While it is true that too much of Sarah’s pessimism kills love in its crib (see her own relationship with Jacob for an example), I think a little dose of it is preferable to pure blind optimism. Becky and Dina have a lot of potential problems– Becky’s housing issue, Dina’s apparent asexuality against Becky’s raging libido, the difficulty of finding a normal rhythm in a relationship that’s so far been defined by drama.
The time to confront obvious potential problems in a relationship is fairly early in the game, when both partners are full of energy and motivation and willing to make real changes in their lives. Dina’s response tells us that this isn’t an issue Sarah just created, or even one she doesn’t know about: it’s an issue that she’s been burying. Becky probably has, too.
True, but they’re also in good positions and are currently (without additional pressure) doing positive things in the relationship to address these things. Becky is enacting long-term plans to no longer be homeless and is trying to make sure there’s not a dynamic of financial inequality where Dina is buying all the stuff.
Becky and Dina are taking care to show appreciation and while Becky still has feelings for Joyce, she acknowledges and celebrates Dina and makes sure that she neither disappears from Joyce’s life to go into co-dependence with Dina, nor leaves Dina out of her attempts to comfort Joyce as a friend.
Dina is stating her extroversion limits and is finding ways to stretch them that are not emotionally taxing. Plus, on the asexuality thing, she may be asexual, but she seems to be an asexual like me who finds sex intellectually intriguing and would likely be interested in exploring that someday. And Becky for her part is doing really well to take lessons from her surprise kiss with Joyce and is going very slowly with a lot of respect for Dina’s boundaries.
Honestly, this pessimism is kind of out of place for these reasons. They aren’t making really obvious mistakes that will cost them in the future like Ruth and Billie. And fears like being a “rebound” are often the kind of thing young people fear before they date enough to know that they aren’t any more doomed than any other relationship.
Which means, Sarah is just dumping on her pessimism because of her own fears regarding intimacy and may in fact make the situation worse by getting Dina wrapped up in her senses of inadequacy in the relationship (the times in which the relationship has shown signs of codependence has been when Dina has been trying to follow a traditional script because of feeling inadequate, especially in comparison to Joyce):http://www.dumbingofage.com/2015/comic/book-6/01-to-those-whod-ground-me/socialsecurity/
And honestly, given the situations both have, trying to fit a more normative script would definitely cause a metric crap ton of problems.
Well really there’s two different kinds of “rebounds.” There’s the option that you seem to be talking about, where person X can’t be with person Y and ends up with person Q but genuinely has feelings for person Q. Then there’s the option that I think most of us have a problem with. Where person X is merely settling for person Q and is just waiting around for perhaps probably maybe even if it’s a misinterpretation of a completely innocent action on behalf of person Y and person X is like I AM GOING TO INTERPRET THIS HOW I WANT AND GO FOR IT and person Q is left behind feeling used, whether person Y was actually making a move on person X or person X just wanted it to mean that. (or a second interpretation of this second situation is person X settles for person Q because they just don’t want to be alone, even if they don’t actually have any romantic feelings for person Q)
Not that I have an opinion one way or the other on which one Becky is cause I’d rather just sit back and read the story but I think that the second situation is the “rebound” that most people have a problem with and really don’t want Dina to be that kind of rebound. Cause those kinds of rebounds always end terribly.
Some people like to misinterpret anything though. Made-up example: Something awesome happens to Joyce, who is a hugger. She is happy, so she hugs Becky, her best friend. Becky is like “OH THIS MUST MEAN SHE FINALLY LOVES ME” and breaks up with Dina to pursue this misinterpreted innocent nothing from Joyce. Joyce of course is like, “I didn’t mean it that way O__o;; ” but now it’s too late cause Dina’s broken-hearted from getting dumped.
Again, made-up example, but when people are in love they are prone to reading too much into innocent things.
Inlaa
Disclaimer: Yes, I AM a fan of Sarah as a character. In fact, she’s my favorite member of the cast. That may muddle my perception of things. But then again, I started liking her most for her observations, personality, and pessimism. Take that into account as you read the following stuff.
– – – – – – – – – –
Honestly, I’m of the opinion that whether or not Dina and Becky both try to make it work, there are plenty of chances this could turn out to be a short (but still potentially happy) relationship, rebound or not.
1. Becky is NOT supposed to be living in the dorm. Her situation is understandable and we can all empathize, but the law won’t. All it takes is for a suspicious, well meaning stranger (or someone horrible like Mary) to ruin her life for her right now. Heck, they’d probably ruin our favorite R.A.’s life while they’re at it since AFAIK she’s letting this go on. They’d either see her as incompetent or realize she’s been hiding stuff from them.
2. Dina and Becky LITERALLY just met a few days ago in webcomic time, and Dina is the first girl at this school that has shown interest in Becky. Dina is happy to be with her, sure, and I’ll bet Becky is too. But that doesn’t mean Becky won’t find someone else she’s more interested in, or that Dina won’t notice Becky still pining for Joyce (she has noticed) and maybe get super stressed out from that. Given her reaction, it’s possible this has been on her mind for a while. I’m pretty sure tomorrow will have some answers.
3. And then there’s psychological issues. Becky has gone through some serious Hell lately. She needs a therapist, and so does Joyce. I forget if either of them agreed to talk to one yet, but they probably should, because at the very least they need to have that outlet for their frustrations and anxieties. If Becky doesn’t get a chance to talk to a therapist now that AFAIK she has AFAIK no DIRECT family to turn to… I dunno. But she’s run away from home, had a gun pointed at her BY HER DAD, had her sexuality invalidated by her old school, feels very betrayed, etc. When that bad juju bubbles and festers, is Dina going to be the one to try and bottle it up? Or to help her work it out? Will that WORK for Becky?
