Their friendship is delightful and Sal in general makes me want to make very unmanly noises whenever she is unintentionally cute/charming, which is basically always.
Marcie can be amazingly expressive with those goggle thingies. Helps that she can apparently move the little specular reflections independently like pupils.
Alternate hypothesis: she’s just wearing regular black-rimmed glasses and has Terminator eyes.
Dumbing of Age works on a sliding timescale. And in the future; people can relocate the sun and the rims of their glasses with massive telekinetic force for the purpose of conveying simple facial expressions. Willis is trying to incorporate some anachronistic references that are a bit “ahead of the curve” so that DoA still seems realistic to our psychic bespectacled babies, assuring the work endures for generations.
Actually it’s the force of her eyebrows trying to leave her face (like everyone else’s do) that distorts the goggles and makes the specular reflections move.
I’m not super sure why there’s hesitation with this. Malaya has shown that it takes almost zero actual effort to set her off. It doesn’t even have to be convincing. There’s history about this subject between these two and I’m pretty sure 1) It’s gonna be really really sad, and 2) BBCC’s gonna spontaneously initiate fusion.
Look, just because me and my boyfriend once made these two Ruby and Sapphire when we were joking around and making DoA as Steven Universe characters doesn’t mean I have that on my fanfic list.
Yet anyways, shut up, don’t look at me.
MatthewTheLucky
I think they meant nuclear fusion via soundwave pressure.
BBCC
Ah, I see. I know absolute jack about physics, so I made the SU joke.
Mostly there’s hesitation because it’s kind of creepy manipulation and as Sal suggests just asking her is by far the better approach.
Someone only having sex with you to prove something to your friend can’t make you feel good about yourself. Unless you’re already the kind of sleazeball who doesn’t care how you get it, in which case you shouldn’t.
ruhrow
Meh, I don’t think it’s creepy, and I don’t think Marcie is a sleazeball for it. If anything, it more makes Malaya the sleazy one.
Hey, if someone is THAT subceptible to the whole “middle school level of reverse psychology” thing, it’s prettymuch your DUTY to exploit them!
Particularly if they are … ‘less than pleasant to be around’!
Rape? Not even a little bit, Malaya is still making a choice even if the situation isn’t entirely what she thought. She can still say no to anyone at any time. And her own screwed up sense of what she should do is leading to her being misled, so I think that is her responsibility. Though it doesn’t make the deception right to do.
No, I mean, it IS kinda deceptive, sure, but Malaya knows who Marcie is, she’s not misrepresenting herself, and this definitely wouldn’t be coercive, so I don’t think that’d be an appropriate way of framing it, but that’s just my personal take, I’m sure plenty of people would have their own interpretation.
… I don’t want to stereotype but as a married parent of young children – that’s about the level of subtle that tends to be in play when you have small dependants who leave you with limited opportunity…
Jaime
@Miri: I do not and cannot have children, but my sister has a five-year-old daughter. And while I NEVER want to talk to my sister about her sex life, she has kind of hinted that sometimes she and her husband have to carefully schedule…um…”personal time.”
For that matter, my partner and I often have completely opposite schedules; he will start work at 10 AM and get home around 7 or 8 PM, and I won’t get home from teaching until midnight or later. (I teach evenings and even after the class is over, I STILL have a ton of work to do.). SO sometimes we do, um, have to schedule “sexy times.” Not to give too much personal info, but sometimes one of us does kind of have to “seduce” the other, but that does not mean we are deceiving each other.
I am not at all sure that “seduction always relies on deception.” And yes, sometimes people do come out and say “Let’s fuck.”
BUT these are college kids. (Anyone who is currently a young adult in college, please forgive me for saying that – I’m old.) I remember the awkwardness I often experienced as a college student. As an example, after a drinking party, my current partner and I (we’ve been together for over a decade now) both fell asleep on the same futon. While I wanted to roll over and snuggle him, I was far too awkward and embarrassed to do so. Once we actually hooked up, he admitted that he felt the exact same way. (SO…this meant that we both wanted to snuggle each other and didn’t because EMBARRASSMENT!) And when we finally hooked up, it did kind of come down to us saying to each other, “Do you want to have sex now please?”
