Rich Mullins
Posted on March 2, 2019 by David M Willis

240 thoughts on “Rich Mullins”

  1. toby

    Something tells me Joyce is going to be mullin this dream over for a while.

    1. nicostrat

      what if… it’s NOT a dream? D:

      1. toby

        then there’s a necromancer running around who’s real into the hammered dulcimer

        1. AbacusWizard

          “a necromancer… who’s real into the hammered dulcimer”

          it me!!!

      2. Sean Dillon

        So it’s overkill?

    2. Ana Chronistic

      that’s rich

      1. toby

        the narrative’s really hammering this lesson in, but im sure she’ll get it eventually

      2. DarkoNeko

        we’re gonna be mullin’ about this.

    3. DarkoNeko

      oh, yeah. A dream. Of course. I totally knew *whistles embarassedly*

  2. Ana Chronistic

    the afterlife has shitty jobs too, huh

    1. toby

      “ugh, gotta provide the BGM for ANOTHER repressed fundie kid’s nightmares. maybe i oughta branch out”

    2. C.

      You got beat by toby!

      1. Ana Chronistic

        http://www.dumbingofage.com/2015/comic/book-5/02-threes-a-crowd/dontcare/

  3. AnvilPro

    This is not a dream. This is how the comic is from now on.

    1. Spriteless Girl

      We will hit peak shortpacked in a month.

      1. Unusually Angry Hippie

        Some shall rejoice, some shall weep, and all shall damn Willis.

  4. ValdVin

    Have we seen Joyce so worried about herself as in panel four?

    1. Bladeglory

      When your Dream Best Atheist Friend delivers a casual jab straight to the Soul-ar Plexus, you should be worried. It might knock the Breath of God right out of you.

  5. Cattleprod

    “Siri, who is Rich Mullins?”

    1. Lokitsu

      It’s when you have 5 even-numbered cards of the same suit. It is a winning hand in absolutely no card game ever invented.

      1. Illithid

        That’d be a flush in poker. Beaten only by full house, four of a kind, and straight flush.

        1. Tan

          Or a higher flush. The high card of such a flush would be 10, so any flush which includes a face card would also beat it.

        2. Jojo42

          Correct. You beat me to it by just a few minutes… 🙂

        3. Dandi_Andi

          It’s also worth five points in cribbage. But since it necessarily precludes and pairs, runs or 15’s, it probably isn’t ever going to be your best available hand.

        4. Deanatay

          A-3-5-7-9, OTOH, is worth nine points (assuming, again, they’re all of the same suit).

          I <3 Cribbage!

        5. Tan

          It is also the top hand in Dragon Poker if played on an even minute of an even hour on an even day of an even month of an even year by the 2nd player sitting counterclockwise of the dealer, as long as their chair is facing north. This caused quite a commotion in the 2016 Championship finals when a Canadian player turned his chair around and sat in it backwards to play this hand, but it was found on review that he maintained his palm on the table felt through the entire motion.

        6. SomeOldGuy

          I know what you’ve been reading!! Heh, heh. I would fail where as Skeeve won!

        7. CJ

          ?
          I should learn to use Skeeve’s strategy.
          (Is dragon poker championship a thing in real life?)

        8. Marsh Maryrose

          I gather that the rules of Dragon Poker bear a striking resemblance to the rules of Calvinball.

        9. All-Purpose Guru

          Reference? Please?

        10. ScoutInTheNight

          Apsrin’s Myth Adventures books.

        11. Lokitsu

          I deny all your arguments, except for Dragonpoker.
          😛

      2. Makkabee

        What about Fizzbim?

    2. Charlie Spencer

      Let me know what she says, please; I’ve never heard of the guy.

      1. Cody

        He’s the guy who wrote that Christian song that goes “our god is an awesome god.”

        1. Charlie Spencer

          And never heard of it either. The comments make it sound like I’m not missing much. Thanks.

  6. newllend(henryvolt)

    Who’s up for another Bizzare Joyce dream sequence.

    1. King Daniel

      It can’t be as bizarre as last time, at least.

      (hope I’m not tempting fate)

      1. Reltzik

        Tempt it! TEMPT IT AND BE REWARDED WITH AWESOMENESS!

      2. Piotr W

        When was the previous dream sequence? I don’t recall it…

        1. Belleif

          That’s for the best.

        2. Piotr W

          No, seriously, I’m curious. Please help!

        3. Daibhid C

          Okay, but just remember, you asked for this:

          http://www.dumbingofage.com/2012/comic/book-2/06-strange-beerfellows/itsme/

        4. Ymfon

          I’ve never figured out how to search the archives for something specific, but it was when her parents came to visit. She was introducing Ethan to them when he tore all his clothes off (screaming “SEXO LOCO!!”), fell with her through the floor into a sex cellar and turned into Ryan the Rapist.

        5. Ymfon

          Whoops, I got it mixed up with Danny’s repressed sex dream about Ethan. Joyce’s was in the Strange Beerfellows storyline; AntJ has a link below.

