292

Indomitable
Posted on February 19, 2021 by David M Willis

292 thoughts on “Indomitable”

  1. Ana Chronistic

    That feels more like a Trajan Pro line

    Joyce, don’t give him ideas

    1. audkitten

      Just do everything in varying thickness of Helvetica. If done right it will look really slick and it might not immediately register what the text actually says, and if done wrong it just drive home the joke

      1. Legasher

        Heh heh heh “varying thickness.” Joe’s already got that covered too.

      2. Victor

        Look Around You

    2. Demoted Oblivious

      Joe, finally nailing it again, since the time he asked, “is it in your pants.”

    3. Yet_One_More_Idiot

      Ear-SIGHT??? Lol Joycy…the word is earshot! xD

      1. maarvarq

        As in “I think we must be within earshot.” “Why” “He just shot off one of my ears!” http://www.thegoonshow.net/scripts_show.asp?title=s09e01_the_sahara_desert_statue

    4. ValdVin

      Joe and QC’s Raven must never meet. Or, they are predestined to have a crossover Slipshine.

      I honestly cannot decide which.

      1. Jeff K!

        That was a comedy routine from one installment of a daily series 15 years ago and you pulled out the link like nothing.

        I bow to your memory supremacy.

        1. ValdVin

          Thanks, but for years I thought it was only natural for a perfectly adjusted grownup to devote far too much of his memory to (in the big scheme) inconsequential things which fascinate and delight him.

  2. Sirksome

    Or maybe just be a decent guy that knows how to respect women and the trust friends put in you by confiding secrets? Maybe just try that out for a bit just to see how it feels.

    1. Agemegos

      Joyce is telling Joe this because of their being human biology lab partners, not because she trusts and wants to confide in him, right. A Joeyce shipper died indside a bit.

      1. Rose by Any Other Name

        Where are you getting that?
        Joyce has had plenty of opportunities to confide that in people away from Becky. I think she trusts Joe more than you’re giving her credit for.

        NOTE: I say this without being a “Joeyce” shipper. I am currently between Joyce ships ATM.

        1. Demoted Oblivious

          Which two Joyce ships are you between, and is it safe to be floating there? Can harbour traffic control monitor your status? Do you have the correct safety equipment on board? Do you require assistance? Harbour control does not advise bobbing about the shipping lanes. They are high traffic areas and some of the pilots are drunk.

        2. Somsphet

          I heard someone talking about drunk pilots, where do I sign up?

        3. Demoted Oblivious

          Contact Exxon Mobil.

        4. BarerMender

          And make sure the pilot ladder is secured to a strong point on the deck. This bullshit of tying them to the rail doesn’t cut it.

        5. Deanatay

          Rose is a tugboat, it’s fine.

        6. Plain Marie

          Ha! I wish I could give you an upvote.

      2. CC

        This isn’t the first time she’s texted Joe to confide in him

        1. CC

          Oh hey, new gravs. Not bad

      3. Phil

        quick reminder that the two of them actually text each other a lot, as revealed some time ago (this being Dumbing of Age, “some time ago” might mean it was 5 years ago idk), so their relationship is deeper than what it seems when they’re physically together.

      4. Needfuldoer

        Of all the other characters, I think Joyce has opened up to Joe the most.

        https://www.dumbingofage.com/2016/comic/book-6/04-it-all-returns/interactions/

        https://www.dumbingofage.com/2020/comic/book-10/02-to-remind-you-of-my-love/mills/

        1. Eyebrow

          And Joe is proving himself worthy of that trust here. He can be a superficial shallow should with women in general but he’s quite engaged and insightful for Joyce.

        2. Matthew Davis

          Yeah, that next-to-last panel makes it pretty clear that Joe recognizes that this is a big deal to Joyce, and I see the final panel as him trying deliberately to distract her by falling back on their public relationship.

    2. Nono

      He did. Well, he tried. He gave out doughnuts, apologised to Rachel, tried to connect with Amber.

      He decided not to keep it up.

      1. Jane

        Becoming a better person is a process, one with ebbs and flows. Sometimes you get everything just right; sometimes you live down to old habits. But so long as you try, eventually you break old habits enough to not fall into them, and build new ones so that it’s not an effort not to be an annoying prig.

        Even with the backsliding, he can be better with time, and acknowledging his flaws was the first step.

        That said… It won’t stop me from finding him annoying and wishing he was off the page so long as he’s living down to his reputation.

      2. Sirksome

        Meh. That was halfhearted at best and at worst outright disengenuine. He was pressured by outside forces such as every girl hating him for his do-list being leaked. He back slid almost immediately or pretty close to that as soon as the heat died down.

        Also reroll!

        1. Sirksome

          Meh Leslie’s cool but I think I’ll stick with Sarah.

        2. Sirksome

          Wait what? Geez this grav reroll stuff is so easy to mess up.

      3. timemonkey

        He learned the important lesson there: not to rank women and treat them like objects. But then he tried to overcompensate by going to the opposite extreme, which of course failed. His next step will be in realizing he can have a sex life without being a pig about it.

        1. thejeff

          That’s the hard part. He still thinks he’s doomed to be his father. That he’ll cheat on and hurt anyone he gets involved with.

          I think what he’s doing now is using a facade of his old persona to keep girls at a distance, while not actually hitting on them as he used to do constantly.

      4. Blindness

        He kept up trying with Amber, she’s pushing him away. He’s at least calmed down his unwanted horniness towards women for the most part due to the others but has been trying to maintain his image to hide his changes. We just haven’t seen him as much in the past couple of years as we used to so his changes are either forgotten or are too subtle to notice in the long run

    3. goki

      You can still respect women (or anyone for that matter) and still mess with them. There is a line of course and Joe is smart enough to know when not to cross it (at least now), and he does have a point, if he suddenly stops messing with Joyce, it would seem suspicious, so he’s got to ease into stopping, and have a lot of fun a long the way. XD

      1. Wraithy2773

        Also, “Last Panel Of A Daily Comic Strip” rules apply. Most strips need to end in a joke, and sometimes it requires stretching characters in order to get that joke in there. Joe throwing in a parting shot that he doesn’t take too seriously definitely applies.

  3. Agemegos

    Copperplate gothic?

    1. Doctor_Who

      Like so.

      1. Agemegos

        Huh. I wouldn,t have called that either copperplate or gothic.

        1. Agemegos

          I’m used to copperplate being an elaborate round hand script, and gothic being sans serif.

          https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copperplate_script#/media/File:Bickham-letter-detail.png

          Funny what a wide range of meanings a term can have even within one field.

        2. Demoted Oblivious

          True, and yes you are correct that copperplate is a particular and precise style of calligraphy, versus more conventional bloody cursive fucking writing (shit), but the name is applied to a completely different, but still classic looking typeface in printing (and thus electronics) applications.

        3. Merbrat

          That script is said it is made *on* a copper plate. Literal plate, for engraving. This is the font.
          https://www.cufonfonts.com/font/copperplate-gothic-light

        4. BarerMender

          Yeah, Gothic and sans serif are literally the same thing.

