*pushes up glasses* well ACTUALLY, if an Alolan Golem with its hidden ability used Explosion against a water or flying Pokemon, it would be super effective.
Blaine is likely a pretty low level goon in the mob. Like, maybe level 5. His challenge rating is correspondingly low.
Amber’s at least a 10th level multiclass Vigilante/Nerd, and Joyce at least a 10th level Goody-Two-Shoes, so it makes sense she’s be able to land a blow.
No, no, see, you’re in the wrong genre. Blaine only appeared to be the ruler of the League of Evil Dads, but the ease of his defeat proves that he was only the puppet of the true final boss. The evil dad above all others, who had yet to reveal himself… hidden in plain sight all this time, now to emerge from the shadows at last. A true master of stealth… just like his progeny.
THAT’S RIGHT RYOU SARUYAMA DUMBING OF AGE TRUE FINAL BOSS
clif
Nonsense. His strings are being pulled by the Head Alien, who is in turn an unknowing tool of the Soggies, which are, in turn, mere pawns of the Anti-Cheese.
You know, I really do wonder what happened between “Joyce leaps at Blaine” and “Blaine bursts out the door holding an unconscious Joyce”. We now know Joyce managed to kick Amber in the face, but it always felt like there was a strip missing in there.
I saw the injury but I actually had thought it was a sign of just HOW TIRED Amber was at that point. I actually went back to figure out that yup, it appeared in that strip.
I wish I could remember the number of the maxim that says friendly fire and ship’s mess should be easier to tell apart. I do know it’s one of the early ones.
Also, holy crow Taylor has been doing that comic almost as long as web comics were a thing.
The main line plot would go, Amber is cured, a situation happens where the world needs Amazigirl, there is no Amazigirl. But this is Wiilis, so I dunno.
Perhaps not, but I’m betting that few health professionals are going to believe that crime-fighting vigilante is not something that needs to be cured. If you take away the defining characteristics of Amazigirl, is she still Amazigirl?
King Daniel
Vigilantism is illegal, but it isn’t a mental illness. It isn’t something to “cure”.
I doubt this is leading up to a straightforward cure. First, because Willis only started actively writing AmbG as a system after deciding there were ways to do so that DIDN’T play as much into deeply inaccurate and dangerous tropes about DID (in particular the Violent Scary Evil Personality, but ‘easily and permanently Cured Into Being Neurotypical’ would probably also count, based off what commenters with firsthand knowledge have said.)
Second, we’ve seen a relatively close analogue with Ruth, who’s doing WAY THE FUCK BETTER with the wonders of antidepressants but is still working to break the shitty thought patterns depression (and Sir) produced. (And is also pretty sure she’ll be on antidepressants for years if not ever, because it’s likely chronic. Speaking from experience, even on functioning meds there are still episodes of relapsing depression.) Antidepressants and anxiety meds would probably help a lot with the non-DID issues, but at the end of the day they are not neurotypical and will not be. AG’s still going to be around sharing Amber’s body because she’s not just the costume that can be put away. And Amber getting to a healthy place after All This Trauma And Self-Loathing would take actual years, in-universe. Assuming a DID-supportive therapist in the first place, which is IN NO WAY A GIVEN. There’s still a genuine question in the Psychologist Community (TM)* about whether or not DID actually EXISTS, and the stance of those that do is still largely… Outdated, shall we say. Bad therapists and doctors can Fuck You Up. (I have relatively tame examples, like ‘the endocrinologist I still remember five years later not because she missed a significant B12 deficiency, but because she and her PA spent forty minutes berating me about how the issue was clearly something that they admitted could not be causing my symptoms.’ The deficiency is long fixed, but I STILL don’t feel comfortable seeing a doctor for the first time alone. This doctor was NOT insisting they knew my brain better than I did and in a position to actively recommend ‘treatments’ that would be counterindicated.)
Third, I’m pretty sure Willis knows well enough about the lasting effects of trauma and how to write them with care and nuance. For previous examples, see Dumbing Of Age, September 10, 2010 to present.
* The Psychologist Community, particularly with regards to certain forms of neurodivergence, often fails to seek input from said neurodivergent people they’re studying. Spectacularly.