        6. BBCC

          I usually check the character tags. Sometimes if there’s two characters who don’t interact much, I’ll tag both of them (ex. tag/sal+dina/)

    2. Architex

      There are suddenly windows just to the left, like they’re the main characters or something.

    3. Formedras

      I would like for this not to be a dream sequence and basically show us that Walkyverse-type stuff can exist in Dumbingverse.

  7. pjeseb

    “I feel God when I pray!”

    Rich Mullins intensifies.

  8. Grant Barnes

    As a religious person, 10/10, grade A nightmare fuel, thanks Willis for this specific eldtritch horror

  9. tim gueguen

    Dream sequence! Not to be confused with Dream Sequence, the 1985 Tangerine Dream compilation album.

  10. jeffepp

    I had to look him up. Turns out, I despise his music!

    1. Keulen

      Contemporary Christian music. Ugh, no thanks.

    2. ValdVin

      Mullins is also nodded to in the arc where Joyce, Jacob, and Becky went to church.

      http://www.dumbingofage.com/2017/comic/book-8/01-face-the-strange/crucifix/

      1. Questionor

        well that answers my question if Mullins is dead in DoA time

  11. Kern Wallace

    Well okay then.

  12. kitty

    doa rich mullins is a little cute and i do not like it

  13. Mr D phone posting

    ….
    What the fuuuuuuu

  14. CommunistCanada

    What About Bob is not a reference I was expecting. I am overjoyed to see it though.

    1. HeySo

      If you google it, there really *is* an uncanny resemblance.

      https://cdn-images-1.medium.com/max/1600/1*JlbLfiXT3Z4828D8fJ29KA.png
      https://m.media-amazon.com/images/M/MV5BNjYwYzRkZTYtMGU4Mi00NGVhLWEzOTgtMmE4ZmI4MzYxMjBkL2ltYWdlL2ltYWdlXkEyXkFqcGdeQXVyMzMyODMwMTI@._V1_.jpg

      1. HeySo

        Oh, guess I didn’t need to do all those replies. I just assumed moderation was never approving anything anymore, given how my previous posts went.

    2. HeySo

      If you google it, there really *is* an uncanny resemblance.

      Specifically between these two images:

      cdn-images-1.medium.com/max/1600/1*JlbLfiXT3Z4828D8fJ29KA.png

      m.media-amazon.com/images/M/MV5BNjYwYzRkZTYtMGU4Mi00NGVh

      1. HeySo

        Sorry, the second one cut off:

        m.media-amazon.com/images/M/MV5BNjYwYzRkZTYtMGU4Mi00NGVhLWEzOTgtMmE4ZmI4MzYxMjBkL2ltYWdlL2ltYWdlXkEyXkFqcGdeQXVyMzMyODMwMTI@._V1_.jpg

        Assuming you’re not using Chrome+Google Search, which’ll try to auto-parse the links, you can just stick them into search and the correct image should pop up as the first result, for those suspicious of random image links.

        1. HeySo

          ..this forum just does not want that second link to work.
          Let’s try image-store.slidesharecdn.com/dcd90329-85c9-4fd2-bf52-b21367af76e6-original.jpeg as a replacement URL.

  15. Sporky

    I like how on-brand Dream Walky is.

    1. MatthewTheLucky

      Joyce’s subconscious knows him better than he knows himself.

      1. ShinyNeen

        I kinda hope that the way the “camera” keeps avoiding a straight-on shot of Walky’s face is deliberate and that it just keeps happening through this whole sequence. Seems like a way Joyce’s brain might treat Walky.

    2. DailyBrad

      I love it, since A. it’s perfect and hilarious, and B. I find Joyce and Walky’s friendship, belligerent as it sometimes is, kind of adorable.

    3. Questionor

      Is it on brand for Walky to know who Mullins is?

      1. Reltzik

        Yes. He knows a wide breadth of media personalities and cultural touchstones so he can make fun of them. (And of course Dexter and Monkey Master did a lot of cultural references in their jokes, so he could have picked up something there.)

        1. DailyBrad

          plus he’d done some acting in a religious children’s show, despite barely remembering it, so I could see him picking some stuff up.

      2. RacingTurtle

        Is it on-brand for Joyce to know what Bill Murray looked like circa “What About Bob?” It is her dream, after all.

        Maybe Hank really likes Bill Murray movies or something.

    4. Deanatay

      Joyce knows Walky better than she wishes she did.

  16. Lily

    I was so confused, thank the comments for telling me it’s a dream lol. I drink that stupid juice every day

    1. Sporky

      Same tbh.

    2. Questionor

      you’re not alone.

    3. Koms

      I’m right there with you. And add to it not knowing who either of those people is.

      1. Fiddler115

        Are you saying you don’t know who Bill Murray is?

        1. Delicious Taffy

          He’s the rich guy from Zombieland, duh.

        2. Koms

          I know Bill Murray. I don’t know Bob

  17. ShinyNeen

    Sweet, exactly how I want a storyline to begin!

    Although c’mon, Joyce’s subconscious, you put Dorothy in a sweater vest but you didn’t put yourself in that matching one? Geez. Missed opportunity!