      2. Sirksome

        For when Times New Roman is too understated but Gothic Black is too pretentious!

    2. Jungle Dwayne

      The Papyrus of name plates.

    3. chris2315

      Copperplate gothic

      1. Demoted Oblivious

        Bra-vo!

      2. Demoted Oblivious

        chris2315 delivers!

        “Look at that subtle colouring. The tasteful thickness. Oh my God. It even has a watermark.”

        1. Lieutenant Dan

          Best response, right there! ?

      3. BarerMender

        I like it.

      4. Opus the Poet

        Very schmancy!

    4. cmasta1992

      The former font of the Golden State Warriors until two seasons ago.

      This has been your sports design spot by CMasta

      1. ValdVin

        Are you a fellow reader of Paul Lukas’ Uni-Watch? Because if you want to geek out about a team’s font history, it is the place to be.

        1. cmasta1992

          I am. It’s a fun read just because we have different opinions on uniform design (I personally think he worships throwbacks and retros too much) but between UniWatch and SportsLogos I get my fill of uniform nerdom

        2. ValdVin

          Ah, the telltale signs!

          As a guy who is still awaiting the return of the Montreal Expos and Nordiques Quebec, I was predestined to be a member there.

    5. butting

      King over at Ubersoft is only too willing to help out.

  4. Muspel

    EarSIGHT? Not earshot?

    Joyce’s glasses must really be weighing on her.

    1. Fist_of_Life

      Of Course! Without ears what would hold up her glasses?

  5. Maemae

    Please. Please give us more Joeyce this semester. I’ve never asked you for anything, Willis, just give me this. I love them so much.

    1. Maemae

      Also, question: If Joyce has admitted to not believing in the ‘God stuff’ anymore, does that mean the last few strips were just her flexing her anti-science Creationism knowledge in order to keep Becky in the dark? Or does Joyce still believe the Creationism stuff, minus all the God-art-in-heaven parts?

      1. Rose by Any Other Name

        The way I read it, it is the former – all smokescreen. Hence the matter-of-fact delivery with little weight behind it.

      2. timemonkey

        The last few strips were just her answering questions about what she’d been taught, she never mentioned her current feelings about it.

        1. MrSmith

          Agreed, thats what it came off like to me.

        2. Blindness

          it’s the ones before class where she set Dina off that might be what’s being talked about, where she did have a subtle point behind her statements even though it was still saturated with fundie-tainted logic

        3. BBCC

          The way she phrased some of it sounded like she still believed it, but she never actually said it, no, and that kind of word game is probably to keep Becky in the dark.

        4. Needfuldoer

          It was probably easier to just rattle off the same old lines than to rephrase. Besides, that’s what Becky expects to hear.

          Note how she wasn’t getting particularly animated about it, unlike other times it’s been brought up.

    2. Mydnyt

      I think my preferred term for this ship I’ve seen is JoJo. And I 100% support and echo your plea

      1. Ava-Ann

        Joece Jojo Joejo just more of it please ? they are both so cute on this page I crave for them to become official

      2. Rose by Any Other Name

        NANI?!

      3. He Who Abides

        Nope. That opens this comic up to all sorts of annoying memes that I want no part of.

        1. Fist_of_Life

          I agree with this sentiment.

        2. Needfuldoer

          As long as Joe doesn’t continue to badger badger badger her about it.

    3. Mordecai

      Wholeheartedly agree–I am thoroughly excited. That’s about as lightly as I can put it in the interest of not being obnoxious. Just… I’m rooting for him to change so badly. I believe in them both so much as individuals, so the fact that their character arcs line up like this is something I really enjoy.

      Joe being better and Joyce finding peace may be some of the things I’m most invested in in the comic, personally. Which is saying something considering how many things there are to care about here.

      1. Needfuldoer

        I’m really hoping he shifts from Roomies!-Joe to Late-Shortpacked!-Joe this semester.

    4. Blindness

      she has dominated the strip since the start of the semester, how much more could you ask for without making it into “Joyce and everyone else”? We got a week of Walky strips and a couple of Walky/Lucy but it’s been dominated by Joyce, Joyce’s issues, Joyce’s impact on the others etc. since the start of the semster…it’s almost at the point of being too much Joyce.

      1. BBCC

        I mean, Joyce IS the main character, in fairness.

      2. thejeff

        They don’t just want more Joyce, but more “Joeyce”, which we haven’t seen too much of yet.

        1. Yumi

          Yeah, this; rant was off-target.

      3. zee

        Huh, it’s almost like Joyce is the main perspective character…

  6. TrueVCU

    This might be the most normal, relatable interaction Joe and Joyce have ever had

  7. Nono

    Is there something in the water that’s causing everyone to ramp up their most obnoxious behaviours to 11 this semester?

    Becky, Walky, Joe. Okay Joe started it before the break, so maybe he’s Patient Zero.

    1. Maemae

      points to Joe for acknowledging that Joyce’s admittance of no longer believing in God is a ‘big thing,’ though? It’s nice to know he understands just how earth-changing this is for her.

      (i’m still all aboard the joeyce train if you couldn’t tell)

      1. MrSmith

        As we all are

    2. Thag Simmons

      With Mike absent, the rest of the cast has to pick up some of the slack

      1. Keulen

        This is my theory as well.

    3. chris2315

      Yes, it’s called “newbookitis.” It’s a disease that causes everyone to play up their most recognizable traits and use each other’s names every other sentence for the benefit of new audience members. Usually wears off after a chapter or two.

    4. Spencer

      Joe specifically is doing it because he decided that he could never actually change (because his “change” involved completely abstaining from sex without really thinking about his actions too deep) so he’s deliberately acting like he did in the earlier days of the comic.

    5. Blindness

      What’s obnoxious about Joe? He’s crass and unafraid of being so, but he’s also right and he has hit the right chord in Joyce that is more of a friend than any of the others have really been. He’s an oversexed guy, but he isn’t obnoxious- just crass and lewd but not obnoxious.

      Dina and Becky are well beyond obnoxious, especially Dina’s recent outbursts about science. Walky is Walky and it’s his overcompensating for his inadequacies as a student. They are the only ones recently who have been obnoxious, Joe hasn’t actually been that.

      1. Yumi

        I didn’t find Dina’s recent strips obnoxious at all, so I think you have to accept that some is just a matter of opinion and that some people might see “crass and lewd” as obnoxious.

    6. Opus the Poet

      Haven’t you been a second semester frosh? This seems normal to me.

  8. Kravis

    No, Joe, you should only “poke” her when you two inevitably become a thing…

  9. JenGen

    It’s been a while, I forgot that she was regularly messaging him when she was back home. Despite Joe being Joe, she really sees him as a confidante. I doubt she’d tell just anyone this, not now at least

  10. Jane

    Joyce, sweetie, that’s not how ears work. You want “earshot”, not “earsight”.

    1. Jane

      Joking aside, though… Calling it “all of that God stuff” as she says she’s no longer a believer really does kind of demonstrate how thoroughly she lost her faith, doesn’t it. Or maybe I’m reading too much into a single line? It just seems rather… Dismissive, to me.