Yeah. I’m not a mental health professional at all, but from what I understand of DID cases like Amber’s, harmonious coexistence is probably the best, most realistic end goal.
I’d guess successful treatment might look more like couples’ therapy than an attempt to suppress alters.
elsendor
sometimes we can integrate, and a lot of psychologists treat integration as the “cure” or the ideal outcome, which a lot of us systems don’t appreciate for a lot of reasons. but in cases where we do integrate, the resulting person is a combination of the alters who integrated, not a suppression or deletion of one of them. amazigirl’s skills would not be lost to amber (not to mention the integrated person might not be AG /or/ amber).
also, even in cases of integration, stress and trauma can cause a system to re-split. once you’re a system you always have the potential to split new alters or to re-split after integration, it has to do with an instabililty of ones sense of self caused by extended childhood trauma. so even if she appeared “cured” it def wouldn’t be that simple.
Regalli
Yeah, I figure if integration IS on the table here it’s probably at a point years in the future in-universe as well, so as far as the comic’s concerned we’re never going to see it.
Needfuldoer
Thank you both for your input!
Regalli
I’ll note here I’m not DID myself, just autistic and with a really good memory for things other people have said in the comments over the years! But hey, if that memory and my ability to write a hugeass thesis comment is helpful to those of you who are systems so you don’t have to spend spoons explaining it, I am happy to do so. (And if not, let me know and I’ll get out of your way!)
Needfuldoer
Not DID either, just trying to learn some of this stuff.
clif
“harmonious coexistence is probably the best, most realistic end goal.”
So since she has achieved this on her own, there is nothing more to be gained by seeking help? Not sure I buy that.
rose
theres a LOT more to functioning well as a system than just liking each other. she decided to me friends with AG but there’s still a lot more unmanaged stuff about their system, communication isn’t as easy as just saying you’re gonna communicate. also, she still needs tons of help for her trauma
I don’t know Yumi. As much as Amber is responsible for being proactive in her mental health I also feel like her support system failed her. The fact this is only being brought up now after shit hit the fan and someones is in a coma is a big yikes for all of them.
Jamie
Both components of her support system are right here, not coincidentally.
clif
But we could always blame Ethan for things he didn’t know. We have Danny as precedent.
Yumi
Sure. I wasn’t saying anything against that, and your comment talked about Amber making a conscious decision. “How far did things have to go before someone supported Amber in getting help” is a different conversation.
Puckish Rogue
You mean like people indulging in her fantasy that Amazi-Girl is a separate individual, yeah I get that
Sirksome
I’m not sure how much of a fantasy it is if AG can withold memories from Amber. I don’t kmow the intricacies of dissassociation but that at least feels pretty tangible proof that AG is something seperate from Amber.
Regalli
Yeah, uh.
Amber demonstrably cannot control, singlehandedly, that she and AG weren’t sharing memories. If she could, that would have happened WEEKS ago. At the very least some point before Brain Ghost Mike had to actually manifest, when her subconscious was putting up ‘MIKE’s everywhere. And she STILL didn’t realize something had actually happened to him until the next morning.
If a part of your brain acts independently of you, is capable of communicating with you as a separate entity, and actively has a set of memories you do not, and vice versa (remember, AG didn’t realize Amber and Walky were becoming a thing either,) what else are you supposed to call them but a separate individual?
Puckish Rogue
You can think anything you like, you can believe anything you want but it’s still just one person and it’s not helped by people reinforcing the notion
Bathymetheus
You clearly believe what you want to believe.
May I suggest that just because you have never experienced something does not mean it does not exist.
Puckish Rogue
I’m not denying Amber may have DID, I’m saying that actively encouraging Amber in her delusion and not encouraging her to seek help is harmful
IE the first time someone saw Amber in a superhero suit would have been a good time to start talking to her about getting help (Dorothy)
Uly
And where, exactly, did you get your degree in psychiatry?
Fogel
Like two distinct [apps] running on the same physical [platform]?
motorfirebox
Memory loss and apparent separate personalities are pretty much textbook DID. There’s a debate to be had about what type, but the general diagnosis isn’t in question at this point.