    1. BBCC

      http://www.dumbingofage.com/2012/comic/book-2/02-choosing-my-religion/sierra/

      ^ She has a matching sweater vest too. We could’ve had it alllllllllllllllll

      1. ShinyNeen

        That’s what I was talking about! Can’t believe Joyce’s subconscious dropped the ball like this!

        At least her subconcious seems to feel the same about Dorothy’s longer, floof-y hair as I do.

        1. BBCC

          See, it just worries me because it means she’s still frazzled, I’m pretty sure. She’s just managed to kick the can down the road.

        2. ShinyNeen

          Honestly I dunno how aware Joyce is of Dorothy’s current level of stress, consciously or otherwise. I don’t know if Dorothy ever made it clear to Joyce why she and Walky broke up, for one thing.

          Though I also could just be projecting from the head-canon I built up when I was trying to write that one fic, so very much *shrug*

        3. BBCC

          Fair enough! Who am I to trample on head canon? 😀

        4. Bagge

          Joyce’s subconscious doesn’t dare to make it’s attraction to Dorothy THAT overt.

          Otherwise I’m surprised they are in class and not in their pretend marriage.

        5. ShinyNeen

          Nah, you’re right- if we saw the pretend marriage in Joyce’s dreams she’d probably be trying to walk it back from a marriage to something less attracted-to-Dorothy sounding.

          Good thing we don’t have to experience that in any form. Isn’t that right, Bagge?

      2. Kay

        Either that or Joyce’s subconscious allowed her to dress Dorothy, and that one *is* Joyce’s sweater vest. So even with dream-logic they can’t be twinning. But it does suggest a previous, unseen scene in which Joyce had to resist the urge to peek through her fingers while Dorothy changed in her room, and Becky woke up in a cold sweat whispering “the prophecy is true; she *is* bisexual”.

        1. BBCC

          Joyce DOES have the same sweater vest in orange, but the green one is Dorothy’s from the time she went to church with Joyce (she took it off so they wouldn’t match).

  18. Sam

    This seems like a dream since Dorothy went from being like ‘Rich Mullins?’ to ‘oh, he’s probably here because you don’t feel God enough and that upsets him’ as if he regularly shows up to accost people for not feeling God when they pray and everyone clearly knows this except Joyce. It’s a dream Joyce, you know Dorothy would never blame you for how much you do or do not feel God. Don’t let dream Dorothy deceive you.

  19. Deadjolras

    I have absolutely no context for who this man is so I don’t know how to read this strip.

    1. Deadjolras

      Oh, I guess this is a dream sequence? Thank you, commenters! No wonder Joyce and Dorothy are wearing matching outfits.

      1. Sporky

        … They aren’t wearing matching outfits though???

        1. Deadjolras

          I meant something more along the lines of “Joyce usually wears sweater vests and her subconscious is dressing Dorothy in sweater vests, too” but apparently my brain decided that was too long of an explanation so it just decided to write “matching outfits” instead. And this is an even longer explanation so thanks for that, brain!

    2. BBCC

      A contemporary Christian singer. He wrote songs like ‘Awesome God’ which was a largely popular song in Willis’ (and likely Joyce’s) childhood church.

      1. Nep

        Oh. Now I know who to blame for that song. Thank you.

        1. Smiling Cat

          According to the googling I just did now. Rich Mullins didn’t much like the song either.

        2. Arian

          Oh, good 🙂

          The thing that annoyed me most about its popularity is that it had its chorus hijacked as a stand-alone thing that then got sung into the ground, when it was written to bebe verse-and-chorus.

          Granted they included theology I disagree with, but musically they were okay.

          Oh, and also, if you listen to the verses, it’s obvious that ‘awesome’ in the chorus means ‘awe-inspiring’, as opposed to the meaningless positive noise that I suspect a lot of the singers of the chorus alone took it for.

          Way to make a not-terrible song terrible.

        3. Nep

          The problem is that since I’ve made this comment, I’ve had it stuck in my head three separate times. It’s not just a big part of my childhood that I’ve walked away from, and part of an ideaology that I disagree with, but it’s the worst ear worm ever.

      2. Delicious Taffy

        I only know that song from a sweet dance mix I heard in an old Vinesauce stream. I think it was one of Joel’s Windows Destruction streams.

      3. Felgraf

        HE’S THE ONE WHO WROTE THAT FUCKING SONG?
        … I already hate him. (Even thuogh the church I grew up in is one that I’m actually still pretty proud of, even if my own beliefs have wandered. Yay UCC of chapel hill).

  20. BBCC

    Oooh, fun! Joyce’s dreams are always interesting.

    The Rich Mullins is a nice touch, as is Walky not knowing who he is.

    I like Dorothy’s sweater vest. Nice touch, Joyce’s subconscious!

    1. AntJ

      Rich Mullins Knows.

      Thanks for pointing out the sweater vest!

      1. BBCC

        It’s the same one Dorothy nearly wore to church before she changed so she and Joyce wouldn’t be matching (as Joyce has the same one in orange).

        1. ShinyNeen

          It was the greatest a disappointment Joyce has ever experienced

    2. Bagge

      Joyce’s subconscious playing dress-up with Dorothy? That is just cute!