      1. Agemegos

        It wouldn’t be surprising if she were still pretty angry about having been taught all the Bible stuff. She has only recently deconverted, and doesn’t yet have much perspective on the way it deformed and endangered her life.

        1. Dara

          OH yeah. I imagine there’s a lot of just straight up raeg in there.

        2. Opus the Poet

          My Pagan group used to have a “recovering Christian” sub-group for all the people decompressing from Christianity. Think AA combined with Al Anon and some Bible readings. Teaching that it wasn’t the religion, it was the people. And that they were out of the toxic people so they could either continue as Pagans, or go back to a different denomination of Christianity.

          And no, we were not trying to use the “bad church” to spread mud over the entire Christian religion.

    2. Thag Simmons

      I think it’s a portmanteau

      1. Jane

        I just assumed it was some newfangled slang I hadn’t heard about, honestly.

        Really, I just wanted to poke a bit of fun at her for it.

    3. Agemegos

      She’d probably find that “incorrigible” was more cutting than “indomitable”, too.

      1. milu

        hah, true! it’s almost like she freudian-slipped and produced a compliment when she’d consciously been meaning to be telling Joe off.

        tbf surely he would also have been into being called an Incorrigible Sex Monster.

        1. Victor

          As a guy who has definitely been called incorrigible in bed, it’s not what I would consider an insult.

  11. King Daniel

    Dumbing of Age Book XI: You Un-Insert Yourself Out of Becky and Dina’s Business, You Indomitable Sex Monster

    1. Regalli

      With Joe doing fingerguns or something.

    2. Deathjavu

      Not even in the same league as “The Euphoria Is In My Pants” for book titles.

      1. King Daniel

        Yeah, but Willis says we don’t get the same character providing two book titles in a row…which is fair, really

        1. Deathjavu

          That’s as arbitrary as any other rule that’s been set *cough*Mike*cough*

        2. King Daniel

          There is a difference between a rule he put in place a decade ago and a rule that AFAIK was just announced yesterday, I think. 😛

        3. Sirksome

          Dumbing of Age Book (??): The rules for book titles are as arbitrary as any other rule that’s been set!

    3. Demoted Oblivious

      Dumbing of Age Book XI: You Indomitable Sex Monster

      Small edit (less is more)

      1. King Daniel

        That’s in violation of the other Willis-stated rule for book titles – they have to be full sentences spoken by characters, not fragments cut out of sentences…even (and especially) if this makes the titles run long:

        Book 1: “This Campus is a Friggin’ Escher Print”
        Book 2: “I Beg You, Don’t Cast Your Body Into the Cragged Shame Pits of the Lustwolves”
        Book 3: “Your Stupid Overconfidence is Nostalgic”
        Book 4: “Amazi-Girl is Always Prepared For Anything”
        Book 5: “Hey, Guess What, I’m a Lesbian!”
        Book 6: “The Machinations Of My Revenge Will Be Cold, Swift, and Absolutely Ridiculous”
        Book 7: “Just Put Down the Ukulele, Only Then Can the Healing Begin”
        Book 8: “Up Here, We Can Be Garbage”
        Book 9: “Now Let’s Go Commit Something Mildly Subversive Which, at Worst, Will Serve as a Humanizing Anecdote and Not as Anything Truly Threatening to the Power Structures at Hand”
        Book 10: “Reject Magical Thinking and Embrace Empirical Evidence”
        Book 11: “???”

        1. BBCC

          Also, Willis likes to keep his titles clean because they tend to be at kids’ eye level at conventions.

          Y’know, back when we still had conventions.

        2. King Daniel

          That too, yeah.

        3. Delicious Taffy

          Them kids have seen and heard worse from their parents, probably within the last five minutes.

        4. Bogeywoman

          Y’never know, a lil Joyce might find a lil window into the world

        5. deathjavu

          I don’t think “The Euphoria Is In My Pants” is particularly dirty, it’s euphemistic enough that it’s only dirty if you already know. Also, kids these days are on the internet…I think we’ve all seen the internet enough to agree most of them aren’t that naive.

        6. BBCC

          I grew up on the Internet. Trust me, it is possible.

        7. Demoted Oblivious

          Disappointing, but so is life.

          Wait, are you talking about conventions as large gatherings of people to share new data about commonly held collections of core data (like fandoms, hobbies and biological contaminants), or are you talking about social conventions like manners, mutual respect, and the rule of law?

        8. BBCC

          The first one.

        9. Needfuldoer

          Book 11 or 12 has to beat Book 9. I refuse to believe we’ve already hit Peak Title!

  12. cmasta1992

    “You don’t know but you’re dying to try you wanna kiss de girl”

    1. Yup

      La la la la la la la kiss de girl..

  13. StClair

    That was… actually really sweet?
    I think, anyway.

    1. RacingTurtle

      I agree

    2. Rabid Rabbit

      It’s very big-brother behavior on his part. Which is probably why she doesn’t like it, as her brothers (and possibly also her sister) may have teased her in this, frankly, Walky-ish way.

      1. thejeff

        Doesn’t mean she doesn’t actually like it. The reaction is part of her role in the bit.

        1. Needfuldoer

          Part of their role play? Those glasses are prescription!

        2. Needfuldoer

          gotdangit.

        3. Opus the Poet

          Norm-core!

  14. Spookyfox

    ugh they’re so fucking cute

  15. JenGen

    I feel like this comment section has like, some of the squarest relationship with their friends I’ve ever seen. Any time even the slightest teasing happens among friends happens in this strip someone takes it as a malevolent act of injustice

    1. Agemegos

      Possibly. My experience of being teased was relentless and awful. Perhaps it is puppies and orgasms for everyone else.

      1. JenGen

        Come on now. There’s a difference between actual friends teasing each other and being teased by bullies and other unwelcomed individuals. This interaction is obviously closer to the former than the latter

        Sorry you went through that but this interaction doesn’t scream “relentless and awful” for Joyce in the slightest

        Puppies and orgasms, nuance and obtuseness

        1. StClair

          it is entirely possible that Agemegos has never experienced the former. like, ever.

        2. JenGen

          Yeah, totally possible but usually you can recognize it even if you haven’t experienced it (of course for some people that is difficult to do and I’m sincerely sorry if that is a difficulty for them). Since their first date blowing up those two have grown pretty close. He’s defended her before after the fake dating fiasco, she’s forced him to be introspective (much to Danny’s frustration that he couldn’t do the same), and during the back home arc it was revealed that those two were texting regularly. Seeing this as antagonistic is ignoring all that.

          If this isn’t how your friend circle operates, cool. But my first comment refers to how every time something like this happens, anything that doesn’t have a reaction of “haha, oh you kidder, you jokester friend of mine” gets a reaction from some readers as though it’s a malevolent act.
          Maybe I could’ve phrased it better but that’s what I said

        3. Spookyfox

          also like maybe it’s just me but I never actually take the last panel as fully cannon or genuine ever. because it’s y’know a punchline. for a comic. that we’re reading.

          but anyway this is friendship. i love lovingly teasing my friends and being teased back

        4. Demoted Oblivious

          I have to disagree 100% with your last sentence, because clearly it should cover
          Kittens acute.