4. Finally, sake of drama. Dude, this is Willis we’re talking about. Willis will do his darnedest to throw monkey wrenches into the characters’ lives because it makes good drama. If something bad can happen, it WILL happen.
5. Oh – and then there’s sexual intercourse. Different people have different opinions about sex. For instance, I frankly don’t give a damn about sex; I don’t see the allure of it; and if I were to have a girlfriend that was REALLY sexual, we’d probably have problems. I think Dina might be interested in sex, but she and Becky may end up with very differing views about how important it is. That can break relationships.
Now, obviously Sarah can’t know about #4, but I’m pretty sure she’s thought about points 1 and 2 a fair bit, and she may be savvy to point 3. This really goes beyond Dina being Becky’s rebound – and again, remember that (as a poster way down at the bottom of the comments mentioned before) Becky and Dina only met days ago and Becky is still orbiting her super crush of forever ago. That orbiting is not a good sign.
Now, this relationship can still go on very happily, with Dina and Becky talking this out and working through the hurdles in their way. As a lot of people said, rebounds can blossom into beautiful, long lasting relationships. That doesn’t mean marriage or life partners necessarily, though that’s possible, but it can mean some happy years of dating, too. Any of these outcomes is a good experience.
This relationship could ALSO end on a HAPPY note, as I think is the most probable and eventual outcome. I think Becky and Dina are going to have a few bad moments, but will realize they’re not really the BEST for each other despite being really, really good friends, and will then break up but stay, yeah, friends. I could see Dina being the sort that’s able to do that, and I could see Becky really wanting to keep Dina as a friend because DINA ATTACKED TOEDAD TO SAVE HER LIFE, ¡JESUS CHRISTO! That’s gotta be a pretty darned good bond. They’ll stay friends, I’m pretty sure of that, no matter what happens.
But with all that said, I do NOT think Sarah was wrong to want to talk about this. She presents herself in a shitty way, perhaps, but this situation Becky is in has a lot of potential to hurt both her and everyone around her, not to mention the fact that she does still have a HUGE crush on her best friend since forever. Could Sarah be creating a self-fulfilling prophecy by bringing this up? It’s possible. But I don’t think I can realistically blame Sarah for worrying about how this will turn out for her friend, and I don’t think I can blame her for voicing this opinion if she thinks it might help.
Also, someone else later on makes a fair point about Sarah’s perspective I’d like to bring up:
“She’s [Sarah] overly pessimistic about her own (love) life, sadly, but pretty spot-on when it comes to others. Remember how she was a party-pooper at the beginning of the semester, when Joyce and Dorothy were headed out to party with Roz? If only she had “pooped” harder.”
And I’d say that’s not far off the mark. Sarah is a pessimist through and through, probably TOO pessimistic, but thus far we don’t have any evidence that she’s a BAD judge of character. Frankly, I’m willing to bet she DID save her first roommate’s life, and we know darned well it’s super fortunate Sarah came to Roz’s party after all. The guy got away thanks to Amazigirl, if anyone remembers that…
ObiKemnebi
All those things taken into account, is it still necessary to bring it up, though? I am currently on a rebound with a guy who is rebounding off of me. All four non-author-related points apply to us. We realize this is most likely not going to be a longterm relationship. But for the moment, we have decided to ignore that and just enjoy it while it lasts. If we can enjoy it now, why focus on the eventual end? That will just get depressing and ruin the joy we feel in the moment. Dina isn’t stupid. She /knows/ what’s going on. But it makes her happy in the moment. She and Becky are both strong enough to deal with bridges when they come to them. Sarah may be right about the nature of the relationship, but it’s still way out of bounds for her to rain on their parade. And this is what she does. She points out possible problems before they become problems, not because the people she’s talking to need to be prepared for those problems, but because Sarah herself is too cynical to accept present joys as they come. She’s trying to force other people to live with her world view of “High failure chance equals don’t bother trying.” And that is /not/ right.
RP
“She’s trying to force other people to live with her world view” – All she’s ever done is warn about potential problems. Yeah, that makes her a Debbie Downer but that’s not the same thing as trying to *force* people into thinking or seeing things the same way she does.
Correct me if I’m wrong but I’ve never seen Sarah say, “Do it my way or else.”
Ana Chronistic
To be fair, True Friends say shit like that–once. If Sarah continues to harp on the “rebound” thing, then she is not a True Friend but a Misery who wants Company.
I’m on year 12 of a “rebound” that, to be honest, I saw coming long ago and was too chicken shit to do anything about (mostly about what it meant for my living arrangements, somewhat similiar to Becky’s but with less Ruthless and financial dependence). The terrible lizbeans can still work! MAKE IT HAPPEN
morg
Asexual? She certainly seemed to be but remember the clip just before Toe Dad showed up? She was very eager to go do something! I thought that Becky or maybe just the concept of having a partner seemed to wake something up.
That’s not really a surprise. I know we aren’t supposed to talk about ‘that other universe’ but personalities seem to be similar across the two and she certainly wasn’t asexual there!
Ugghhh, fuck Sarah’s shitty perspective. I don’t care if she’s vigilante because of it she’s a bad friend and she pushes people away.
Saying this helps no one. The whole concept of being afraid of being a rebound is counterproductive. These doubts will likely cause Dina to mistrust Becky’s behavior or her feelings for Becky. Either way the result is that Dina will be less likely to be open with Becky and more likely to let anxiety ruin a perfectly good relationship. Thus fulfilling Sarah’s shit prophecy.
Unless Sarah proceeds to coach Dina to be ask Becky honest questions this is destructive advice.
Kris
Sarah’s a pessimist and quite unlucky in her own love life. She puts up walls to prevent being hurt. While not great this advice is pretty much the best she can give given her experiences. In her mind this is compassion. That’s my view of it anyway.