      Come to think of it, she has never been subject to “Joyce dress everyone day”, has she?

  21. BarerMender

    And Wikipedia says, Rich Mullins was thrown out of a car on I-39 north of Bloomington and was killed by a truck. Now we know where Willis gets his ideas.

    1. AntJ

      I-39 goes through Bloomington, IL. Bloomington, IN has I-69.

      1. Sporky

        haha thats the number that people say “haha thats the number” about

      2. Marsh Maryrose

        But still, it was 1997 and he wasn’t wearing a seat belt. There’s trusting in God and then there’s “hey, watch this!”

        1. Josh Spicer

          To be honest, my dad never wore a seatbelt until it became a state law in 2005 or so.

      3. BarerMender

        And yet, the parallels are there.

    2. Bicycle Bill

      I read “thrown out of a car on I-39” and, until I looked at the Wikipedia article, I had this mental image of someone “taking him for a ride” and pushing him out of the car into traffic.

  22. Yossarianduck

    Add Rich Mullins to the favourite DoA character poll, Willis

  23. fire_daws

    I’m expecting Julia Gray and Blake to be making out in one of the corners of the room.

    1. Deanatay

      Actually, it’s Julia Gray and Balky.

      *Joyce screams*

  24. Woomy

    I like the new direction this comic is taking

  25. AntJ

    WOW.

    Here we go. Who wants to bet on how soon Joyce will have an orgasm? Probably by the end of this storyline, or at least Book 9?

    1. Kyrik Michalowski

      Is that something Willis would actually show in comic? Obviously not the nsfw parts but I wonder if that is even something he will touch.

      1. AntJ

        I’m practically betting on it. 3 storylines ago Joyce was avoiding Jacob because Walky made her think about fucking him, then Dorothy told her to buy lube. Next she was asking Ruth about vibrators. Then she discovered slashfiction. This is snowballing at a rapid rate, with onlookers telling Joyce she’s totally repressed and needs to stop feeling guilt over her body, so I think it’s only a matter of time and that’s the logical place to go. Obviously we won’t see anything NSFW but we might have a facial close-up with a swirly red background, like when Joyce discovered Dorothy was atheist.

      2. Geneseepaws

        I cannot imagine Willis molesting one of his own characters. That’s what Mike is for.

  26. AndrewO

    “Jesus said whatever you do to the least of these my brothers you’ve done it to me. And this is what I’ve come to think. That if I want to identify fully with Jesus Christ, who I claim to be my Savior and Lord, the best way that I can do that is to identify with the poor. This I know will go against the teachings of all the popular evangelical preachers. But they’re just wrong. They’re not bad, they’re just wrong. Christianity is not about building an absolutely secure little niche in the world where you can live with your perfect little wife and your perfect little children in a beautiful little house where you have no gays or minority groups anywhere near you. Christianity is about learning to love like Jesus loved and Jesus loved the poor and Jesus loved the broken-hearted.”
    -Rich Mullins

    1. Schpoonman

      I haaate most things Christian, but Rich Mullins is not one of them. It helped that his songs are actually decent music.

      1. Arian

        My perspective as well. It’s a shame that many of the posters’ sole association with him is “the guy wrote that one song we can’t stand”.

        1. Arian

          *who wrote

  27. Kyrik Michalowski

    I find it fascinating that Dorothy is the one saying that to Joyce in her dream, I mean I know dreams don’t have to make sense but c’mon Joyce’s brain. At least have some coherency here, it should have been Sarah.

    1. Sporky

      Actually, it makes sense because this is definitely the beginning of a nightmare. Sarah telling her something negative is just par for the course, but Dorothy doing it is upsetting because she loves and trusts Dorothy so much.

      So her brain does make sense, it’s just evil.

      1. Kyrik Michalowski

        You make a strong argument there, still I can always hope for Sarah to be included in this dream sequence somewhere.

      2. AntJ

        In the dream involving Ethan and Ryan, Dorothy was looking on and sneering. Her parents looked shocked, Becky looked horrified, but Dorothy seemed to be egging Joyce on: http://www.dumbingofage.com/2012/comic/book-2/06-strange-beerfellows/thing/

        Carol and Hank (and even Mary) were afraid Dorothy would lead Joyce astray. Joyce really likes Dorothy and didn’t want to lose that friendship, and of course Dorothy is respecting her personal choices, but Joyce’s subconscious has this deep-seated fear that she must choose between Dorothy (and her other new friends) and God, so Dorothy is portrayed in this part of her brain similarly to how Satan is portrayed in the book of Job. She’s being tested by forces that want to pry her from her faith, forces that think she will only be steadfast when things are easy. Now things are gray instead of black and white, Becky is gay, being gay is okay, being an atheist is okay, Ross is a monster, maybe her mom is a monster too, the people she was taught to fear are nice, and the people she was taught were nice are now feared. Dorothy was the first crack to Joyce’s faith, the first nonreligious person she had probably ever met. She wants what Dorothy has badly, but is afraid of wanting it. So Dorothy makes perfect sense as the avatar to call out her lapse in faith.