          (Though puppies can be very obtuse).

        5. Miri

          My husband is the oldest of 4. I’m a middle child. He “playfully ribs” and seriously pisses me off pretty regularly. But if he knows something will actually upset me, he will not do it. There have been occasions he’s gotten it wrong (and e.g. He did apologise when he accidentally hit a trigger I didn’t know he had, over something that happened about 27 years ago, that I had thought was minor enough that I didn’t mention it until after that happened)…

          If the person you’re teasing is laughing and calling you names back, and you’re friends or whatever with mutual liking and respect, that’s probably OK – but if they ask you to stop, and you don’t, that isn’t friendly and good-natured.

          Here, Joe is acknowledging the magnitude of what she’s just told him, then asking her how he should publicly respond to the news to best support her. While also reducing some of the tension that comes with a large, serious revelation. Friendship! Of the “you are such a dick”est type!

        6. Demoted Oblivious

          This had to be re-read a couple of times. On my first pass, it read as the solution to all the listed challenges was: Friendship of the […] dick-fest type. And while fwb can solve some problems, it didn’t seem right off the bat that it was appropriate to the preceding data.

        7. JenGen

          I’ll cop to that, that was my bad, haha

    2. Wizard

      Yeah, Joe’s teasing here struck me more as affectionate than mean. Of course, I can’t speak for Joyce’s perception of it.

    3. Blindness

      He cares about her and treats her like a sister, he’s done this with Amber before and did it with Danny a long time ago so it’s Joe showing how close you are. He doesn’t do it with the others, which folks must assume is either him being mean and a jerk or him trying to get into her pants- either way, it’s clear from the past that he isn’t doing it as anything but sibling ribbing

    4. thejeff

      I do know some people who, for whatever reason, are really bothered by this kind of friendly teasing in real life – even when they see it between others. For at least one of them, it was too close to abuse disguised as teasing she’d been through.
      It’s tricky, because it certainly can be a real friendly thing, but it can also be a good cover or excuse for worse. From outside and even sometimes from inside, it can be hard to tell the difference.

      1. StClair

        One of my brothers likes to do this. It’s fun… for him. Poke people and watch them jump or squirm or get defensive. Entertainment for someone who gets bored easily.
        Like you say, it’s left me with a bad taste/less patience/to assume the worst when I see others do it.

  16. King Daniel

    If only Joyce was raised Catholic, then she could’ve used Saint Lawrence’s help for learning how to avoid getting roasted

    1. King Daniel

      grav does not check out

  17. carms

    I really like this interaction. I was not really and may still not be a jojo shipper but man I really like their relationship. for all his flaws Joe has been a consistently good friend to Joyce, at least when (he recognises that) it counts.

    1. carms

      There’s such a Good Boy under all the dysfunctional socialisation and upbringing

      1. audkitten

        You can tell that he cares about her as a friend, and I’m not sure I’ve seen him treat anyone else as gently as he does Joyce.

        1. MrSmith

          Also the only other person to treat Joyce as gently is Dorothy and Joe is a friend of Dorothy…coincidence, I think not

        2. Delicious Taffy

          Joe’s a lesbian?

        3. RacingTurtle

          “Friends of Dorothy” do not have to be women. If my memory and a quick google to double-check haven’t failed me, they were primarily gay men

        4. Agemegos

          Agreed. It’s still not how Joe would identify himself.

        5. MrSmith

          I was trying for a play on words but I don’t think I quite nailed it…

        6. Victor

          For now. Every generation is more LGBTQ+ than the last. When this comic started, Joe was a millennial. He’s now Gen Z. By 2033 he’ll be Gen Alpha, and there’s a decent chance he’ll be at least heteroflexible.

          Hmm. Maybe 2034, because by then it might be fall of their junior year.

          I wonder if Willis will skip summer?

          (I’m still mad about Halloween. Damn you Willis!)

        7. RacingTurtle

          Out of nesting, but: MrSmith, I thought your play on words worked fine, especially since it was a callback to something Joyce said awhile back. I just wanted to clarify in case Taffy was actually confused, and not just joking

  18. audkitten

    Anyone else think Joe and Joyce would actually make a nice couple? Not right now, but maybe down the line some when they’ve both grown a bit?

    1. Thag Simmons

      It’s been a popular ship (if not a dominant one) for some time

    2. StClair

      Lots of people here, IMO.
      (Including me.)

    3. Agemegos

      There is a small hard core of us Jojo shippers, yes.

      Among other things, Joe has to realise that he can do what he told Jacob he admires Joyce for doing. Which is to say, when he recognises flaws in himself he ought to try to deliberately change to make them better.

      1. DailyBrad

        Yeah, Joe’s biggest issue is that he doesn’t have faith in himself to change, though I am curious if Richard’s been putting the work in. If he has been, plus him seeing that Joyce is changing such a fundamental part of himself, then maybe he’ll challenge that doubt in himself, as well.

        1. DailyBrad

          (Well, his biggest problem is the casual misogyny, but given I am talking about changing that, then the point still stands :P)

        2. Needfuldoer

          I wonder how much of that is genuinely held, load-bearing belief and not just a performative defense mechanism.

        3. thejeff

          At some point, is there a difference? Normally it not being genuinely held might make it easier to shed, but if it’s tied to a deep defense mechanism, that’s not really the case.
          Wear the mask long enough, you become it.

    4. crow

      I like their brother-sister dynamic. I feel like an actual romantic relationship between them would be difficult considering their histories. But if it happens it’ll probably be cute anyways, whatever.

    5. Lingo

      Honestly I think it’s Willis’s OTP for this universe.

    6. Wizard

      Eh, maybe, some day. For now, at least, I really like them as friends. I think Joyce has a whole lot to sort out before she’s ready for any kind of relationship. As for Joe, I think regular interactions with a woman he’s not actively trying to bed could be good for him. Just dealing with her as a person might help with the objectification problem.

    7. Keulen

      I’ve been shipping them on and off for some time now.

    8. Autogatos

      I ship it. They’re both flawed people but they seem to bring out the best in each other and feel comfortable confiding in/being themselves around each other, which is a very shippable dynamic. (That and the playful snark, which they both seem to secretly enjoy)

    9. Ava-Ann

      In my head I feel like the only way it’ll work while they’re still in college is that they’re going to get caught up in a moment of vulnerability but be in denial about it until it keeps happening. And when they’re finally honest about their feelings they will begin to make a conscious effort to address their faults and try to make it work… Secretly. They both seem like they’d be too embarrassed to admit they’re into each other/dating.

      And then further down Sarah would be the first to notice somethings up when Joe hasn’t been bragging about the women he’s shagged – or maybe that he stops hitting on her? Yeah, either her or Dorothy. Maybe both.