Weyland
Yes, but it’s as though Sarah has no concept of a self-fulfilling prophecy, as by saying these things and pointing them out, she has made a problem exponentially more likely to occur.
Shade
I’m sure does, given her recent problems with wooing Jacob. However, being aware of the problem is only the first step. Breaking out of it is harder, especially when it becomes habitual.
Which I suspect for Sarah it has.
Znayx
You guys are all right… But I’m being hopeful here. Everybody’s being touched by little character changes. Even Joe is showing a little more to himself, so I’d say it’s about time for something to change in Sarah… for better or worse.
Well… hrm. On one hand, there’s self fulfiling prophecies. On the other hand, there’s the truth that being warned about bumps in the road, let’s you drive more cautiously.
There’s a fine grey line though!
… to be honest, if there’s going to be a big messy break up ANYWAY, it’s better to be prepared.
… but on the other hand, in this case, everything was going nicely, there were no real problems, and as Weyland said, self fulfiling prophecy here, ie Sarah becomes the cause of the break up, making a problem where there was none.
…
Now, one more thing to consider. Dina immediately said “I know”… that could mean several things. One possible (and I say possible) thing is that she was already worried about this fact but was showing a smile on the outside, but wanted to talk to someone about it. And will now talk to Sarah about it, get it off her chest.
And (her I’m being overly optimistic, opposite of Sarah!), maybe both of them will talk, then realize the relationship is actually going great, no worries after all! Let’s all be extra nice to each other now! Happy ending! OK I’m in lala land here lol. … eh, I can hope… right? … RIGHT?
DAVE!!! MAKE THE HAPPY HAPPY SCENARIO HAPPEN PLEASE!!! Drama Tag pulled, fine, but we just had a lot of angst and major unhappiness, remember a good comic has some BALANCE, and Dina is the one we choose for some happiness!!! … please? 😉
I agree with a lot of the chain. Sarah is very cynical about romance and relationships of all kinds. And she has a habit of torpedoing relationships before they start by being way too focused on their “inevitable end”. This means she assumes most other relationships other people are in will be doomed by their problems, whatever they are, no matter how small they are (remember she axed her developing connection with Jacob simply because she became convinced that eventually Jacob would see her less desirable qualities and leave and so she actively resisted any form of connection).
So yeah, to her its kindness to notice a potential flaw, no matter how unlikely and bring it up before things get too untangled. And it’s a kindness that can be genuine and helpful (her being able to see through Joe’s intentions with regards to Joyce) as much as it can be nothing but a hinderance to its recipient (here).
It’s a delicate balance and where Sarah is she’s going to get it wrong sometimes.
MerchV
Gotta move the plot forward, I guess.
Lord Riven
You meant ‘vigilant,’ but I love the idea of a pessimism vigilante, stalking through the nights, crushing dreams wherever hope is found in the name of bleak truths, hollow justice, and the American way!
gkheyf
the super wet blanket!
…must gave the lamest costume ever
Ryan
The truth hurts.
CleverTrousers
There are worse ways Dina could react to mounting microaggressions (microignorings? micromisplacedaffections?) from a partner clearly in love with Joyce and in her professional life than the explosive dissolution of the relationship.
Except we’re not currently seeing those microaggressions from Becky. Becky has been doing a good job making sure Dina is appreciated and has made sure to include her in things like comforting Joyce when that has been necessary. It’s not like Becky is making small digs at her to be more Joyce-like or praising Joyce at her expense.
So, this is basically a warning about a non-existent problem.
Brasca1
Someone has to be the rebound or there’d be no one to move on to. And while Sarah’s POV is not without some validity she’s hardly a success in matters of the heart. Hopefully, Dina will keep that in mind.
Yeah, rebounds are not nearly as bad as young, new to dating, people believe they are.
I mean, they can be, if the person on the rebound mistreats the person they are rebounding with and takes them for granted (see Scott Pilgrim with Knives).
But more often than not, it’s just dating. And not any more doomed or prone to be short term than any other form of dating.
Misteline
I don’t see being concerned about someone as being a bad friend. The gentle approach Sarah was taking may not have created any doubts, but Dina asked for brutal honesty. Sometimes thats what you want and need. And as Dina said…she already knew. Emotional turn around is rarely that fast or that drastic without doubt already being there.
Sarah cares, has yet to be wrong, and feels a strong sense of responsibility toward the less experienced of her freshman brood. And every time Sarah has had doubts about a situation or someone’s intentions, she’s been completely right. Her biggest sin has been being pretty nonspecific and noncommital. Tbh I think she’s giving exactly the type of advice one would want someone around to give if the couple wasn’t hecka adorbs. Realistically their relationship has some major danger signs for people afraid of getting hurt, as well as people afraid of others getting hurt. Becky and Dina got together during major upheaval in Becky’s life and Becky’s world view is changing quickly and drastically, as is Dina’s. Starting a relationship in the middle of that can lead to some unhealthy behavior and warp a new relationship. It probably way too early to tell, but Sarah’s experiences have set her up to worry early and doubt interpersonal relationships. And while we’ve seen Becky’s arc first hand, to Sarah she’s still at least partially the girl who entered their lives through deception and manipulation, no matter how justified her actions may seem. Sarah didn’t trust her from the very beginning…and was 100% right both about her being deceitful and about he deceit leading to a life altering mess. Now Becky has jumped from Sarah’s ultra naïve roommate to the girl with little to no social skills who everyone else treats like she’s 12, in less time than it takes to get over a cold.
