In the not too distant future
In 2020
There was a prof named Robin
Rather different from you or me
She worked in the House of Reps (U.S.)
Just another face wearing fancy dress
She did a crap job voting for the right
But her constituents were angry and she fucked off in the ni-ight…
We’ll put her in the classroom
The wost we can find (that mural!)
She’ll have to stand and lecture them
And we’ll blow all of their minds
Now mind you Robin can’t control
If her antics hit the skids
Because she used this bullshit stunt
To shake up all these kids
STUDENT ROLL CALL
Joyce Brown (drift left!)
Becky! (likes girls!)
Dot Keener (hi Ms. Prez!)
Roooooooz (I’m the progressive!)
If you’re wondering how she has the stuff
To teach poli-sci facts (la la la)
Then repeat to yourself it’s webcomics
I should really just relax
It’s a reference to Mystery Science Theater 3000. You can see the newer version on Netflix or some of the older episodes on its YouTube channel or on their Twitch channel.
The original gas goes something like this:
Those as can do.
Those as can’t teach.
Those as can’t teach teach teachers.
Andrew Weil
When I was in school, the last line was “Those who can’t teach, teach PE”. I’ve also heard “Those who can’t teach become school administrators”, which in my experience isn’t far from the truth.
Likewise.
It both devalues teachers and implies that you can’t both “do” and “teach” at the same time which is entirely absurd.
CC
I agree with the sentiment in theory, but (at least in STEM classes and outside of private unis) teachers aren’t paid nearly enough, so every professor is either retired and slowly going senile or was too incompetent or too much of a jackass to keep a job in the field. I don’t think it’s universal (and I don’t even know if it applies in this specific case), but it’s not 100% unfounded
CC
(forgot the important part of that “but” – for most fields, including basically every STEM and especially at public uni, teaching is literally the least paying job in the entire field)
SeanR
Likely also the most portable. If you want to be a geologist, you probably need to live where the mines and oilfields are. If you want to be a geology teacher, there are lots of schools to choose from.
CC
True enough, though that’s not as relevant outside of physical sciences and anything anthropology-adjacent.
(Personally, I’m in a computer-focused field less than half an hour from a tech-heavy city, and I’ve never had a professor I’d rate above a 4/10 on Being A Teacher. I can’t actually prove proximity correlates inversely with competence, but it wouldn’t surprise me!)
drs
Eh, that depends. Oil consumes most geologists, sure. Physicists have national lab options, also Wall Street if they want to take their math/experiment skills there, physicists and chemists have a bunch of corporate options. Software had a fair range of options and even now after covid.
Meanwhile professorships may have a range of options but a lot less choice, unless you’re a superstar that multiple places bid on. You go whereever offers you a chance at tenure, and if you get tenure you *stay there*. Making married couples of academics really fun, the “two body problem” of finding a college or city where both of you can find suitable jobs.
Andrew Weil
Or maybe they aren’t motivated solely by money. (This might not apply if teaching doesn’t even pay a living wage, but in many countries, people become teacher not because they can’t get higher paying jobs, but because teaching is their vocation.)
Odditude
There is a teaching demand for STEM professors, at least in natural sciences. If you want the title, and want to be a leader of your own research group, you need to teach.
If you are done having your own research group you can still teach until your retirement, which is nicer. Academia is stressful, at least in natural sciences (it is the only place I have experiences)
BarerMender
But had there not been a particle of truth in it, it hadn’t caught on.
Or should I have said, “wouldn’t have caught on?” I guess the “if” clause sets up a condition, so I should use the conditional.
I enjoy talking shit about Robin, she usually deserves it, but I’m kinda with you on that. I don’t know what disgruntled peaked-in-high-school former football player came up with that, but have you ever tried to learn something from a person who cannot execute that thing? Try learning how to make pancakes from someone who can’t make pancakes, I dare you.
drs
Anyone who’s suffered through a math class taught by the gym teacher knows that sometimes, people who can’t do the thing *do* end up teaching the thing. There’s the ideal world, and then there’s real school systems.
There’s also that for a bunch of technical subjects, if you’re good at doing it then you can make a lot more money for less aggravation by doing it than by being a public school teacher.
Of course in college you have professors who supposed to be good at doing it, and teaching… whether they’re any good at teaching is an entirely different matter.
CC
Agreed. There’s a gradient of majors that goes from “there’s basically no applicable jobs with the major, so teaching is competitive because it’s the only reliable paycheck that’s not retail” on one end to “every single job that’s even slightly degree-relevant pays more than a public uni adjunct professor position, so only the people who can’t get or keep a job literally anywhere else take it”, with an extra heaping helping of “they don’t teach professors how to teach, so almost no one outside the education major knows how to actually do it” spread across the entire spectrum.
drs
There’s also “I spent my life doing this, now I’m retired and can teach”. But they won’t have gone through education school for elementary/high school teach, by default.