      However the case, I am so onboard with their ship. And generally as characters they top of my fave-not-annoying list so in case I’m dead wrong, I can still dream during moments like this, ha..

    10. Azhrei Vep

      I’m not a big fan of Joe and Joyce as a couple because I’m a huge fan of them as surrogate siblings. And mixing the two just gets creepy for me, even if it isn’t technically incestuous.

  19. Regalli

    Honestly the last panel feels as much like a ‘I acknowledge this is huge for you and want you to know it doesn’t have to change our dynamics’ as a ‘light ragging on Joyce is fun’ thing. (And frankly they are not wrong, and the fact that Joyce counts among her closest friends Becky and Sarah who are prime Joyce-teasers suggests to me she does enjoy that dynamic with her friends.)

    In conclusion: awww, she’s trusting him with an earthshattering secret again! Aww, he’s acknowledging its importance to her!

    1. DailyBrad

      Yeah, I think he’s just diffusing the tension a little and razzing her, not paying her trust back in scorn. That, and this would be a rather sobering place to leave things if they didn’t tie it up with a punchline.

    2. Wraithy2773

      Aye, that and also just ending the daily comic strip with a joke. It’s like when Danny came out of the closet to Joe, and Joe made a joke about Danny’s hat being too straight for him, it’s a funny joke to end the day’s strip on, and also true to the character in defusing the tension with a joke: https://www.dumbingofage.com/2017/comic/book-7/04-the-do-list/stufflikethis/

  20. MrSmith

    Gotta say out of all the interactions between the characters these two seem the most…relatable, realistic, real perhaps but that also includes relationships between the two in the different comics as well

    Its a shame we’ll probably never see them (possibly) take it to the next level although I’d be satisfied just seeing them going on a date together

    1. Deathjavu

      You can see that. It’s in the archives.

      1. Agemegos

        It went well. Mike helped!

      2. MrSmith

        I mean a proper date, a date without the need of a chaperone and which doesn’t end up in an assault

        1. Deathjavu

          Nope, too late, monkey paw finger has already curled up.

        2. MrSmith

          Naah I got a good feeling we’ll see something to suggest there might, some ways down the track, be just be a future for the two of them

        3. deathjavu

          *second monkey paw finger curls shut*. Great, now you’ve done it.

        4. Needfuldoer

          Joe and Joyce go to Galasso’s, and Mike’s Force ghost keeps interfering to Joe’s detriment. A spilled drink here, a dropped pizza slice there…

        5. MrSmith

          Grrrrr!

  21. Bagge

    Wow. That’s incredibly sincere, heartfult and supportive interaction there in the middle, between all the snark.

    1. StClair

      That’s what I thought!

  22. audkitten

    I totally want Indomitable Sex Monster on some business cards

  23. Alongcameaspider

    To be entirely fair to Joe here if he were to suddenly stop roasting her for it that may make Becky suspicious that somethings going on with Joyce

  24. Spencer

    This strip I think provides a clear divide in how Walky and Joe annoy Joyce for their amusement.

    Walky finds out Joyce needs glasses and just constantly throws shit in her face about it despite her stated hatred of even having to think about needing them. There was never really a point where it felt like equal ribbing.

    Joe finds out from Joyce that she no longer believes in God and Joe knows that’s one of the foundations of her entire person. Joe first asks if it’s “huge” because Joe wants to know how Joyce is dealing with it, and then she responds that yeah, it is huge.

    Then Joe teases her a bit, but it comes off to me as a joke about their existing status quo than, specifically, laughing at the dissolving of Joyce’s fate. Also it’s the last panel of a comic strip and it needs to end in a joke.

    1. audkitten

      See, I think they could actually have a healthy relationship if they were allowed to grow a bit more first. Like, if they were seniors or in grad school. I think it would still be disastrous right now.

      1. DailyBrad

        Yeah, like I do genuinely like the idea of Joe and Joyce as a ship, I think they have a very interesting dynamic, but it’s definitely not a “this would, right here and now, be a good idea” kind of thing, same as Dorothy/Walky, Amber/Danny, and Ruth/Billie were not made to last. Isn’t to say they’d be invariably doomed, but they were not ready at the very least, and Joe/Joyce wouldn’t be ready now.

        1. Autogatos

          Yeah I think one of the reasons I ship them is their respective interactions with each other seem to be some of the few times they each feel comfortable being truly honest and open with someone else.

          Joyce has been more open with Joe than she has with anyone else (even Dorothy possibly? Maybe not Sarah though) and Joe has been more sincere with Joyce than anyone else (except maybe Danny, but I’d need to go back and reread). She and Danny seem to be the only two people he ever drops his “act” around.

        2. Insanenoodlyguy

          The sex is not yet imminent but seems inevitable. This ship has a healthy chance for canon installation! The key moment will probably be the morning after, and what is or isn’t said, and if what is or isn’t said is said very dumb.

        3. thejeff

          I think the key moments are likely to be before the sex, though there will likely be some after as well. I don’t think Joyce has given up her romantic notions and will want some level of relationship before she lets herself get swept away.

          Which will be a big deal for Joe.

    2. timemonkey

      Yeah, ’cause Joe actually likes Joyce. Joyce and Walky share a social circle but they don’t get along.

      1. DailyBrad

        Yeah, Walky and Joyce I think do consider each other friends, but they act like kids around each other and have childish rivalry.

        Joe and Joyce have a more mature connection, even if it’s obviously been very rocky one. The parent issues and the Jacob issue, along with the lingering topic of Joyce being seemingly aware Joe has feelings for her, make for a very different chemistry.

        1. Delicious Taffy

          Wait, do you think she knows? I can’t recall anything to that effect. Keep in mind I’m forged from pure Autismium, though.

        2. Miri

          “What was I before I was a 0, Joe?” (Then he ran off to have casual sex with Malaya, who wanted to prove to… I’m not quite sure who that she’s desirable hot stuff. She kicked him out after, and he decided that change was impossible… But it looks like he resumed basic grooming after the kidnapping and Mike stuff/his dad married Amber’s mother, and he is now trying to be a good brother in the face of regular rejection – poor Amber is grieving AND totally peopled out…)

        3. dralou

          It was not blatantly said, but there were two times where Joyce pointed out stuff suggesting that she had an inkling:

          At one time (that I can’t find), she asked what score she had before Joe put a zero on her in his Do-list.
          And at another time, she stated that Joe wouldn’t try to stop her flirting with Jacob if Joe didn’t think she had a shot: https://www.dumbingofage.com/2018/comic/book-8/03-faz-is-great/lying/

      2. BBCC

        Joyce likes Walky. He was one of the people she wanted when she was stuck at home post-shooting last semester. Dorothy and Billie were the other two.

        1. Spencer

          I’m not entirely sure she likes Walky so much as he is a familiar figure in her life that she put with around Dorothy.