Would I say anything? No, because I’m all about self preservation. Never insert yourself into anyone else’s relationship if you don’t wanna get burned. Either you’ll get blamed for their insecurities, or you’ll be that friend who tried to break them up right up to and beyond when they actually do break up. Bonus bile if you were right. Being right about the likelihood of someone getting hurt is never endearing, no one’s thankful for the warning even though they’re even less likely to want to clean up the aftermath. This is a lesson that Sarah already learned the hard way, and its a big part of why she built up her walls in the first place.
I’m less worried about Dina and Becky than I am about Sarah. In some ways I’m happy that Sarah is finally committing enough to express the actual concern at issue, but she’s tried so hard not to get involved, and I’m not sure how she’s going to take it when Willis inevitably has everything blow up in her face. Dina and Becky and cute and all, but Sarah has been letting her walls fall only to turn into a kind of Cassandra truth avatar. We build walls to protect our most vulnerable spaces, and nothing good ever came to Cassandra for speaking the truth. Or to Sarah for that matter.
Savail
This. So much this.
Liliet
(you are right about stuff, but I just wanted to note that Dina is not in fact 12. She’s treated like she is, yes, but remember, being angry at that is basically what STARTED her relationship with Becky. She kissed her to show she wasn’t a little kid. She has social difficulties, yes, but autistic =/= childish. Other people’s assumptions are on them. If anything, Becky’s treating her the best out of her friends rn)
I think Dina can handle it. She doesn’t strike me as the type to play games, shenanigans, and scripts. I think she wants directness. And she’s intelligent, much more so than most of them (and most of us) give her credit for.
Yeah, I was gonna say, in Sarah’s defense Dina explicitly requested directness. It’s not like Sarah is having an internal monologue about how much she loves the sorrow of freshman girls as she does it.
octopod
Seems like she’d be doing so if she were being honest with herself, though.
Ghola
Maybe, just maybe? She feels that being aware of the potential for harm is more important then the fleeting happiness burying your head in the sand will give.
Like, you know, how her fleeting happiness in having friends was utterly bloody buried by the drama invoked by her doing the right thing and saving her friend.
Because she attempts in her actions to be an agent of realism and warning, but instead acts as an agent of pessimism and pain. In some ways, she’s the anti-Mike. Mike acts maliciously with the intent of causing harm, but ends up forcing people to grow and develope in the process. Sarah acts with the intent of protecting others from themselves, but ends up primarily causing pain and discomfort. However, her attempts only do this to us, the readers, because Sarah herself is a more developed and three-dimensional character, whereas Mike is simply snarky maliciousness incarnate.
Wait, it’s been only a week? I thought they were almost done with their first semester by now! I’ve been reading this since I was a sophomore in highschool and I’ve already moved to sophomore in College! God…I want to be in their universe just so I can…enjoy?…being nineteen for like ten years.
I know! I am literally crying tears because of it right now. The effect it had on me reminded me of that one page where after Ethan tackles Danny, then they make out but you see that it’s a thought bubble but the twist is that it’s Danny’s thought bubble.
Huh! I’m surprised, actually, that the characters think that this matters. What’s wrong with a rebound relationship, those can turn into lasting ones, too.
This. When you’re young, rebounds are one of those big scary words that are always shown in movies (when noted to be rebounds) to be giant buckets of fail (even though most romantic comedies involve the main romance being a rebound from a recently failed relationship in actuality).
And like many things sold to people as key parts of romance, it is a giant crock of shit.
They can, and maybe this will. But the odds are against them. Dina’s literally the first girl to fall in Becky’s lap who was responsive to her advances and Dina kissed her out of annoyance over how she was being treated. Not the best beginning, not totally doomed but we’ll have to see how genuine the attraction is once the first relationship shine wears off.
I mean, yeah, but people meet the loves of their lives on grindr, too. You don’t have to Meet Cute for it to become a very meaningful relationship in its own right.
I don’t really think so. Yeah, their beginning is rather uncommon (Dina kissing her to spite her friends, Becky finding the first person in her life to love her back unapologetically), but they’re enacting good relationship practices and show genuine care. They’re both in NRE (new relationship energy) and there might be conflicts that arise later, but right now they are adapting to the very real issues both of them have faced in this relationship with an impressive amount of aplomb.
These two characters in particular are 18-20 and have a very limited understanding of relationships. This is actually a pretty common belief. Neither has actually had a rebound relationship and doubtfully know anyone who has had one.
In other words, they’re inexperienced and are relying on what their culture had taught them about how these things happen.
You all are right. I forgot that the title was Dumbing of Age, not ‘characters who think that they know things are correct, and then everyone makes mature decisions’.
470 thoughts on “Riddles”
butts
SHIT
butts
SUDDEN MOOD SHIFT
lejwocky
Followed by freezing in carbonite
Jack Faire
Good pull
Jon Rich
Awesome reference.
Cheryl
Willis giveth and Willis taketh away.
T Campbell
While it is true that too much of Sarah’s pessimism kills love in its crib (see her own relationship with Jacob for an example), I think a little dose of it is preferable to pure blind optimism. Becky and Dina have a lot of potential problems– Becky’s housing issue, Dina’s apparent asexuality against Becky’s raging libido, the difficulty of finding a normal rhythm in a relationship that’s so far been defined by drama.
The time to confront obvious potential problems in a relationship is fairly early in the game, when both partners are full of energy and motivation and willing to make real changes in their lives. Dina’s response tells us that this isn’t an issue Sarah just created, or even one she doesn’t know about: it’s an issue that she’s been burying. Becky probably has, too.
Cerberus
True, but they’re also in good positions and are currently (without additional pressure) doing positive things in the relationship to address these things. Becky is enacting long-term plans to no longer be homeless and is trying to make sure there’s not a dynamic of financial inequality where Dina is buying all the stuff.