        1. Sporky

          Wow, that’s way more insightful than I was.

        2. Bagge

          A+ analyzing!

          Also, Dorothy has been very perceptive for some character trait Joyce is less than proud of, such as her taking pride in herself for standing up to her parents, or her trying to pry Jacob away from Raidah. She fits the role when her brain wants someone to air an ever more hidden, dark secret.

        3. AntJ

          Dorothy doesn’t lie to Joyce, even when it can be painful. So we know Joyce truly is having a crisis of faith.

          Although Joyce has been shown to have deep moments with whoever is handy. Amazi-Girl, Ethan, Roz, and even Joe have filled that role.

          Dorothy has been shown to have exceptional emotional intelligence, and with all of Joyce’s repression, Dorothy often can tell how Joyce feels before Joyce realizes it herself. So she needs someone else whom she trusts to start that internal conversation.

  28. Bicycle Bill

    24 hours from now, Google engineers are scratching their heads over the sudden surge in searches for “Rich Mullins”.

    1. Bagge

      Google nothing. I’m youtubing him! First hit was “Awesome God”

      1. Bagge

        The title seems to come from the song Sometimes By Step, which as far as I can tell is about how the singer and God will always be buddies. I can imagine that to be a source of stress for Joyce if she is no longer certain that applies to her.

  29. StClair

    What about Bob?

  30. Foxhack

    Bill Murray circa What About Bob had less hair, didn’t he?

  31. Tacos

    I’ll be honest, if it weren’t for this comment section, I wouldn’t know who the hell Rich Mullins is.

    1. Delicious Taffy

      The double-edged sword of comment sections.

    2. Keulen

      I had to google him, I don’t listen to contemporary Christian music so I hadn’t heard of him before now.

  32. Delicious Taffy

    This Mullins guy looks like he eats sand and brags about it.

    1. toby

      this comment made me bark out a laugh at 1am last night, thank u

  33. Jess

    Between today’s strip and the comments section I feel like I’m the one in a weird dream. What is going on?? I hope to find out…soon???

  34. DailyBrad

    “Also, he is probably here to remind you to wear a seatbelt.”

    1. Reltzik

      “Joyce, I didn’t wear a seat belt and I died and now I’m in Heaven with God, so definitely wear your seat belt.”

      …… not exactly the most persuasive PSA ever.

  35. robertskitch

    I thought that I’d missed a page…

  36. EvilMidnightLurker

    Willis, just so you know, a commercial on it’s walky is apparently so bad that my phone absolutely refuses to let me go there.

  37. Architex

    “Also you said ‘what about Bob?’ Cpt. Holy made a pop culture reference!”

  38. Bagge

    “Now, Dorothy, rub your thing on my tummy…”

    1. Delicious Taffy

      Joyce would evaporate on the spot if she saw Dorothy’s thing. It’s too much for her mind to handle, at this stage in her life.

  39. Meagan

    I’m gonna post this here cuz I’m guessing it’s one of the quickest ways to get an answer…I just joined the Patreon and found out the old bonus strips are super blurry. The first one was transcribed, but not all are. Any tips for how to read them? Thanks

    1. BBCC

      That IS weird. They were working fine a while ago. Could be the files are out of date?

      They’re screwy for the old regular strips too.

      1. Meagan

        Yeah there is something about Patreon changing how images are viewed? Some of them have links to download, in which case it is possible to do that and view them correctly, but not all.

        1. BBCC

          Sounds like a Patreon update that screwed us over. Bah.

          The bonus strips are all in the book pdfs, so I’ll see if I can transcribe them on Patreon sometime tomorrow.

        2. BBCC

          Okay, so I just checked and it’s only up to the first bonus strip in May 2015. Everything after that should be readable. I’ll transcribe the ones up to that point and if you find others, I’ll fix it.

        3. BBCC

          Transcripts are done!

        4. Meagan

          Thank you! I noticed!!

  40. Reltzik

    So, yeah. It’s been obvious for a while that Joyce’s faith is on shaky ground. She’s emerged from the cult bubble and made friends with outsiders that her circle would disaprove of for what they are, not who they are. She’s seen some of the monsters that the religion can turn people into. She’s distanced from her fellow believers. All of that is how deconversion often begins.

    But this is big. This is the “personal relationship with God” that’s vanishing. That’s… if not the entire cornerstone of that brand of Christian’s religious experience, at least a significant chunk of it.

    1. Meagan

      I actually feel kinda sad about this, that for people who were taught to think about “god” in a certain way, that when the other beliefs the church taught are shown to be mistaken, the relationship with “god” often disappears too and people become atheists, rather than changing their conception of God.

      To me “God” is like the sacred mystery of the universe. The feeling I get on a beach with the waves rolling in… Awe.

      I’ve seen that when people are raised super fundie and then move away from it, they also can lose that awe and become really reductionist and cynical. Also start putting all religion into a binary of Christian/atheist instead of acknowledging the variety of religious and spiritual traditions around the world.