        2. Regalli

          Yeah. The difference is that Walky seems to genuinely struggle with ‘there is a line and I should not cross it,’ whether that’s his sister’s fundraiser for her best friend not meeting goals or Joyce needing glasses. (Given we’ve seen him try to defuse tension between Sal and Linda – unsuccessfully, but still – gotta assume the whole ‘favored child in an abusive household who clearly uses jokes as a defense mechanism’ thing plays a role there as well.) They’re friends. Not as close friends as Joyce is with others, but close enough Walky’s teasing falls into ‘annoyingly over the line, but friendly’ rather than Not Friend teasing like, say, Mike’s.

        3. thejeff

          Though it’s also worth noting that with Walky, Joyce teases back. Which she doesn’t do as much with the others. They go after each other pretty regularly, even if it wasn’t so apparent in the glasses strips.

          Some take that as her actually disliking him, but I read it as just a different twist on their friendly teasing relationship.

        4. Regalli

          Yeah, she’s the youngest sibling, she’s almost certainly familiar with dishing out teasing as a form of affection, not just taking said teasing. I don’t think either of them is as close to each other as they are to other members of the cast – I can’t see Joyce telling Walky this yet, or Walky knowing how to respond to it seriously the way he could for Amber’s ‘Faz may be my half-brother and I try not to think about it because then I feel guilty for not being there for him’ or Jennifer’s depression cuddles – but they do genuinely seem to enjoy their dynamic. (Thinking on it, I think Walky’s the only main cast member who’s had an onscreen Teasing Sibling Dynamic – Sal and Jennifer both get aggravated at him, Amber’s a mixture of frustration towards and defensiveness of Faz, Ruth firmly puts herself in the Defend Howie position, Jacob very much wants to impress Harrison, and everyone else hasn’t really had enough interaction with a sibling onscreen to know for sure. We know from Jocelyne’s ‘new little sister says what’ bit that the Browns have at least a little teasing in their dynamic. Maybe the two of them fill that gap for each other? Hard to say since most interactions between Joyce and Jocelyne also include Joyce going through some shit, Jocelyne trying to gauge if her little sister’s safe to hear a bombshell, and/or their parents, so we don’t know for sure what their dynamic was like growing up.)

  25. BBCC

    Joyce, stop giving him ideas! You know what kind of friend he is. XD

  26. P!enapple

    Love that she can talk with joe, and tell him some of what means a lot to her, and that she trusts him. So sweet it tugs on my heart, and rarely do i feel that innocent, trusting vibe 🙂

  27. bcb

    You should really tell Becky. She isn’t unwilling to hang out with people who are atheist (see Dina). IF she gets upset about it (and that’s a big if), it will be because you didn’t feel like you could tell her, which would get worse the longer you wait.
    (Yes, I am talking to a fictional character who can’t hear me.)

    1. DailyBrad

      I think there’s more to it than that. Like, keep in mind how frustrated she got with Joyce at the party, so while I think Becky would be understanding, Joyce has reason to not just take that for granted.

      I think she also just doesn’t especially want to talk about it right now with family, and Becky’s family now. Like, I doubt Jocelyn knows.

    2. Agemegos

      Joyce has still internalised faith as a virtue and doubt as a failing. She does not yet truly accept that faith is a moral failing like anger or sloth. Becky once reproached her for expressing doubt when Becky had maintained her faith through greater tribulations, and she is ashamed for Becky to know the extent of her, as they both see it, weakness.

      1. DailyBrad

        Yeah, Becky rebuked her at the party rather harshly, even if I think it was Joyce’s tone that bothered her as much as her words, so she might be less harsh if the context had been different than Joyce being kind of dismissive about Becky’s concerns about premarital hanky-panky with Dina.

        It’s going to be interesting to see how different Becky may feel when she inevitably does find out, if she’s going to still come down on Joyce over it or recognize that her feelings aren’t just Joyce being kind of pissy about it like she was in the moment.

        1. Agemegos

          I observe that Becky herself has given up the young-Earth creationism they were raised in, and presumably would not fault Joyce for doing the same. Either it does not occur to Joyce that she could dissimulate belief in some convenient subset of Christian beliefs and faith in some nebulous all-father who had not specifically done any discreditable acts. “God is Love!”

        2. thejeff

          It would be hard and would probably lead to some questions she doesn’t want to deal with, since Becky knows how closely together they were tied in Joyce’s head.
          Evolution means no Garden of Eden, which means no Fall, which means no Original Sin, which means everything they’ve been taught is wrong.

    3. Keulen

      I agree that Joyce should tell Becky, but I worry that Becky might not react as well to learning that Joyce is now an atheist. Becky is clearly ok with Dina being an atheist, but they’ve only known each other for a few months and Dina has been an atheist for the entire time that Becky has known her. Meanwhile, Becky and Joyce are childhood friends who were both raised in the same fundie Christian upbringing, so I feel like it might be harder for Becky to accept that Joyce is an atheist now.

  28. DailyBrad

    Ooh, interesting, including Joe in this trust circle. Like yeah, I strongly suspected she would, she’s confided in him before, and she knows he *can* be discrete if he wants to be. Like, he’s less likely to slip this than Walky would accidentally (though Walky has been her secret keeper before, too, like on the party), or possibly try to force the issue in order to help.

    Like, Joe was who she went to before her parents split but she became aware they were fighting, so there’s precedent, it probably isn’t just because it came up with regards to class. I also am curious if it’s just God she is on the outs with, and if her Young Earth stuff was genuine or just her keeping appearances.

    1. thejeff

      It’s kind of implied here that the “God stuff” includes the creationism they were talking about before class.

      I suspect it’s not quite that simple and she’ll have some work to do clearing all the “debunking” she was taught out of her head.

  29. PASchaefer

    I can’t believe DW passed up the chance to use “earsight” in the url. Surely that won’t come up again.

  30. crow

    He pokey da hair

    1. RacingTurtle

      *poke*

  31. Suet

    Joyce’s Week In Summary: “Opposite!”

    “earsight”? Must be the case of the slips

  32. MrSmith

    It seems to me that Joyce might be the first girl that made Joe realise that girls can be more than just a receptacle for “little Joe”, that he can have shared experiences with them, that they just might even be…equals

    If (and admittedly thats a pretty big if) thats the case then Joyce is going to play a very big part in Joes life

    I still remember the first girl that made me think “huh” (we still occasionally talk on facebook) and she played a big part in changing me from somewhat of a Joe into…well still a bit like Joe actually but with a few of the rougher edges taken off

    I really hope its similar for Joe because once that empathy kicks in he’ll become a better person because he’ll treat women better, not because its the right thing to do but because he wants to and his life will actually improve

    I don’t like the idea of two people getting together with the idea of one of them “fixing” the other but in this case Joyce might just be fixing Joe inadvertently, hes certainly a better person already for knowing Joyce

    1. Agemegos

      What might be best for Joe is not that Joyce “fix” him, but that he emulate her example and start fixing himself. He recognises that she does it — he told Jacob that she does — and would I think be better and happier for the belief that he can do so too and the effort of trying.

      1. MrSmith

        I don’t mean Joyce is actively trying to fix Joe but rather through the interactions they’ve had, Joyces patience (how many other girls have actually tried to find out what makes Joe tick?) and Joyces examples of how to actively improve she might just have become almost a mentor for Joe, someone to aspire to be like

        1. Agemegos

          Yeah, that’d be nice and is my head-canon. But I don’t tell Willis so as not to tempt them to spoil it for me.