Becky and Dina are taking care to show appreciation and while Becky still has feelings for Joyce, she acknowledges and celebrates Dina and makes sure that she neither disappears from Joyce’s life to go into co-dependence with Dina, nor leaves Dina out of her attempts to comfort Joyce as a friend.
Dina is stating her extroversion limits and is finding ways to stretch them that are not emotionally taxing. Plus, on the asexuality thing, she may be asexual, but she seems to be an asexual like me who finds sex intellectually intriguing and would likely be interested in exploring that someday. And Becky for her part is doing really well to take lessons from her surprise kiss with Joyce and is going very slowly with a lot of respect for Dina’s boundaries.
Honestly, this pessimism is kind of out of place for these reasons. They aren’t making really obvious mistakes that will cost them in the future like Ruth and Billie. And fears like being a “rebound” are often the kind of thing young people fear before they date enough to know that they aren’t any more doomed than any other relationship.
Which means, Sarah is just dumping on her pessimism because of her own fears regarding intimacy and may in fact make the situation worse by getting Dina wrapped up in her senses of inadequacy in the relationship (the times in which the relationship has shown signs of codependence has been when Dina has been trying to follow a traditional script because of feeling inadequate, especially in comparison to Joyce):http://www.dumbingofage.com/2015/comic/book-6/01-to-those-whod-ground-me/socialsecurity/
And honestly, given the situations both have, trying to fit a more normative script would definitely cause a metric crap ton of problems.
Dragon_Nataku
Well really there’s two different kinds of “rebounds.” There’s the option that you seem to be talking about, where person X can’t be with person Y and ends up with person Q but genuinely has feelings for person Q. Then there’s the option that I think most of us have a problem with. Where person X is merely settling for person Q and is just waiting around for perhaps probably maybe even if it’s a misinterpretation of a completely innocent action on behalf of person Y and person X is like I AM GOING TO INTERPRET THIS HOW I WANT AND GO FOR IT and person Q is left behind feeling used, whether person Y was actually making a move on person X or person X just wanted it to mean that. (or a second interpretation of this second situation is person X settles for person Q because they just don’t want to be alone, even if they don’t actually have any romantic feelings for person Q)
Not that I have an opinion one way or the other on which one Becky is cause I’d rather just sit back and read the story but I think that the second situation is the “rebound” that most people have a problem with and really don’t want Dina to be that kind of rebound. Cause those kinds of rebounds always end terribly.
Cerberus
But Joyce is straight. There’s no there there for the second type of rebound.
Dragon_Nataku
Some people like to misinterpret anything though. Made-up example: Something awesome happens to Joyce, who is a hugger. She is happy, so she hugs Becky, her best friend. Becky is like “OH THIS MUST MEAN SHE FINALLY LOVES ME” and breaks up with Dina to pursue this misinterpreted innocent nothing from Joyce. Joyce of course is like, “I didn’t mean it that way O__o;; ” but now it’s too late cause Dina’s broken-hearted from getting dumped.
Again, made-up example, but when people are in love they are prone to reading too much into innocent things.
Inlaa
Disclaimer: Yes, I AM a fan of Sarah as a character. In fact, she’s my favorite member of the cast. That may muddle my perception of things. But then again, I started liking her most for her observations, personality, and pessimism. Take that into account as you read the following stuff.
– – – – – – – – – –
Honestly, I’m of the opinion that whether or not Dina and Becky both try to make it work, there are plenty of chances this could turn out to be a short (but still potentially happy) relationship, rebound or not.
1. Becky is NOT supposed to be living in the dorm. Her situation is understandable and we can all empathize, but the law won’t. All it takes is for a suspicious, well meaning stranger (or someone horrible like Mary) to ruin her life for her right now. Heck, they’d probably ruin our favorite R.A.’s life while they’re at it since AFAIK she’s letting this go on. They’d either see her as incompetent or realize she’s been hiding stuff from them.
2. Dina and Becky LITERALLY just met a few days ago in webcomic time, and Dina is the first girl at this school that has shown interest in Becky. Dina is happy to be with her, sure, and I’ll bet Becky is too. But that doesn’t mean Becky won’t find someone else she’s more interested in, or that Dina won’t notice Becky still pining for Joyce (she has noticed) and maybe get super stressed out from that. Given her reaction, it’s possible this has been on her mind for a while. I’m pretty sure tomorrow will have some answers.
3. And then there’s psychological issues. Becky has gone through some serious Hell lately. She needs a therapist, and so does Joyce. I forget if either of them agreed to talk to one yet, but they probably should, because at the very least they need to have that outlet for their frustrations and anxieties. If Becky doesn’t get a chance to talk to a therapist now that AFAIK she has AFAIK no DIRECT family to turn to… I dunno. But she’s run away from home, had a gun pointed at her BY HER DAD, had her sexuality invalidated by her old school, feels very betrayed, etc. When that bad juju bubbles and festers, is Dina going to be the one to try and bottle it up? Or to help her work it out? Will that WORK for Becky?
4. Finally, sake of drama. Dude, this is Willis we’re talking about. Willis will do his darnedest to throw monkey wrenches into the characters’ lives because it makes good drama. If something bad can happen, it WILL happen.
5. Oh – and then there’s sexual intercourse. Different people have different opinions about sex. For instance, I frankly don’t give a damn about sex; I don’t see the allure of it; and if I were to have a girlfriend that was REALLY sexual, we’d probably have problems. I think Dina might be interested in sex, but she and Becky may end up with very differing views about how important it is. That can break relationships.
Now, obviously Sarah can’t know about #4, but I’m pretty sure she’s thought about points 1 and 2 a fair bit, and she may be savvy to point 3. This really goes beyond Dina being Becky’s rebound – and again, remember that (as a poster way down at the bottom of the comments mentioned before) Becky and Dina only met days ago and Becky is still orbiting her super crush of forever ago. That orbiting is not a good sign.