      1. Reltzik

        In the interests of a civil comment section I shall forgo my rant on this topic. Instead I will just say that many atheists, myself included, are perfectly capable of feeling a sense of awe and mystery and wonder without believing there’s some sort of god behind it. (Eat it, Oprah.)

      2. Sam

        Because to them, that was what their relationship to God was built on so without that, and with that being their core idea of what God is, they may find it easier to let go of religion than to try to construct a new image and that may be what is best for them as individuals at the time. Especially if they were never given the option to not believe before.

        As an atheist myself, I can also say that being an atheist doesn’t make you cynical and reductionist (I find cynics to be truly boring people). That is likely less to do with the loss of awe itself *alone* and more to do with being bitter about everything that led up to the loss to begin with. Because being told God is real and your beliefs are right, then being proven wrong to the point you question if God is real would hurt a lot and it may make you feel like you were betrayed by being forced into believing these things by your community and family to start with if you come to the conclusion that he is not real to you.

        Still isn’t very nice to be a cynical ass that tries to ruin it for everyone else but it is understandable why those who go from super religious to not religious may feel pretty mad and bitter and cope with it poorly because religion used to be their main coping mechanism for life’s events and that’s the thing they just lost.

    2. Jurti

      I agree. I think this is going to be a really interesting story arc. She has already been moving toward some big revelations throughout the strip since she came to college. It will be really great to see her expand and grow even further instead of always being so restrained by her incredibly limiting upbringing.

      At the same time, I am feeling a bit nervous. This is going to probably be a rough ride.

      1. ShinyNeen

        Yeah, I think “nervous” sums up my feelings perfectly. It looks like this dream is going to make Joyce confront something really scary and painful for her to think about, but it’s just a dream so hopefully it won’t hurt too bad long-term.

        But it’s really promising that this is what the new storyline is starting off with, especially since Joyce seems unlikely to follow Joe or Billie’s recent examples of backsliding considerably on their growth.

  41. BenRG

    Joyce, here is a free tip: Don’t stay up too late writing. The dreams that an overstimulated subconscious can provide are freaky. So, I’m assuming that ‘Dorothy’ is Joyce’s superego and ‘Walky’ is Joyce’s ego?

    1. SillyGoose

      Wouldn’t Walky rather be her Id? And Joyce would be the ego.

      1. Shane

        I think Joyce is out of touch with her id.

        It is funny that Dorothy is the matter-of-fact, knowledgeable and authoritative explainer of what’s going on in Joyce’s mind.

        1. Ethics Gradient

          Ah, Joyce!

          Beware the Id’s of March!

        2. Agemegos

          Well, I laughed.

        3. Arian

          Ditto. 😀

  42. Kelli217

    In the sliding scale of DoA time, Mullins originally died when Joyce was around 5 years old. Now, he died 4 years before she was born.

  43. Ravenstromdans

    Call me ageist if you like, but I’m a little surprised Walky knows about “What About Bob?”

    1. BenRG

      Actually, I’m pretty sure that isn’t Walky but is a part of Joyce’s subconscius using his face in her dreams.

      1. Ravenstromdans

        Honestly, that’s even MORE baffling to me, given how sheltered Joyce has been throughout most of her life.

  44. Delicious Taffy

    By the way, the art in this strip looks better than usual. I really like it.

  45. acher4

    wth?

  46. Zaxares

    I have NO idea who Rich Mullins is. XD

  47. Lone Duck

    If this is a dream, Joyce’s subconscious is filling in pretty well for Walky. I also like the idea that Joyce doesn’t know what he looks like and is just imagining a Bill Murray-like older man.
    The name was kinda familiar to me, and once I googled it, I was like, yeah, I heard those songs all the time back when I was religious.

  48. Charlotte

    This is meant to be a dream, right?
    I’m confused.

    1. Sam

      Yes. Rich Mullins in real life passed away quite a while ago.

      1. Charlotte

        I will admit that I have no idea who Rich Mullins is.

  49. Arian

    Rich Mullins wrote my favourite song, for what that’s worth. But anyway, what’s he doing here? He’s dead.

    1. Arian

      Oh, right, Joyce is dreaming.

  50. ninja_jesus

    Rich Mullins gives me YTMND flashbacks.

  51. sun tzu

    Considering how autobiographical this Joyce is, this is the first Willis comic in which atheist!Joyce is a possibility.

  52. Kurt

    As a Christian reader of this comic, Willis’ familiarity with the landscape and language of Evangelical Christianity is always quite interesting to me.

    As far as CCM music goes, you can do a LOT worse than Rich Mullins.

    1. Arian

      I agree.

    2. Reltzik

      Agreed. Though that says more about CCM than Rich Mullins.

    3. Valerie

      I think he was raised as a fundamentalist Christian, so that’s probably why. (I might be misremembering, though.)

  53. Liska

    I came in to comment, because I’m a fan of Ted Yoder, who mentioned Rich Mullins as an influence of his, which lead to me checking him out, which means that I actually know who he is and kinda what a hammered dulcimer is! So neat! and it seriously made me laugh and I really needed that this morning.

  54. TsunamiJane

    I still like a lot of Rich Mullins songs despite no longer identifying as a Christian.