    2. thejeff

      I don’t think it’s quite that simple with Joe. Much of his problem is that he thinks he’d emulate his father and hurt anyone he got involved with by cheating on them. He tried to avert this by just having casual sex, so no one would care enough to be hurt.
      In his own messed up way, empathy’s always been part of it for Joe.

      1. MrSmith

        That’s the thing though, he’s actually not that far off from being a good guy

        He’s kept Joyce’s trust, he’s not fazed at his best friends bi sexuality, he tried to mend Jacob and Joyce’s relationship and he doesn’t buy into strange notions of what it means to he a man

        1. thejeff

          I don’t know about that last. He’s definitely some toxic notions about sex, if that counts as “strange notions of what it means to be a man.”

        2. MrSmith

          It was more about Walkys views about masculinity and shoes

  33. RacingTurtle

    Joe’s tiny smile as Joyce hauls him away in the first panel is really cute

    1. MrSmith

      He certainly doesn’t mind physical contact with Joyce thats for sure

  34. Joyfulldreams

    With all the talk of JoJo in the comments, does anyone have any good fic recs. I’m falling so hard for this ship I must consume content.

    “They’d be a great couple after growing a bit first too bad we’ll never see it because they’d need to be like seniors and time in the comic will not allow it” BUT FANFIC WILL. WHERE’S THE FANFIC. GIMME.

    1. Delicious Taffy

      Is… is there DoA fanfic? I knew there was fanart (primarily Yoto and hyper???), but the Literature has completely passed under my radar.

      1. BBCC

        I’ve written a couple Marcie/Sal fics on AO3. No JoJo sadly and a look at AO3 doesn’t yield any I can see either.

      2. Joyfulldreams

        What the!!! there are only like 17 DoA fanfics on AO3?!?!?!? WHAT?!?!?

        My heart is BROKEN, how could this comic be running for this long without a fandom?!?!

        Where am I going to get the fic where Joe is the first person Joyce does the premarital hanky panky with?!?!?!

        1. Joyfulldreams

          Someone, anyone, please tell me where the literature is. It must exist. There must be more.

        2. BBCC

          I believe there’s a bit more on Tumblr. You could also try Fanfiction.net but I wouldn’t hold my breath.

          There’s definitely a fandom, but fanfic does not seem our strong point. I write a little, but my interests focus more on my faves so I haven’t been much inspired for Joe/Joyce. I like both of ’em and I can see potential, but Joe’s not high on my fave list.

        3. Regalli

          I haven’t successfully finished a fic in SO FUCKING LONG, but I also tend to be pretty meticulous in trying to make things canon-compliant (or ‘canon compliant with a couple big divergences’ if necessary) if I’m not working explicitly in an AU. For a daily strip, that makes things a bit… difficult. I also tend to assume Joyce/Joe is a really long-game ship where they aren’t ready to date YET, but if and when they do there’s a very real chance they remain together as endgame (whatever that means in this particular comic), which puts things in a nebulous future I’m not remotely prepared to speculate on.

          Could potentially someday fit some shipping into a fic where I don’t think canon will get to in a hurry, though. Wouldn’t be the primary focus, but. Hm.

        4. Joyfulldreams

          Seriously though y’all, I spent all of last night thinking about this. Can you IMAGINE the character growth involved with Joe and Joyce doing the do? How kind of thematically perfect it is?

          For Joyce it would involve finally trying to let go of the ways her upbringing made her terrified of acting on her own desires, and alienated her from her own body; and doing it with somebody she trusts who cares about her and is EXPERIENCED and will make sure to show her a damn good time.

          And for Joe??? Letting somebody in emotionally while having sex??? Having FEELINGS about them, before during and after???!?

          fjdsiGJioasjGIADJSgiodji it would be so PERFECT AUGH.

          If this ever happened it would be the siren call for me to finally get slipshine.

        5. Joyfulldreams

          Or just write fanfic about it. Come on people, all the Jojo shippers in this comment section and NOBODY is gonna do the writing???

          Maybe I just need to be the change I want to see in the world.

          Other fic idea: Mike fix-it fic where he doesn’t die and instead has to actually work through improving his shitty attitude and so also Ethan doesn’t vanish for the semester so he and Danny can work through THEIR stuff and get together. Perfect.

  35. AbacusWizard

    aw yuss coppaplate goth is tha best font

  36. Throwatron

    i cannot believe i ship this, i am ashamed but also it feels good

    1. Council

      Honestly, it seems all around good for both of them. They bring out the best in each other.

      If only they weren’t terrified of the best in each other, it would have been a thing a while ago.

      1. Agemegos

        Interesting view! I suppose that the best in Joyce is deliberately changing herself for the better, and Joe is afraid of being responsible for being what he becomes. What would you say is the best in Joe that Joyce is afraid of developing?

        1. Council

          An independent worldview, wielding labels rather than letting himself and others be defined by them, him being sexually liberated(a quality independent of him being an oversexed creep), and most of all, the ability to cope with situations he dislikes in a constructive manner.

          The latter is not to be confused by an ability to improve in a constructive manner. I realize there is a possible overlap between the two ideas, but not necessarily.

          And yes, you pinned down what I had in mind in the other direction. I’d also add Joyce’s propensity to look at anyone’s qualities as a person, prejudices be damned, and empathize with what she finds, while Joe is prone to deliberately ignore such things to avoid becoming emotionally invested.

        2. Needfuldoer

          This is a good take.

  37. JediMB

    I ship Joe with a container to… Abu Dhabi?

    1. Eldritchy

      At least he’ll have Nermal for companionship.

    2. milu

      that got a hoot out of me =D

  38. Eldritchy

    Somehow I feel like Joe always wanted to be an older brother and here he sees a chance for himself.

  39. Yotomoe

    “Earsight” Joyce’s Synesthesia is getting worse, ain’t it?

    1. Delicious Taffy

      The music software?

    2. King Daniel

      Is that better or worse than eyesmell?

    3. PB

      Huh, so it is

  40. PB

    Stop
    Being
    So
    Damn
    SHIPPABLE

    1. plasticwrap

      Boys only want one thing and it’s DISGUSTING

      1. Needfuldoer

        That can’t be healthy. Personal hygiene is important!

  41. Daniel M Ball

    damn, Joe may just badger her back into Faith.

  42. Sombrero

    Nice contrast (again) between Joe’s obnoxious public persona and likeable private one that only is allowed to come out with people that have earned his respect. From foolish to perceptive in just two strips.

  43. plasticwrap

    I continue to like Joe more and more.

  44. CJ

    She looks like her sister in panel 3.

    1. Needfuldoer

      They have the same eyes, hair color, and face shape/jawline.

      https://www.dumbingofage.com/2019/comic/book-9-comic/03-sometimes-the-sky-was-so-far-away/shortsighted/

  45. Lone Duck

    TBF, Joe and Joyce are pretty similar. Both were raised in dysfunctional families, whose upbringing was largely shaped by their parents. And both struggle to publicly leave that pattern of behavior behind.