BUT we were both older than a lot of college students and both had had other relationships. I follow this webcomic regularly and realize that my present experience as someone who not been a college student for years (and who currently teaches at a college) is not the same as the characters’. But I also do have to say that active consent is SUPER important, no matter what your age or level of sexual experience.
I would edit to say that INITIAL seduction USUALLY involves some degree of deception. Even if it’s just putting on nicer clothes or makeup than usual, giving flattering compliments, maybe playing up shared interests or accomplishments, perhaps practicing ahead of time to come off less awkward and more charming… It’s kind of expected on both sides that you’re at least trying to present yourself in the best possible light, which is rarely going to be the Whole Truth.
As for this, at the worst interpretation, it is more along the lines of pick-up artistry (pick-up artisting? pick-up art? The act that a pick-up artist performs), which can certainly get skeevy rapidly, but I think as a one-off hijink… Well, we’ll see how things go, but at the very least they’re well, well short of the line of rape.
I absolutely have done this, and it’s worked out very well a very large number of times. “Hey, nice shoes, wanna fuck?” works very well in clubs. “Hey, we should bang,” is also how my girlfriend (of almost 3 years!) and I met.
I don’t think anyone would argue that Sal is being nice to Malaya here. But this doesn’t read as coercion or rape to me.
If there’s anything particularly immoral about it, it’s that it gets close to gaslighting. And in that sense? Yeah, this is wrong. Less in the sense that it steps over a line, and more in the sense that ethical lines aren’t meant to be toed except in extreme circumstances, which this is not.
Honestly, I only forgive Sal for this because it’s a story in a comic strip, and she’s a more sympathetic character by far than Malaya.
It’s not coercion or rape. It’s deceitful, but Malaya is still completely free to choose who she sexually pursues. All Malaya has to do is be mature and not pursue Marcie just because Sal shows some interest and the whole plan fails. The whole plan hinges on Malaya going out of her way to be spiteful to Sal.
I agree it’s not really rape, but it’s not very cool either. If nothing else, if Marcie is interested in anything beyond the one time physical sex, only getting that because Malaya wants to mess with Sal seems like it wouldn’t be very rewarding.
It is not. It is deceptive and not particularly eithical but it isn’t rape (both parties would be consenting) and it is not rape by coercion (as Malaya would still have the ability to choose not to and is not being swayed by force or threats).
It’s more on par with lying to someone you just met to seem cooler and make them more interested in you – it’s not the right or best approach. It is something you can do to get the results you want, but they will feel horribly betrayed if they learn the truth. Though since this is Malaya, she would likely not believe Sal if she said it was a lie at a later time.
To be fair, if this works, malaya is just as bad. The whole thing is based on her being willing to use (and potentially hurt) a friend to get back at sal. That’s a story without any heroes. It’s a high school drama though, so that’s probably pretty realistic.
Sam
Oh, Malaya is bad regardless. If she was a better person who wasn’t so spiteful and easy to provoke in her desire to make sure Sal is unhappy, this plan would NEVER have a chance in the first place. Whether Malaya is willing to risk hurting a friend to spite Sal though is the real question.
Rape by deception does exist, but it typically refers to situations where the assailant impersonated someone else entirely (such as coming into a darkened room when the victim was waiting for her/his romantic partner). This is just immature shenanigans.
I can’t tell what the last panel is supposed to be implying, does this mean they are going with the plan of just asking Malaya if she likes Marcie? Or the plan of Sal pretending to be into Marcie?
I think that’s not quite “pleased as punch”, but more of an overly forced smile. She knows she should take the “ask her” approach, but she’s going with the other one.
159 thoughts on “Like-like”
Ana Chronistic
Tell someone how you REALLY feel? What madness is this??