Now, this relationship can still go on very happily, with Dina and Becky talking this out and working through the hurdles in their way. As a lot of people said, rebounds can blossom into beautiful, long lasting relationships. That doesn’t mean marriage or life partners necessarily, though that’s possible, but it can mean some happy years of dating, too. Any of these outcomes is a good experience.
This relationship could ALSO end on a HAPPY note, as I think is the most probable and eventual outcome. I think Becky and Dina are going to have a few bad moments, but will realize they’re not really the BEST for each other despite being really, really good friends, and will then break up but stay, yeah, friends. I could see Dina being the sort that’s able to do that, and I could see Becky really wanting to keep Dina as a friend because DINA ATTACKED TOEDAD TO SAVE HER LIFE, ¡JESUS CHRISTO! That’s gotta be a pretty darned good bond. They’ll stay friends, I’m pretty sure of that, no matter what happens.
But with all that said, I do NOT think Sarah was wrong to want to talk about this. She presents herself in a shitty way, perhaps, but this situation Becky is in has a lot of potential to hurt both her and everyone around her, not to mention the fact that she does still have a HUGE crush on her best friend since forever. Could Sarah be creating a self-fulfilling prophecy by bringing this up? It’s possible. But I don’t think I can realistically blame Sarah for worrying about how this will turn out for her friend, and I don’t think I can blame her for voicing this opinion if she thinks it might help.
Also, someone else later on makes a fair point about Sarah’s perspective I’d like to bring up:
“She’s [Sarah] overly pessimistic about her own (love) life, sadly, but pretty spot-on when it comes to others. Remember how she was a party-pooper at the beginning of the semester, when Joyce and Dorothy were headed out to party with Roz? If only she had “pooped” harder.”
And I’d say that’s not far off the mark. Sarah is a pessimist through and through, probably TOO pessimistic, but thus far we don’t have any evidence that she’s a BAD judge of character. Frankly, I’m willing to bet she DID save her first roommate’s life, and we know darned well it’s super fortunate Sarah came to Roz’s party after all. The guy got away thanks to Amazigirl, if anyone remembers that…
ObiKemnebi
All those things taken into account, is it still necessary to bring it up, though? I am currently on a rebound with a guy who is rebounding off of me. All four non-author-related points apply to us. We realize this is most likely not going to be a longterm relationship. But for the moment, we have decided to ignore that and just enjoy it while it lasts. If we can enjoy it now, why focus on the eventual end? That will just get depressing and ruin the joy we feel in the moment. Dina isn’t stupid. She /knows/ what’s going on. But it makes her happy in the moment. She and Becky are both strong enough to deal with bridges when they come to them. Sarah may be right about the nature of the relationship, but it’s still way out of bounds for her to rain on their parade. And this is what she does. She points out possible problems before they become problems, not because the people she’s talking to need to be prepared for those problems, but because Sarah herself is too cynical to accept present joys as they come. She’s trying to force other people to live with her world view of “High failure chance equals don’t bother trying.” And that is /not/ right.
RP
“She’s trying to force other people to live with her world view” – All she’s ever done is warn about potential problems. Yeah, that makes her a Debbie Downer but that’s not the same thing as trying to *force* people into thinking or seeing things the same way she does.
Correct me if I’m wrong but I’ve never seen Sarah say, “Do it my way or else.”
Ana Chronistic
To be fair, True Friends say shit like that–once. If Sarah continues to harp on the “rebound” thing, then she is not a True Friend but a Misery who wants Company.
I’m on year 12 of a “rebound” that, to be honest, I saw coming long ago and was too chicken shit to do anything about (mostly about what it meant for my living arrangements, somewhat similiar to Becky’s but with less Ruthless and financial dependence). The terrible lizbeans can still work! MAKE IT HAPPEN
morg
Asexual? She certainly seemed to be but remember the clip just before Toe Dad showed up? She was very eager to go do something! I thought that Becky or maybe just the concept of having a partner seemed to wake something up.
That’s not really a surprise. I know we aren’t supposed to talk about ‘that other universe’ but personalities seem to be similar across the two and she certainly wasn’t asexual there!
Some Name
Why must Sarah hurt the Dina?
Plasma Mongoose
Because this sort of thing is why Sarah exists.
John
Ugghhh, fuck Sarah’s shitty perspective. I don’t care if she’s vigilante because of it she’s a bad friend and she pushes people away.
Saying this helps no one. The whole concept of being afraid of being a rebound is counterproductive. These doubts will likely cause Dina to mistrust Becky’s behavior or her feelings for Becky. Either way the result is that Dina will be less likely to be open with Becky and more likely to let anxiety ruin a perfectly good relationship. Thus fulfilling Sarah’s shit prophecy.
Unless Sarah proceeds to coach Dina to be ask Becky honest questions this is destructive advice.
Kris
Sarah’s a pessimist and quite unlucky in her own love life. She puts up walls to prevent being hurt. While not great this advice is pretty much the best she can give given her experiences. In her mind this is compassion. That’s my view of it anyway.
Weyland
Yes, but it’s as though Sarah has no concept of a self-fulfilling prophecy, as by saying these things and pointing them out, she has made a problem exponentially more likely to occur.
Shade
I’m sure does, given her recent problems with wooing Jacob. However, being aware of the problem is only the first step. Breaking out of it is harder, especially when it becomes habitual.
Which I suspect for Sarah it has.
Znayx
You guys are all right… But I’m being hopeful here. Everybody’s being touched by little character changes. Even Joe is showing a little more to himself, so I’d say it’s about time for something to change in Sarah… for better or worse.