CC
Plus, you wanna guess the overlap between “old and slowly going senile retirees” and “extremely competitive teaching position”?
Clif
*Of course in college you have professors who supposed to be good at doing it, and teaching *
Where in the world did you get that idea? In college you have professors who are supposed to be good at research, getting published, and getting grants. Teaching is kind of an afterthought, essential but not something you want to let get in the way of the important stuff.
crow
But considering how many lies American students end up “knowing” about history, and the fact that at least in my rural school, an unqualified PE teacher could become a science teacher, I can see how people would lose their faith in teachers actually knowing what they’re talking about.
It has truth to it. It doesn’t mean all teachers are shit. It means if you are not good enough for a competitive job you can usually find a teaching job instead.
As someone who works part-time in academia, I see that most academic personnel view it as an easy gig that pays good money. Sure it’s easy if you don’t spend any effort. And it’s good money if you aren’t actually qualified for a competitive job.
I know many teachers who work hard and do it because they love it. Those are not the people we are talking about here.
Also there is a notion of respect towards professors amongst students. Like “oh wow he’s a professor, he must be an expert on the field”. No, people become professors by coauthoring a bunch of abstract papers for 10 years while detaching themselves from the industry. Their title says nothing about their knowledge of the course they are teaching you. Chances are.
I’m not trying to offend teachers or anybody. I was just kind of noting that it’s the cliche that’s happening here. Robin can no longer be a politician so she’s teaching a political science class. I thought it was a decent observation to make. My apologies.
UrsulaDavina
It’s made worse beacuse most people who teach political science have no desire to become politicians.
Sirksome
I honestly didn’t think my comment would be so negatively recieved especially since it’s a common saying. I thought it applied to this situation but now I regret typing it and would delete it if I could.
Fiddler115
I am a retired teacher. My wife has been a teacher for 20 years. I have tons of friends who are teachers. Believe me, Sirksome, you did nothing wrong. It’s a very common saying. It was completely appropriate to today’s strip. I took zero offense, and, frankly, I doubt many other teachers would feel much differently. We’ve all heard plenty of actually offensive comments over our time teaching. I feel like this comment section takes offense to some pretty innocuous statements sometimes when they should save their ire for the comments that are intentionally over the line. I fully expect for people to respond about how offensive my statements just were.
crow
I’m not sure whether people are offended that Sirksome said this, or just saw an opportunity to talk about a long-held pet peeve of theirs.
Clif
I’m offended you would take back the comment.
Well, not really. It’s one of those comments that isn’t really true, but contains enough truth to hurt.
UrsulaDavina
I am sorry if made you feel bad about it. Its not a big deal so don’t feel to bad about it. There doesn’t appear to be any malicious intent here.
Sirksome
It was just a shock. It’s like if I typed “All’s well that ends well” and then someone replied “Well my father died falling into a well! Not everything actually ends well!”. I’d feel kind of bad about that. Like I did for this. But I’m not putting that on you or anyone else. It was just a mistake on my end.
Clif
World War II ended well. Unless your loved one died on the beaches of Normandy or you lived in Hiroshima. There’s being a decent human being who respects others and there’s “screw em if they can’t take a joke.” And there’s also a reasonable course to be laid between the two. There will always people who will take offense at anything you say. There will always be some good people who are hurt be anything you say. Saying nothing is a terrible solution. So accept the fact that you can’t win and move on.
emusam
Robin was a successful politician because she was incompetent. Her supporters were able to prop her up and make her an exciting mouthpiece for their goals. She’s out because she started to care about something other than pleasing her party. She could have continued being bad at politics.
She’s not out because she lost. She’s out because she wanted to vote for her opponent for Becky’s sake.
The flip side to that old phrase is that even if you can do it, doesn’t mean you can teach it. I’ve had classes taught by top research professors who obviously knew their shit, but had no idea how to convey even the basics to undergrads.
Some go into university academia because they can’t cut in the real world, I suppose. Some because they do love the teaching side. But for others they’re there for the pure research and teaching is just something they have to do to keep the research position.
320 thoughts on “Rondeau”
Ana Chronistic
In the not too distant future
In 2020
There was a prof named Robin
Rather different from you or me
She worked in the House of Reps (U.S.)
Just another face wearing fancy dress
She did a crap job voting for the right
But her constituents were angry and she fucked off in the ni-ight…
We’ll put her in the classroom
The wost we can find (that mural!)
She’ll have to stand and lecture them
And we’ll blow all of their minds
Now mind you Robin can’t control
If her antics hit the skids
Because she used this bullshit stunt
To shake up all these kids
STUDENT ROLL CALL
Joyce Brown (drift left!)