←courted husband by spontaneously using him as a bed
PB
Aww. ❤️
Clif
All the hearts.
BBCC
I love these two.
Kyrik Michalowski
Their friendship is delightful and Sal in general makes me want to make very unmanly noises whenever she is unintentionally cute/charming, which is basically always.
Doctor_Who
Marcie can be amazingly expressive with those goggle thingies. Helps that she can apparently move the little specular reflections independently like pupils.
Alternate hypothesis: she’s just wearing regular black-rimmed glasses and has Terminator eyes.
Schpoonman
It’s the Parker-Wilson Eyewear Effect. Under correct conditions, realistically static eyewear will mimic facial expressions for effect.
BarerMender
I never noticed that before.
BarerMender
Now I have to go back and look at all the Marcie toons.
Diner Kinetic
Dumbing of Age works on a sliding timescale. And in the future; people can relocate the sun and the rims of their glasses with massive telekinetic force for the purpose of conveying simple facial expressions. Willis is trying to incorporate some anachronistic references that are a bit “ahead of the curve” so that DoA still seems realistic to our psychic bespectacled babies, assuring the work endures for generations.
Needfuldoer
Maybe we can do that already, but since there’s no coordination we’re pulling the sun in many different directions and it all cancels out.
thejeff
Actually it’s the force of her eyebrows trying to leave her face (like everyone else’s do) that distorts the goggles and makes the specular reflections move.
ktbear
Correct me if I’m wrong but aren’t Ana Chronistic’s references always ahead of the curve?
Chris Phoenix
Hey, there’s Biblical precedent for people being able to move the sun. And this is a comic about religion, so…
(Sorry, too soon?)
AntJ
Her glasses remind me of Boneclaw Mother’s mask from Digger
Schpoonman
I’m very familiar with where Sal is in panel 5.
Schpoonman
I’m not super sure why there’s hesitation with this. Malaya has shown that it takes almost zero actual effort to set her off. It doesn’t even have to be convincing. There’s history about this subject between these two and I’m pretty sure 1) It’s gonna be really really sad, and 2) BBCC’s gonna spontaneously initiate fusion.
BBCC
Look, just because me and my boyfriend once made these two Ruby and Sapphire when we were joking around and making DoA as Steven Universe characters doesn’t mean I have that on my fanfic list.
Yet anyways, shut up, don’t look at me.
MatthewTheLucky
I think they meant nuclear fusion via soundwave pressure.
BBCC
Ah, I see. I know absolute jack about physics, so I made the SU joke.
StClair
Best part, it works both ways.
thejeff
Mostly there’s hesitation because it’s kind of creepy manipulation and as Sal suggests just asking her is by far the better approach.
Someone only having sex with you to prove something to your friend can’t make you feel good about yourself. Unless you’re already the kind of sleazeball who doesn’t care how you get it, in which case you shouldn’t.
ruhrow
Meh, I don’t think it’s creepy, and I don’t think Marcie is a sleazeball for it. If anything, it more makes Malaya the sleazy one.
Batz
Hey, if someone is THAT subceptible to the whole “middle school level of reverse psychology” thing, it’s prettymuch your DUTY to exploit them!
Particularly if they are … ‘less than pleasant to be around’!
Mr. Mendo
Who could say no to that smile?
Doctor_Who
Malaya, probably, hence the hijink.
Shen Hibiki
She’s had no chance to say “no” since she has no idea! XD
Kamino Neko
I’m torn.
On the one hand, I feel Marcie, here. Avoidance is always the best!
On the other…this kind of stupid hijinx never go well.
Khantalas
I feel like that’s just par for the course when you interact with Malaya.
Marsh Maryrose
Oh, come on. When have wacky hijinx ever gone wrong in a comic?
StClair
… right, okay, what about in this comic?
… right, okay, how about…
Reltzik
Willis must have forgotten the layer that includes a translation of Marcie’s sign-language. I can’t tell what her response to all this is.
….