  55. snapdragon

    Joyce’s strange dreams are some of my favorite moments from DoA.

  56. Jim

    Am I the only person here who had to Google Rich Mullins?

    1. oh no

      I would have, but the time I came around the comments were able to fill me in.

  57. kilgaen

    Now you see, that can’t be a dream. Walky is making reference that I’m pretty certain Joyce wouldn’t know. Unless Walky is the only supernatural element of DOA, capable of invading the dreams of others. Or it’s his dream.

    Or Joyce actually did see What About Bob and thought the same thing. But what are the odds such a thing would be buried in her subconscious?

  58. Josh Spicer

    Well THIS is clearly a dream.

    I mean, assuming that IS Rich Mullins and NOT Bill Murray circa What About Bob?

    For some reason Bill Murray appearing in class playing a…whatever that is is more believable than Rich Mullins.

    1. Josh Spicer

      OH he did Awesome God and Step by Step.

      He immediately earns my praise. Two of the best contemporary Christian songs.

      1. Arian

        Since you think so, google “If I Stand” and “Ready For The Storm”, which are my two favourites of his songs.

        Religious Content Warning: may not be beneficial for angry and/or damaged former believers.

    2. Bicycle Bill

      I believe that’s a version of a hammered dulcimer.

  59. Rartorata

    Galasso strikes again!?

  60. Toes14

    I just love it when comic strips reference religious types and simply expect everyone to know who the hell they are. (not) I just wasted 10 seconds of my life Googling Rich Mullins. Now I’m pissed!!

    1. toby

      so did you expect there to be no obscure religious content in this comic about a fundamentalist, or

    2. JBento

      Ladies and gentleman, the problem with humans:

      “I have increased the sum of my knowledge, what affront to the natural order is this? HOW DARE YOU?!”

      1. Valerie

        Hey now, they might have needed that space in their brain for theropod facts.

    3. Inahc

      I just assumed that if it was important, the comments section would cover it. It wasn’t really, but was covered anyways. 🙂

  61. BigDogLittleCat

    I had never heard of Rich Mullins before now and I would like to return to that state, please.

    1. Bathymetheus

      You’re going to need a Calvin-style summer vacation.

  62. Vulcanodon

    Oh, this is going to be traumatic for Joyce.

  63. Mel

    It’s an interesting choice in Rich Mullins, and a good one.

  64. Opale

    Dumbing of Age book 8: Are we sure that’s Rich Mullins, an’ not just Bill Murray circa “what about bob”?

  65. Nelly Dreadful

    Does dream Dorothy mean that Joyce NO LONGER feels God when she prays, or does she mean Joyce has NEVER felt God when she prayed and has been lying about it all this time? I’ve heard both experiences from former Christians and I’m wondering what my heart should be breaking about.

    1. Sazazezer

      This is kind of the big break i’m dreading for Joyce. No longer feels god/Never felt god. Either way we know based on what Willis has said that Joyce is at one point going to find herself walking down that path of logic that leads her to realise that god doesn’t and has never existed and everything god related that she’s been brought up with is wrong.

      It’ll be good for her in the long run, but ripping that particular band-aid off…

      1. BBCC

        There’s a chance she might be a more flexible Christian like her Walkyverse counterpart did but since this Joyce is much more autobiographical…yeah, I think it’s more likely her faith will break if it bends too much.

      2. Dark

        Which is really unfortunate, because that trope has been played out to the point of becoming cliche.

        1. thejeff

          Because it happens. Particularly to people breaking away from the more toxic forms of Christianity.
          Plus you know, semi-autobiographical.

          It also seems likely Becky won’t be taking that path, which cuts down on the cliche factor, since it’s not being applied as the only option.

        2. BigDogLittleCat

          Is it cliche if it’s the lived experience of a lot of people?
          That’s how many christians deconvert: they realize that whatever they “felt,” they put there.

  66. Untes

    Well, this isn’t the first place I expected a Rich Mullins reference. But here we are. He had some decent ideas on Christianity at least. Not The Worst Human.

  67. toby

    the comment I’m responding to is probably gonna get deleted in moderation but like: man, as a fellow atheist, maybe don’t reduce all religious beliefs to the times when bad people use them to do horrible things

    1. Ethics Gradient

      Yeah, no.

      The old bad apples argument doesn’t wash when the hierarchy cover and hide paedophillia in order to preserve the order of things.

      All religions point to control. Any “good” they do lead to that control.

      I’m done with allowing religion a space in life when all they do is lead to misery and control.

      1. Valerie

        Any large enough organization is going to have serious corruption. That includes religions, yes, but also corporations and governments. The issue isn’t really religion so much as— like you said— the hierarchy that is able and willing to cover up and excuse horrible actions carried out by its members.

        1. BBCC

          Also, excellent way to assume all religions have equal power and authority in society.

        2. Inahc

          Corruption, yes, but *serious* corruption? *All* large organizations? Am I being naive in thinking that not all governments are at covering-up-pedophilia levels of corrupt?

          Your point stands either way , I just… I’m hoping humanity isn’t quite *that* hopeless?