Mopey
I think the point was that few truly challenged Amber on the matter but rather just played along. Even after realizing it may be a personality split and not just a cute superhero affectation.
Also, I’m not really sure it makes sense to talk about “textbook” DID. It’s an often reclassified and still a pretty controversial diagnosis with a lot of experts still suggesting it’s really just an offshoot of some other mental disability.
144 thoughts on “Splitting”
Ana Chronistic
Joyce used Explosion!
It was super effective!
In all the wrong ways!
Mra
Joyce used double kick
Joyce’s attack missed!
Chris
Joyce used Flail. It’s not very effective.
Ana Chronistic
I feel like Thrash was more likely
Cmasta1992
Normal type moves can’t be super effective!
Sharks
*pushes up glasses* well ACTUALLY, if an Alolan Golem with its hidden ability used Explosion against a water or flying Pokemon, it would be super effective.
Shen Hibiki
Joyce is many things. “Normal” is not one of them XD
RANdom
Do you suppose she’s a Fairy type?
Regalli
I mean… She is a friend of Dorothy.
(I could see her as at least part-Fighting Type for sure, though. Punches AND focus on honor.)
Deanatay
Wait… Joyce… can punch MORE than just DADS??
o_0
Rosicrucian
Joyce wears the Keds of justice, but it’s indiscriminate justice.
I don't know my name anymore.
Joyce actually wears steel toed shoes. It’s a tightly guarded secret. She almost swore at her nightstand in the middle of the night. Once.
Bicycle Bill
Joyce is seen mostly in boots.
She wears the Uggs of Justice.
nobodybasically
But when will she be strong enough to tell Ethan that Faz was involved?
Opus the Poet
Speaking of whom, did anybody get Faz off the curb?
Yumi
He lives there now.
anonymousethatscurriesinthedarkness
The only ones who notice him as the dogs looking for a fire hydrant and they avoid him.
Koms
That smile would give even dogs nightmares
OtterBoy1
Jeepers!
Nono
I’m surprised Ethan’s stomach hasn’t curdled yet from all the guilty whiplash he’s been having.
Miri
I kinda love that Blaine didn’t manage to land a single blow hard enough to leave an ouchy, when Joyce flailing did 😀
Also hooray for taking responsibility and committing to getting some help! Good girl, Amber!
Doctor_Who
Blaine is likely a pretty low level goon in the mob. Like, maybe level 5. His challenge rating is correspondingly low.
Amber’s at least a 10th level multiclass Vigilante/Nerd, and Joyce at least a 10th level Goody-Two-Shoes, so it makes sense she’s be able to land a blow.
Regalli
Blaine’s a money-launderer, too. None of his points are actually in taking a hit.
Jamie
This deserves an internet. Do we still give those out, or am I just old now.
Regalli
Dunno, but if you are, I am too.
Mmm, internet.
anonymousethatscurriesinthedarkness
KOSH “Yes”
butts
No, no, see, you’re in the wrong genre. Blaine only appeared to be the ruler of the League of Evil Dads, but the ease of his defeat proves that he was only the puppet of the true final boss. The evil dad above all others, who had yet to reveal himself… hidden in plain sight all this time, now to emerge from the shadows at last. A true master of stealth… just like his progeny.
THAT’S RIGHT RYOU SARUYAMA DUMBING OF AGE TRUE FINAL BOSS
clif
Nonsense. His strings are being pulled by the Head Alien, who is in turn an unknowing tool of the Soggies, which are, in turn, mere pawns of the Anti-Cheese.
Roborat
It’s assholes all the way down.
Stephen Bierce
I am stuck on Band-Aids/’Cause Band-Aid’s stuck on me…
Lexi
You know, I really do wonder what happened between “Joyce leaps at Blaine” and “Blaine bursts out the door holding an unconscious Joyce”. We now know Joyce managed to kick Amber in the face, but it always felt like there was a strip missing in there.
Keulen
Somehow I completely missed that Amber had an injured spot on her face after that strip but not before it until just now.