(sarcasm, of course)
Marsh Maryrose
The Willisian mouth crinkles in panel 4 need no translation.
purblebirb
I love how her goggle shinies are now her pupils
Lala
They always have been.
Stu
…yeah, pretty sure a literal “sigh.” is the appropriate response here.
Tan
In my headcanon, Sal is also simultaneously signing the word sigh. We cannot see her hands in that panel, so you cannot tell me I am wrong.
Victor Riley
Eat outta shorts! Eat outta shorts!
Wait… that came out wrong…
TrueVCU
Realization: isn’t this kind of rape, or at least coercion by deception?
Nono
It wouldn’t work if Malaya wasn’t gullible.
Or more like this is basically half the get laid schemes on How I Met Your Mother.
Kyrik Michalowski
Rape? Not even a little bit, Malaya is still making a choice even if the situation isn’t entirely what she thought. She can still say no to anyone at any time. And her own screwed up sense of what she should do is leading to her being misled, so I think that is her responsibility. Though it doesn’t make the deception right to do.
Mra
I don’t know what to classify it as, but it definitely isn’t honest.
DailyBrad
No, I mean, it IS kinda deceptive, sure, but Malaya knows who Marcie is, she’s not misrepresenting herself, and this definitely wouldn’t be coercive, so I don’t think that’d be an appropriate way of framing it, but that’s just my personal take, I’m sure plenty of people would have their own interpretation.
BarerMender
Seduction always relies on deception. Even if both of you know what’s going on. You never come out and say, “Wanna fuck?”
Miri
… I don’t want to stereotype but as a married parent of young children – that’s about the level of subtle that tends to be in play when you have small dependants who leave you with limited opportunity…
Jaime
@Miri: I do not and cannot have children, but my sister has a five-year-old daughter. And while I NEVER want to talk to my sister about her sex life, she has kind of hinted that sometimes she and her husband have to carefully schedule…um…”personal time.”
For that matter, my partner and I often have completely opposite schedules; he will start work at 10 AM and get home around 7 or 8 PM, and I won’t get home from teaching until midnight or later. (I teach evenings and even after the class is over, I STILL have a ton of work to do.). SO sometimes we do, um, have to schedule “sexy times.” Not to give too much personal info, but sometimes one of us does kind of have to “seduce” the other, but that does not mean we are deceiving each other.
Jaime
I am not at all sure that “seduction always relies on deception.” And yes, sometimes people do come out and say “Let’s fuck.”
BUT these are college kids. (Anyone who is currently a young adult in college, please forgive me for saying that – I’m old.) I remember the awkwardness I often experienced as a college student. As an example, after a drinking party, my current partner and I (we’ve been together for over a decade now) both fell asleep on the same futon. While I wanted to roll over and snuggle him, I was far too awkward and embarrassed to do so. Once we actually hooked up, he admitted that he felt the exact same way. (SO…this meant that we both wanted to snuggle each other and didn’t because EMBARRASSMENT!) And when we finally hooked up, it did kind of come down to us saying to each other, “Do you want to have sex now please?”
BUT we were both older than a lot of college students and both had had other relationships. I follow this webcomic regularly and realize that my present experience as someone who not been a college student for years (and who currently teaches at a college) is not the same as the characters’. But I also do have to say that active consent is SUPER important, no matter what your age or level of sexual experience.
Marsh Maryrose
According to the late great Allan Sherman, “Dating is when you pretend to be someone else until the other person loves you for who you are.”
Colineo
Thought you meant the guy from “The Critic”
Tan
I would edit to say that INITIAL seduction USUALLY involves some degree of deception. Even if it’s just putting on nicer clothes or makeup than usual, giving flattering compliments, maybe playing up shared interests or accomplishments, perhaps practicing ahead of time to come off less awkward and more charming… It’s kind of expected on both sides that you’re at least trying to present yourself in the best possible light, which is rarely going to be the Whole Truth.