        3. thejeff

          Well, some organizations lack the easy access to children. But we see sexual harassment in a broader range.
          Governments aren’t quite the same, I think. At least democracies tend to have more accountability built and elections provide motivation to release rather than conceal dirt on opponents.

          Religions do have the built in advantage of being set up as moral authorities, making it much harder to challenge them.

        4. Bathymetheus

          In Canada right now we have a controversy about government attempting to avoid prosecuting a large corporation for bribing foreign officials in order to win contracts. A lot of people seem to think this is no big deal, and that it is naïve to suggest that this be diapproved of.

          My concern is that if governments get to interfere in the justice system for “good” reasons (preserving jobs (=votes)), it’s a small step to doing so to protect themselves from the consequences of wrongdoing. Nixon tried this with “the night of the long knives”. trump is trying it right now with his attempts to discredit and derail the Mueller investigation.

          Democracy is based on the concept that the law applies equally to everyone. That isn’t completely true at the moment, and it is NOT OK to say that’s just the way things are.

        5. Bathymetheus

          @thejeff: this came out sounding like I’m criticising you for saying something you did not in fact say. Apologies for my clumsy wording.

          I just mean that government corruption is not trivial even when it seems to be in the public interest. Many people think that “the end justifies the means”, and while this is an argument that can be made, how valid it is varies with the circumstances. My own feeling is that given our human tendency to view our own actions and motivations more favourably than those of others, we should never let those in power control the social mechanisms intended to provide an objective standard of propriety.

          If we fail to insist that our representatives and high-status individuals be subject to the same standards as the rest of us, we don’t have democracy, we have feudalism.

        6. BigDogLittleCat

          The root problem with most religions is not systemic sexual abuse and cover-ups. The problem is they are about control: about a limited number of people (usually men) who control the lives of their followers: what to believe, what to think, what is moral, down to how to have sex and with whom.

          Some religions are more obviously controlling their followers – they’re the ones that tend to be called cults – but the mainstream religions also try to define morality and shape their followers’ minds.

          Some forms of Buddhism and some pagan religions are not control freaks, but every one of the Abrahamic religions is about power.

          And that power is what creates the abuses and the cover-ups. When you’ve convinced people that you are the chosen representative of the all-powerful creator of the universe, you can get away with a lot of shit.

        7. BBCC

          Awful bold of you to assume what’s true of Christianity is also true of other Abrahamic religions.

        8. BBCC

          Real talk – the people I’ve seen talk the most about examining the things taught by their clergy and scripture have been the Jewish and Islamic communities I’ve interacted with. I wouldn’t be shocked if there were also Christian communities like that, but I have never seen one so I can’t speak on experience on that. Regardless, it’s silly to assume universality when there’s a fuckton of religions running around, and yeah, different religions and philosophies have different ideas what constitutes morality – that’s kinda the point.

          This whole thread is bound to devolve into a fight and should probably be deleted in the first place because it’s not going to lead to anything good.

  68. Aprion

    well… that was random AF

  69. Thulcandran

    “He knows you don’t feel God when you pray,” good lord Willis, you don’t need to stab straight for the heart every time. (I’ve been counteracting this all day by reminding myself of the deep feeling of relief the first time you realize everyone* else was faking it too.

    *not everyone was faking it, I realize now, but damn near almost.

    1. Arian

      Well, I would say I wasn’t faking it, but you can assume I’m just fooling myself if you’d like to.

      What I believe about it isn’t influenced in any way by whether or not anyone believes it, so assume I’m one of the deceived with my full blessing if you like. 😉

  70. Agemegos

    It’s probably not okay to link Oglaf from here, even to a particular strip that is safe for the places Oglaf is not reliably safe for. So I’ll just say that there is a recent Oglaf strip titled “Bread Alone” that is about a fellow who was actually happier before God became a real presence when he prayed.

    1. Agemegos

      For those not familiar: Oglaf is a very ribald and sometimes sexually explicit web-comic set in a fantasy realm, with recurring themes and characters but no through plot. Though gods are real in the Oglaf setting the comic is sometimes satirical about religion and other fantasy ropes.

      Oglaf is not safe for anywhere. I think Amber would like it. Maybe Ethan, too. Danny has obviously not read it.

    2. Poofdepoof

      Oh, I remember that one!

      https://media.oglaf.com/comic/bread_alone.jpg

  71. Agemegos

    Bill Murray is not tagged.

  72. Agemegos

    Cardinal Pell. He hasn’t been a mere bishop since 1996.

  73. Lia47

    aw man i hope we get a whole joyce religion arc next

  74. Fredcritter

    Tangentially (not to pick on anyone here): I must say that I’m … amused? … interested? … when the term “atheist” gets used as an accusation rather than as a simple descriptor. Because, after all, the ancients—the Greeks, Romans, and others—regarded the Jews as atheists because they only believe in one God…

  75. Gus Snarp

    Well, I had to google Rich Mullins, but now that>/i> song is going to be stuck in my head all day. Thanks, Willis.

    1. Gus Snarp

      And I goofed an HTML tag. I hang my head in shame.

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