Lexi
I saw the injury but I actually had thought it was a sign of just HOW TIRED Amber was at that point. I actually went back to figure out that yup, it appeared in that strip.
pjeseb
Remember kids, friendly fire isn’t.
Jamie
I watched Howl’s Moving Castle recently, though.
clif
Work of art on multiple levels.
Rose by Any Other Name
Unless you’re in Stilwater. Then the clerks are very friendly.
anonymousethatscurriesinthedarkness
Maxim 15. Only you can prevent friendly fire.
Opus the Poet
I wish I could remember the number of the maxim that says friendly fire and ship’s mess should be easier to tell apart. I do know it’s one of the early ones.
Also, holy crow Taylor has been doing that comic almost as long as web comics were a thing.
clif
The main line plot would go, Amber is cured, a situation happens where the world needs Amazigirl, there is no Amazigirl. But this is Wiilis, so I dunno.
King Daniel
Preeetty sure DID isn’t something that you “cure”.
Council
It’s not.
The term is very iffy for the solutions available, at least, when not outright misleading.
Nono
“Managed” might a better word, I think?
clif
Perhaps not, but I’m betting that few health professionals are going to believe that crime-fighting vigilante is not something that needs to be cured. If you take away the defining characteristics of Amazigirl, is she still Amazigirl?
King Daniel
Vigilantism is illegal, but it isn’t a mental illness. It isn’t something to “cure”.
rose
yeah, using the word “cure” for DID is very shitty, thanks
Regalli
I doubt this is leading up to a straightforward cure. First, because Willis only started actively writing AmbG as a system after deciding there were ways to do so that DIDN’T play as much into deeply inaccurate and dangerous tropes about DID (in particular the Violent Scary Evil Personality, but ‘easily and permanently Cured Into Being Neurotypical’ would probably also count, based off what commenters with firsthand knowledge have said.)
Second, we’ve seen a relatively close analogue with Ruth, who’s doing WAY THE FUCK BETTER with the wonders of antidepressants but is still working to break the shitty thought patterns depression (and Sir) produced. (And is also pretty sure she’ll be on antidepressants for years if not ever, because it’s likely chronic. Speaking from experience, even on functioning meds there are still episodes of relapsing depression.) Antidepressants and anxiety meds would probably help a lot with the non-DID issues, but at the end of the day they are not neurotypical and will not be. AG’s still going to be around sharing Amber’s body because she’s not just the costume that can be put away. And Amber getting to a healthy place after All This Trauma And Self-Loathing would take actual years, in-universe. Assuming a DID-supportive therapist in the first place, which is IN NO WAY A GIVEN. There’s still a genuine question in the Psychologist Community (TM)* about whether or not DID actually EXISTS, and the stance of those that do is still largely… Outdated, shall we say. Bad therapists and doctors can Fuck You Up. (I have relatively tame examples, like ‘the endocrinologist I still remember five years later not because she missed a significant B12 deficiency, but because she and her PA spent forty minutes berating me about how the issue was clearly something that they admitted could not be causing my symptoms.’ The deficiency is long fixed, but I STILL don’t feel comfortable seeing a doctor for the first time alone. This doctor was NOT insisting they knew my brain better than I did and in a position to actively recommend ‘treatments’ that would be counterindicated.)
Third, I’m pretty sure Willis knows well enough about the lasting effects of trauma and how to write them with care and nuance. For previous examples, see Dumbing Of Age, September 10, 2010 to present.
* The Psychologist Community, particularly with regards to certain forms of neurodivergence, often fails to seek input from said neurodivergent people they’re studying. Spectacularly.
Needfuldoer
Yeah. I’m not a mental health professional at all, but from what I understand of DID cases like Amber’s, harmonious coexistence is probably the best, most realistic end goal.
I’d guess successful treatment might look more like couples’ therapy than an attempt to suppress alters.
elsendor
sometimes we can integrate, and a lot of psychologists treat integration as the “cure” or the ideal outcome, which a lot of us systems don’t appreciate for a lot of reasons. but in cases where we do integrate, the resulting person is a combination of the alters who integrated, not a suppression or deletion of one of them. amazigirl’s skills would not be lost to amber (not to mention the integrated person might not be AG /or/ amber).
also, even in cases of integration, stress and trauma can cause a system to re-split. once you’re a system you always have the potential to split new alters or to re-split after integration, it has to do with an instabililty of ones sense of self caused by extended childhood trauma. so even if she appeared “cured” it def wouldn’t be that simple.