As for this, at the worst interpretation, it is more along the lines of pick-up artistry (pick-up artisting? pick-up art? The act that a pick-up artist performs), which can certainly get skeevy rapidly, but I think as a one-off hijink… Well, we’ll see how things go, but at the very least they’re well, well short of the line of rape.
Reltzik
Nope, never. No one ever just comes out and says that.
MaximumZero
I absolutely have done this, and it’s worked out very well a very large number of times. “Hey, nice shoes, wanna fuck?” works very well in clubs. “Hey, we should bang,” is also how my girlfriend (of almost 3 years!) and I met.
Jamie
I don’t think anyone would argue that Sal is being nice to Malaya here. But this doesn’t read as coercion or rape to me.
If there’s anything particularly immoral about it, it’s that it gets close to gaslighting. And in that sense? Yeah, this is wrong. Less in the sense that it steps over a line, and more in the sense that ethical lines aren’t meant to be toed except in extreme circumstances, which this is not.
Honestly, I only forgive Sal for this because it’s a story in a comic strip, and she’s a more sympathetic character by far than Malaya.
Jaime
I like your name! 🙂
Shane Wegner
Only if mind control exists, which it doesn’t.
Lex
It’s not coercion or rape. It’s deceitful, but Malaya is still completely free to choose who she sexually pursues. All Malaya has to do is be mature and not pursue Marcie just because Sal shows some interest and the whole plan fails. The whole plan hinges on Malaya going out of her way to be spiteful to Sal.
thejeff
I agree it’s not really rape, but it’s not very cool either. If nothing else, if Marcie is interested in anything beyond the one time physical sex, only getting that because Malaya wants to mess with Sal seems like it wouldn’t be very rewarding.
Sam
It is not. It is deceptive and not particularly eithical but it isn’t rape (both parties would be consenting) and it is not rape by coercion (as Malaya would still have the ability to choose not to and is not being swayed by force or threats).
It’s more on par with lying to someone you just met to seem cooler and make them more interested in you – it’s not the right or best approach. It is something you can do to get the results you want, but they will feel horribly betrayed if they learn the truth. Though since this is Malaya, she would likely not believe Sal if she said it was a lie at a later time.
Alanari
To be fair, if this works, malaya is just as bad. The whole thing is based on her being willing to use (and potentially hurt) a friend to get back at sal. That’s a story without any heroes. It’s a high school drama though, so that’s probably pretty realistic.
Sam
Oh, Malaya is bad regardless. If she was a better person who wasn’t so spiteful and easy to provoke in her desire to make sure Sal is unhappy, this plan would NEVER have a chance in the first place. Whether Malaya is willing to risk hurting a friend to spite Sal though is the real question.
Gwen
Rape by deception does exist, but it typically refers to situations where the assailant impersonated someone else entirely (such as coming into a darkened room when the victim was waiting for her/his romantic partner). This is just immature shenanigans.
Kyrik Michalowski
I can’t tell what the last panel is supposed to be implying, does this mean they are going with the plan of just asking Malaya if she likes Marcie? Or the plan of Sal pretending to be into Marcie?
My next question is, what can possibly go wrong?
Nono
Marcie is basically giving the ‘Heyyyy best buddy! D’ya wanna do me the biggest, bestest favour?’
DailyBrad
I take it as Marcie being down with the plan, so as to avoid the coming out and saying it. She looks pleased as punch.
thejeff
I think that’s not quite “pleased as punch”, but more of an overly forced smile. She knows she should take the “ask her” approach, but she’s going with the other one.
abysswatcher1993
For once Sal is is the voice of reason, and Marcie continues to be the voice of lust.
Shen Hibiki
The sign-language of lust. All hands-on.
Marsh Maryrose
Laurie Anderson, Langue D’Amour:
Because the woman was restless. She was a hothead.
She was a woman in love.
BarerMender
Heck, Sal, all you have to do is let Malaya see you looking at Marcie and biting your fist.
ValdVin
And, since this is Willis, also Sal biting her lip. (Okay, it’s not easy to do both at once, but still…)
Xccj