Becky! (likes girls!)
Dot Keener (hi Ms. Prez!)
Roooooooz (I’m the progressive!)
If you’re wondering how she has the stuff
To teach poli-sci facts (la la la)
Then repeat to yourself it’s webcomics
I should really just relax
For Political Science 9000…
monica
*slow clap*
brilliant!
Doctor_Who
It st- actually that was fantastic.
Rose by Any Other Name
**falls to my knees**
I’m not worthy!
I’m not worthy!
Further Wanes World References!
Moon
ok this and the strip itself gave me a much needed laugh, thanks ?
Cholma
LOl! I was just going to post “We’ve got DRAMA SIGN!” but yours is MUCH better. Same ref, but yours is a direct hit.
Doom Shepherd
And came up with the entire jingle in 5 minutes, you are my new god (minor, household. Enjoy the sacrificial chocolate.)
Cholma
Actually, if you’re a Patreon follower of the All-Powerful Willis, you too could have 24 hours to come up with the perfect comment! 🙂
Kensou
Best part is today’s Word of God confirmation that her pipe is a silly pipe.
Merbrat
Needs bubbles.
Tandel
*furious applause* citizenkane.gif
nightshade
that was mighty…….
Jon Rich
I don’t even know what that is supposed to be a reference to, and I think it was incredible. You have my admiration.
NotPiffany
It’s a reference to Mystery Science Theater 3000. You can see the newer version on Netflix or some of the older episodes on its YouTube channel or on their Twitch channel.
J
I love their “Every Country has a Monster” rap.
Prime_pm
I fucking love you.
goggleman64
I sang this to myself and loved it
AbelUndercity
(Wipes away a tear)
That was bee-yoo-tiful…
Ryek Hvek
that was loverly
Needfuldoer
YES! YES! YES!
(Read that in either M. Bison’s voice, or Mr. Regular’s voice.)
Deanatay
That. Was. Amazing.
Of course, I love parodies, so I may be biased.
You left a word out, though, at the end.
Political Science Theater 9000!
Cuz it’s gonna be Theater, no doubt.
Ana Chronistic
She said Political Science 9000!
FacelessDeviant
This warrants an impressed nod with the corners of my mouth down and my eyebrows up. Several nods, even.
Robert
I’m late to the party, but hokey smokes that rocked great big rocks.
Keith Curtis
Brilliant work. Take a Grammy out of petty cash.
J
Superb. Perfect for this theater (webcomic) of a theater (classroom) of theaters of war (among other topics).
Doctor_Who
I thought that lady who showed up at my last garage sale looked familiar.
JetstreamGW
Pfftahahahahahahahahahahaha
Sirksome
Those who can’t do teach I guess.
tim gueguen
But what do those who can’t do, and who can’t teach, do?
Sirksome
They teach too which actually brings us to Robin’s first lesson plan. “Grifting 101”
Rainhat
Administration.
Axel
teach gym
drs
Punditry and talk radio.
BarerMender
The original gas goes something like this:
Those as can do.
Those as can’t teach.
Those as can’t teach teach teachers.
Andrew Weil
When I was in school, the last line was “Those who can’t teach, teach PE”. I’ve also heard “Those who can’t teach become school administrators”, which in my experience isn’t far from the truth.
OBBWG
Matt Goerning has the best answer do.
OBBWG
Okay, that doesn’t seem to have worked. The link is https://emy2.tripod.com/Humor/cando.html
Durandal_1707
God I hate this cliché
Jaime
THANK YOU!
Rose by Any Other Name
Likewise.
It both devalues teachers and implies that you can’t both “do” and “teach” at the same time which is entirely absurd.
CC
I agree with the sentiment in theory, but (at least in STEM classes and outside of private unis) teachers aren’t paid nearly enough, so every professor is either retired and slowly going senile or was too incompetent or too much of a jackass to keep a job in the field. I don’t think it’s universal (and I don’t even know if it applies in this specific case), but it’s not 100% unfounded
CC
(forgot the important part of that “but” – for most fields, including basically every STEM and especially at public uni, teaching is literally the least paying job in the entire field)
SeanR
Likely also the most portable. If you want to be a geologist, you probably need to live where the mines and oilfields are. If you want to be a geology teacher, there are lots of schools to choose from.
CC
True enough, though that’s not as relevant outside of physical sciences and anything anthropology-adjacent.
(Personally, I’m in a computer-focused field less than half an hour from a tech-heavy city, and I’ve never had a professor I’d rate above a 4/10 on Being A Teacher. I can’t actually prove proximity correlates inversely with competence, but it wouldn’t surprise me!)
drs
Eh, that depends. Oil consumes most geologists, sure. Physicists have national lab options, also Wall Street if they want to take their math/experiment skills there, physicists and chemists have a bunch of corporate options. Software had a fair range of options and even now after covid.