Regalli
Yeah, I figure if integration IS on the table here it’s probably at a point years in the future in-universe as well, so as far as the comic’s concerned we’re never going to see it.
Needfuldoer
Thank you both for your input!
Regalli
I’ll note here I’m not DID myself, just autistic and with a really good memory for things other people have said in the comments over the years! But hey, if that memory and my ability to write a hugeass thesis comment is helpful to those of you who are systems so you don’t have to spend spoons explaining it, I am happy to do so. (And if not, let me know and I’ll get out of your way!)
Needfuldoer
Not DID either, just trying to learn some of this stuff.
clif
“harmonious coexistence is probably the best, most realistic end goal.”
So since she has achieved this on her own, there is nothing more to be gained by seeking help? Not sure I buy that.
rose
theres a LOT more to functioning well as a system than just liking each other. she decided to me friends with AG but there’s still a lot more unmanaged stuff about their system, communication isn’t as easy as just saying you’re gonna communicate. also, she still needs tons of help for her trauma
rose
this was all really well said, agreed with everything here!
Sirksome
Finally! Geez! How far did this have to go before Amber made a conscious decision that she needed help?!
Yumi
Amber didn’t believe she could be helped/didn’t believe she desvered help a lot of the time.
Sirksome
I don’t know Yumi. As much as Amber is responsible for being proactive in her mental health I also feel like her support system failed her. The fact this is only being brought up now after shit hit the fan and someones is in a coma is a big yikes for all of them.
Jamie
Both components of her support system are right here, not coincidentally.
clif
But we could always blame Ethan for things he didn’t know. We have Danny as precedent.
Yumi
Sure. I wasn’t saying anything against that, and your comment talked about Amber making a conscious decision. “How far did things have to go before someone supported Amber in getting help” is a different conversation.
Puckish Rogue
You mean like people indulging in her fantasy that Amazi-Girl is a separate individual, yeah I get that
Sirksome
I’m not sure how much of a fantasy it is if AG can withold memories from Amber. I don’t kmow the intricacies of dissassociation but that at least feels pretty tangible proof that AG is something seperate from Amber.
Regalli
Yeah, uh.
Amber demonstrably cannot control, singlehandedly, that she and AG weren’t sharing memories. If she could, that would have happened WEEKS ago. At the very least some point before Brain Ghost Mike had to actually manifest, when her subconscious was putting up ‘MIKE’s everywhere. And she STILL didn’t realize something had actually happened to him until the next morning.
If a part of your brain acts independently of you, is capable of communicating with you as a separate entity, and actively has a set of memories you do not, and vice versa (remember, AG didn’t realize Amber and Walky were becoming a thing either,) what else are you supposed to call them but a separate individual?
Puckish Rogue
You can think anything you like, you can believe anything you want but it’s still just one person and it’s not helped by people reinforcing the notion
Bathymetheus
You clearly believe what you want to believe.
May I suggest that just because you have never experienced something does not mean it does not exist.
Puckish Rogue
I’m not denying Amber may have DID, I’m saying that actively encouraging Amber in her delusion and not encouraging her to seek help is harmful
IE the first time someone saw Amber in a superhero suit would have been a good time to start talking to her about getting help (Dorothy)
Uly
And where, exactly, did you get your degree in psychiatry?
Fogel
Like two distinct [apps] running on the same physical [platform]?
motorfirebox
Memory loss and apparent separate personalities are pretty much textbook DID. There’s a debate to be had about what type, but the general diagnosis isn’t in question at this point.
Mopey
I think the point was that few truly challenged Amber on the matter but rather just played along. Even after realizing it may be a personality split and not just a cute superhero affectation.
Also, I’m not really sure it makes sense to talk about “textbook” DID. It’s an often reclassified and still a pretty controversial diagnosis with a lot of experts still suggesting it’s really just an offshoot of some other mental disability.