)–I’m extrapolating specifically from Booster’s own objections to dating Ethan, a gay man.
It’s notable that there was some pushback on the idea that Booster isn’t masc in the comments, seeming entirely rooted in the fact that Booster has kind of a boxy build, short hair, and dorms with a dude. It would be wild to assume Booster isn’t aware of how they’re gendered by others–achem. So my read of it is that Booster does not want to be perceived as masc-presenting, and part of that is not wanting to date people who’re theoretically solely into men. Framing it as something Ethan might not be into is just them not wanting the experience of finding out whether Ethan is into it.
Granted, that’s speculation on my part, and we’ll see how this plays out.
Autogatos
No I agree that is a totally plausible, and very likely accurate read of the situation based on how Booster has replied to stuff before.
I was just speaking generally about the topic. But agree that in my above examples it seems less likely that Booster falls into category 3 (indifferent about how their gender is perceived) and therefore much more likely to be bothered by someone being attracted to them if that person is attracted to strictly one gender.
v.gay.person
I know folks like that, too. IMO how we experience attraction is just as personal as gender and the language we use to describe that experience is our own. It doesn’t have to be strict, and historically the meaning of orientation categories has changed a lot and will continue to, just like how we experience attraction can change at different points in our life regardless of how we generally see ourselves.
I’m nonbinary and queer lesbian. I’m still a lesbian when I get turned on by cross dressers or trans men or when I have sex with men because I’m primarily 99% of the time attracted to women and femininity and only want to be in relationships with people who have traits closely associated with femininity. I’m not attracted to men as a gender. I also call myself vegan, even though I’ll eat and drink animal products when I visit friends’ farms because it’s ethically sourced because it doesn’t sit right with me to tell people I’m vegetarian but won’t eat /their/ non-vegan food.
pig
Huh. To me, “straight woman” implies “only attracted to men” rather than “not attracted to women,” which I infer is your operating definition. This is an interesting difference in definition.
That said, my husband is straight and still married me after I came out as nonbinary, so…. Yeah, binary categories get weird around nonbinary people.
Caro