    Also, his name begins with a J, which means Joe would fit into the Brown family dynamic.

  46. Lone Duck

    Also…
    https://www.dumbingofage.com/2011/comic/book-1/03-men-are-from-beck-women-are-from-clark/bicep/

  47. JBento

    Today, on our “People Who Deserve Nothing and Should Get Even Less” segment, I would like folks to go to this tweet by Ocasio-Cortez, a representative of New York who helped fundraise over 1 MILLION DOLLARS for a relief fund for FUCKING TEXAS, and read the responses of Texans.

    https://twitter.com/AOC/status/1362608192958652417

    1. Needfuldoer

      It’s easier to double down on preconceived notions than it is to admit they’re wrong.

  48. Pilgrim

    I’ve been meaning to write something snarky about how Dumbing of Age Bloomington has a lot more snow on the ground than real world Bloomington sees in a typical decade. Then came last week storms, which dumped at least a foot. Biggest storm since 2014.

    Do your Hoosier fans a favor and don’t write any storylines about tornadoes.

  49. SolomonK

    I think it’s possible that “earsight” is either a joke remark that Joyce has heard before, a small bit of wordplay she is doing herself here, or is indicative of the fact that due to her new glasses she has “eyesight” on her mind.

  50. thumb

    Jesus, I remember the couples who would pretend not to be together when it was super obvious. Same energy.

    But they got good vibes. Joyce confides in Joe and is willing to ask a favour, Joe has no problem keeping it hidden even if it plays off his jerk persona.

  51. Rabisch

    Oh no… They are adorable together ♡!!!

  52. Vulcanodon

    She’s getting better at speaking the words. This… is a really big deal.

  53. zee

    God this whole strip is so fucking cute. Also why is joe kinda hot in panel 2? Is it because Joyce is kinda realizing it?

    1. MrSmith

      Pretty sure the future Mrs Rosenthal has already acknowledged the future Mr Browns hotness

  54. Needfuldoer

    Dat panel 3 Joyce, tho…

    1. Sombrero

      A timely reminder that Joyce is Jocelyn’s sister.

      1. Throwatron

        I mean Jocelyn needs some tips from her sister on glasses game, these glasses on Joyce is among the cutest things I have SEEN in LIFE.

        1. Sombrero

          Brown & McIntyre, Glass-Fashionistas since DoA Book 11.

  55. wiki

    I can’t believe people are upset at Joe for this interaction, it adorable.

    (I get a lot of people are still mad at Joe for previous acts, but I find him pretty tame when it comes to sexism. Like the worst he did was the list and tbh the fact he kept a private ongoing list is more stupidly nerdy to me than insulting)

    1. wiki

      god dammit joe, don’t show up with that expression when I am defending you

    2. Spencer

      I mean, the list was pretty awful?

      He kept an itemized, numeric list of women at his college that he shared around, and while this was treated as a funny dudebro thing eventually it came out, everyone was super pissed off at him, Rachel flat out tells him that it’s a miracle it was never used by predators who now had a description of every girl in Joe’s vicinity, and most importantly of all it made Joyce realize that Ryan wasn’t just a singularly evil person who sprang from the ground committed to being the worst person alive, but that he was someone raised in a culture that taught him women are a sexual commodity to be exploited and even someone like Joe, someone she considered a friend she relied on for support in a bad moment, could engage in that culture.

      Joe is not an outright misogynist but his attempts at avoiding the Dreaded Feels lead him to create a system where he has entirely transactional relationships with women. I don’t know if this was always the intent or Willis’ own perception of Joe changed over time, but there’s a clear distinction between the frat bro with a decent head on his shoulders who lectured Danny on protecting Billie from having sex with him on the grounds that she can’t decide for herself, and how he’s been written since he tried and seemingly failed to make a change.

    3. Needfuldoer

      In this instancespecifically, I think the last panel is him deflecting as a defense mechanism to keep the conversation at surface-level. He still tries to keep others at arm’s length because he’s afraid of committing and hurting people.

      1. Deathjavu

        We call this maneuver “the Walky”.

        1. Needfuldoer

          I don’t think I want to know what kind of toy Joe would throw at her head.

    4. TemperaryObsessor

      Joe didn’t mean to be hurtful but his journal was only “private” because he wanted to give it an air of exclusivity. If you are a boy and talk with him for 10 seconds he will give you the password whether you want it or not.
      Also the fact that he offered to raise Roz’s score if she ended class early suggest on some level he was hoping he could use it to get women to audition for his sexual fantasies.

    5. BBCC

      It wasn’t a private list. It had an RSS feed and subscribers. It had a password, but he gave it out to anyone who asked (and several who didn’t).

      I agree this specific strip, he’s pretty harmless though.

      1. wiki

        don’t get me wrong, its weird stupid idea and irl would not like that guy. However, in the context of the comic where we have students playing Batman and Sherlock while also having a high stake kidnapping/murder case there is a certain bit of leeway due to the over topness of the universe and characters in general.

        So when compared to ‘I’ve decided Batman is a good role model, but only in the how to deal with trauma’, ‘I am going to have every type of identity crisis with in two months’ and ‘I am the stupidest you thought a politician could be till 2016’ the dude who’s quirk is to keep a list of local girls to help his goal of trying to sleep with everyone with the same dedication of a weeboo on the jojo wikia is just kinda funny.

  56. Alaric

    I love the fact that Joyce and Joe are friends. It’s so apparently unlikely, for both of them, and yet, so believable.

  57. Ruru42

    I ship it

  58. DarkoNeko

    oh yes, he should.

  59. Icalasari

    Actually Joyce, Joe should. Becky is a troll by nature, if she sees Joe no longer teasing you, she is going to start poking and prodding to figure out what’s going on

    You actually want him to keep up appearances

    1. Alaric

      OR she could just tell Becky the truth…

      1. Needfuldoer

        I think there’s a very complicated hangup stopping her from doing that. Part imposter syndrome, part not wanting to break their friendship.

        https://www.dumbingofage.com/2019/comic/book-10/01-birthday-pursuit/beeessin/

        They’ve gone through a lot together, and Becky still has her faith even though she objectively got the worst of it. So what’s Joyce’s “problem”? Is their shared upbringing the only thing they actually have in common?

        1. Alaric

          Oh, I agree. It’s just, if you start thinking rationally, like “Joyce should want Joe to keep teasing her to keep Becky from figuring out what’s going on”, the rational next thought would be “Or just tell her.” Nothing about this situation has to do with rational thought, though, so I doubt Joyce is going to suddenly want Joe to keep teasing her.

      2. Icalasari

        Yeah, but from Joyce’s perspective and reasoning, it makes sense for her to actually be FOR Joe doing this

  60. Josh Spicer

    Bad idea but he sort of has the spirit.

  61. 0kami

    New business card for Joe!

    “Eggshell, with Romalia type. Whadda ya think?”

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