Jason
Well… hrm. On one hand, there’s self fulfiling prophecies. On the other hand, there’s the truth that being warned about bumps in the road, let’s you drive more cautiously.
There’s a fine grey line though!
… to be honest, if there’s going to be a big messy break up ANYWAY, it’s better to be prepared.
… but on the other hand, in this case, everything was going nicely, there were no real problems, and as Weyland said, self fulfiling prophecy here, ie Sarah becomes the cause of the break up, making a problem where there was none.
…
Now, one more thing to consider. Dina immediately said “I know”… that could mean several things. One possible (and I say possible) thing is that she was already worried about this fact but was showing a smile on the outside, but wanted to talk to someone about it. And will now talk to Sarah about it, get it off her chest.
And (her I’m being overly optimistic, opposite of Sarah!), maybe both of them will talk, then realize the relationship is actually going great, no worries after all! Let’s all be extra nice to each other now! Happy ending! OK I’m in lala land here lol. … eh, I can hope… right? … RIGHT?
DAVE!!! MAKE THE HAPPY HAPPY SCENARIO HAPPEN PLEASE!!! Drama Tag pulled, fine, but we just had a lot of angst and major unhappiness, remember a good comic has some BALANCE, and Dina is the one we choose for some happiness!!! … please? 😉
Cerberus
I agree with a lot of the chain. Sarah is very cynical about romance and relationships of all kinds. And she has a habit of torpedoing relationships before they start by being way too focused on their “inevitable end”. This means she assumes most other relationships other people are in will be doomed by their problems, whatever they are, no matter how small they are (remember she axed her developing connection with Jacob simply because she became convinced that eventually Jacob would see her less desirable qualities and leave and so she actively resisted any form of connection).
So yeah, to her its kindness to notice a potential flaw, no matter how unlikely and bring it up before things get too untangled. And it’s a kindness that can be genuine and helpful (her being able to see through Joe’s intentions with regards to Joyce) as much as it can be nothing but a hinderance to its recipient (here).
It’s a delicate balance and where Sarah is she’s going to get it wrong sometimes.
MerchV
Gotta move the plot forward, I guess.
Lord Riven
You meant ‘vigilant,’ but I love the idea of a pessimism vigilante, stalking through the nights, crushing dreams wherever hope is found in the name of bleak truths, hollow justice, and the American way!
gkheyf
the super wet blanket!
…must gave the lamest costume ever
Ryan
The truth hurts.
CleverTrousers
There are worse ways Dina could react to mounting microaggressions (microignorings? micromisplacedaffections?) from a partner clearly in love with Joyce and in her professional life than the explosive dissolution of the relationship.
Cerberus
True.
Except we’re not currently seeing those microaggressions from Becky. Becky has been doing a good job making sure Dina is appreciated and has made sure to include her in things like comforting Joyce when that has been necessary. It’s not like Becky is making small digs at her to be more Joyce-like or praising Joyce at her expense.
So, this is basically a warning about a non-existent problem.
Brasca1
Someone has to be the rebound or there’d be no one to move on to. And while Sarah’s POV is not without some validity she’s hardly a success in matters of the heart. Hopefully, Dina will keep that in mind.
Cerberus
Yeah, rebounds are not nearly as bad as young, new to dating, people believe they are.
I mean, they can be, if the person on the rebound mistreats the person they are rebounding with and takes them for granted (see Scott Pilgrim with Knives).
But more often than not, it’s just dating. And not any more doomed or prone to be short term than any other form of dating.
Misteline
I don’t see being concerned about someone as being a bad friend. The gentle approach Sarah was taking may not have created any doubts, but Dina asked for brutal honesty. Sometimes thats what you want and need. And as Dina said…she already knew. Emotional turn around is rarely that fast or that drastic without doubt already being there.
Sarah cares, has yet to be wrong, and feels a strong sense of responsibility toward the less experienced of her freshman brood. And every time Sarah has had doubts about a situation or someone’s intentions, she’s been completely right. Her biggest sin has been being pretty nonspecific and noncommital. Tbh I think she’s giving exactly the type of advice one would want someone around to give if the couple wasn’t hecka adorbs. Realistically their relationship has some major danger signs for people afraid of getting hurt, as well as people afraid of others getting hurt. Becky and Dina got together during major upheaval in Becky’s life and Becky’s world view is changing quickly and drastically, as is Dina’s. Starting a relationship in the middle of that can lead to some unhealthy behavior and warp a new relationship. It probably way too early to tell, but Sarah’s experiences have set her up to worry early and doubt interpersonal relationships. And while we’ve seen Becky’s arc first hand, to Sarah she’s still at least partially the girl who entered their lives through deception and manipulation, no matter how justified her actions may seem. Sarah didn’t trust her from the very beginning…and was 100% right both about her being deceitful and about he deceit leading to a life altering mess. Now Becky has jumped from Sarah’s ultra naïve roommate to the girl with little to no social skills who everyone else treats like she’s 12, in less time than it takes to get over a cold.
Would I say anything? No, because I’m all about self preservation. Never insert yourself into anyone else’s relationship if you don’t wanna get burned. Either you’ll get blamed for their insecurities, or you’ll be that friend who tried to break them up right up to and beyond when they actually do break up. Bonus bile if you were right. Being right about the likelihood of someone getting hurt is never endearing, no one’s thankful for the warning even though they’re even less likely to want to clean up the aftermath. This is a lesson that Sarah already learned the hard way, and its a big part of why she built up her walls in the first place.
I’m less worried about Dina and Becky than I am about Sarah. In some ways I’m happy that Sarah is finally committing enough to express the actual concern at issue, but she’s tried so hard not to get involved, and I’m not sure how she’s going to take it when Willis inevitably has everything blow up in her face. Dina and Becky and cute and all, but Sarah has been letting her walls fall only to turn into a kind of Cassandra truth avatar. We build walls to protect our most vulnerable spaces, and nothing good ever came to Cassandra for speaking the truth. Or to Sarah for that matter.
Savail
This. So much this.
Liliet
(you are right about stuff, but I just wanted to note that Dina is not in fact 12. She’s treated like she is, yes, but remember, being angry at that is basically what STARTED her relationship with Becky. She kissed her to show she wasn’t a little kid. She has social difficulties, yes, but autistic =/= childish. Other people’s assumptions are on them. If anything, Becky’s treating her the best out of her friends rn)
Sambo
To avoid her being more hurt in the future?
ton
but what if this mistake is the best mistake she’s ever made?
I just want dina to be happy. Hopefully with becky
timemonkey
Because she was told to be direct?
Michael Steamweed
I think Dina can handle it. She doesn’t strike me as the type to play games, shenanigans, and scripts. I think she wants directness. And she’s intelligent, much more so than most of them (and most of us) give her credit for.
Wolfbeckett
Yeah, I was gonna say, in Sarah’s defense Dina explicitly requested directness. It’s not like Sarah is having an internal monologue about how much she loves the sorrow of freshman girls as she does it.
octopod
Seems like she’d be doing so if she were being honest with herself, though.
Ghola
Maybe, just maybe? She feels that being aware of the potential for harm is more important then the fleeting happiness burying your head in the sand will give.
Like, you know, how her fleeting happiness in having friends was utterly bloody buried by the drama invoked by her doing the right thing and saving her friend.
Not everyone who is a realist enjoys it.
rachel
THERE IS NOT A GOOD REASON D: D:
DarkoNeko
even your avatar agreees.
trrebi981
I believe you mean, why must Dina always be Willis’ primary hurt deposit box.
Doctor_Who
Because Willis is full of hate and bitterness and can’t allow us to have nice things!
Tsar Kastyk
Because Dina called her favorite number 2, and she is insulted. This is her firing back.
Rukduk
Because she attempts in her actions to be an agent of realism and warning, but instead acts as an agent of pessimism and pain. In some ways, she’s the anti-Mike. Mike acts maliciously with the intent of causing harm, but ends up forcing people to grow and develope in the process. Sarah acts with the intent of protecting others from themselves, but ends up primarily causing pain and discomfort. However, her attempts only do this to us, the readers, because Sarah herself is a more developed and three-dimensional character, whereas Mike is simply snarky maliciousness incarnate.
Alice Macher
This is the most balanced assessment of Sarah (both in and of herself, and in comparison with Mike) that I’ve seen.
Ana Chronistic
“A WEEK?? That’s like FOREVER in DOA YEARS”
Kris
Seriously that’s like a year a least.
Silvester Crow
Wait, it’s been only a week? I thought they were almost done with their first semester by now! I’ve been reading this since I was a sophomore in highschool and I’ve already moved to sophomore in College! God…I want to be in their universe just so I can…enjoy?…being nineteen for like ten years.
Bicycle Bill
Heck no, they’re just barely into October.
Natsu
Give dina all the hug
blackouthart
goddammit, willis, that FLAVOR TEXT
JustCheetoDust
Flavor of the month: tears.
Cheshrin
What gave that final panel the right to exist. WHO ALLOWED SAD DINA. I’LL FIGHT THEM.
SmartAlec105
I know! I am literally crying tears because of it right now. The effect it had on me reminded me of that one page where after Ethan tackles Danny, then they make out but you see that it’s a thought bubble but the twist is that it’s Danny’s thought bubble.
Doctor_Who
Sad Dina is a travesty!
Deanatay
Sarah made Dina sad.
WILLIS MADE DINA SAD
HULK SMASH RAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRGHHH
Leorale
Huh! I’m surprised, actually, that the characters think that this matters. What’s wrong with a rebound relationship, those can turn into lasting ones, too.
electromagneticDestroyosaur
Dude, they’re 18, 19 years old. They don’t know shit about relationships.
Benjamin Geiger
I’m 33 and they know more than I do.
Cerberus
This. When you’re young, rebounds are one of those big scary words that are always shown in movies (when noted to be rebounds) to be giant buckets of fail (even though most romantic comedies involve the main romance being a rebound from a recently failed relationship in actuality).
And like many things sold to people as key parts of romance, it is a giant crock of shit.
timemonkey
They can, and maybe this will. But the odds are against them. Dina’s literally the first girl to fall in Becky’s lap who was responsive to her advances and Dina kissed her out of annoyance over how she was being treated. Not the best beginning, not totally doomed but we’ll have to see how genuine the attraction is once the first relationship shine wears off.
Leorale
I mean, yeah, but people meet the loves of their lives on grindr, too. You don’t have to Meet Cute for it to become a very meaningful relationship in its own right.
Cerberus
I don’t really think so. Yeah, their beginning is rather uncommon (Dina kissing her to spite her friends, Becky finding the first person in her life to love her back unapologetically), but they’re enacting good relationship practices and show genuine care. They’re both in NRE (new relationship energy) and there might be conflicts that arise later, but right now they are adapting to the very real issues both of them have faced in this relationship with an impressive amount of aplomb.
Gordon
These two characters in particular are 18-20 and have a very limited understanding of relationships. This is actually a pretty common belief. Neither has actually had a rebound relationship and doubtfully know anyone who has had one.
In other words, they’re inexperienced and are relying on what their culture had taught them about how these things happen.
Leorale
You all are right. I forgot that the title was Dumbing of Age, not ‘characters who think that they know things are correct, and then everyone makes mature decisions’.
Captain Button
And how else will they learn?
TamiDOA
By reading Dumbing of Age, of course. I’ll have all this relationship stuff figured out … in a few hundred years … maybe.