Meanwhile professorships may have a range of options but a lot less choice, unless you’re a superstar that multiple places bid on. You go whereever offers you a chance at tenure, and if you get tenure you *stay there*. Making married couples of academics really fun, the “two body problem” of finding a college or city where both of you can find suitable jobs.
Andrew Weil
Or maybe they aren’t motivated solely by money. (This might not apply if teaching doesn’t even pay a living wage, but in many countries, people become teacher not because they can’t get higher paying jobs, but because teaching is their vocation.)
Odditude
There is a teaching demand for STEM professors, at least in natural sciences. If you want the title, and want to be a leader of your own research group, you need to teach.
If you are done having your own research group you can still teach until your retirement, which is nicer. Academia is stressful, at least in natural sciences (it is the only place I have experiences)
BarerMender
But had there not been a particle of truth in it, it hadn’t caught on.
Or should I have said, “wouldn’t have caught on?” I guess the “if” clause sets up a condition, so I should use the conditional.
Schpoonman
I enjoy talking shit about Robin, she usually deserves it, but I’m kinda with you on that. I don’t know what disgruntled peaked-in-high-school former football player came up with that, but have you ever tried to learn something from a person who cannot execute that thing? Try learning how to make pancakes from someone who can’t make pancakes, I dare you.
drs
Anyone who’s suffered through a math class taught by the gym teacher knows that sometimes, people who can’t do the thing *do* end up teaching the thing. There’s the ideal world, and then there’s real school systems.
There’s also that for a bunch of technical subjects, if you’re good at doing it then you can make a lot more money for less aggravation by doing it than by being a public school teacher.
Of course in college you have professors who supposed to be good at doing it, and teaching… whether they’re any good at teaching is an entirely different matter.
CC
Agreed. There’s a gradient of majors that goes from “there’s basically no applicable jobs with the major, so teaching is competitive because it’s the only reliable paycheck that’s not retail” on one end to “every single job that’s even slightly degree-relevant pays more than a public uni adjunct professor position, so only the people who can’t get or keep a job literally anywhere else take it”, with an extra heaping helping of “they don’t teach professors how to teach, so almost no one outside the education major knows how to actually do it” spread across the entire spectrum.
drs
There’s also “I spent my life doing this, now I’m retired and can teach”. But they won’t have gone through education school for elementary/high school teach, by default.
CC
Plus, you wanna guess the overlap between “old and slowly going senile retirees” and “extremely competitive teaching position”?
Clif
*Of course in college you have professors who supposed to be good at doing it, and teaching *
Where in the world did you get that idea? In college you have professors who are supposed to be good at research, getting published, and getting grants. Teaching is kind of an afterthought, essential but not something you want to let get in the way of the important stuff.
crow
But considering how many lies American students end up “knowing” about history, and the fact that at least in my rural school, an unqualified PE teacher could become a science teacher, I can see how people would lose their faith in teachers actually knowing what they’re talking about.
UrsulaDavina
It comes from George Bernard Shaw’s 1905 play Man and Superman.
I to hate this phrase
Ob
It has truth to it. It doesn’t mean all teachers are shit. It means if you are not good enough for a competitive job you can usually find a teaching job instead.
As someone who works part-time in academia, I see that most academic personnel view it as an easy gig that pays good money. Sure it’s easy if you don’t spend any effort. And it’s good money if you aren’t actually qualified for a competitive job.
I know many teachers who work hard and do it because they love it. Those are not the people we are talking about here.
Also there is a notion of respect towards professors amongst students. Like “oh wow he’s a professor, he must be an expert on the field”. No, people become professors by coauthoring a bunch of abstract papers for 10 years while detaching themselves from the industry. Their title says nothing about their knowledge of the course they are teaching you. Chances are.
Chronos
same
plasticwrap
I find this expression so offensive. Teachers are a pillar of the community and this just undermines everything they do.
Sirksome
I’m not trying to offend teachers or anybody. I was just kind of noting that it’s the cliche that’s happening here. Robin can no longer be a politician so she’s teaching a political science class. I thought it was a decent observation to make. My apologies.
UrsulaDavina
It’s made worse beacuse most people who teach political science have no desire to become politicians.
Sirksome
I honestly didn’t think my comment would be so negatively recieved especially since it’s a common saying. I thought it applied to this situation but now I regret typing it and would delete it if I could.
Fiddler115
I am a retired teacher. My wife has been a teacher for 20 years. I have tons of friends who are teachers. Believe me, Sirksome, you did nothing wrong. It’s a very common saying. It was completely appropriate to today’s strip. I took zero offense, and, frankly, I doubt many other teachers would feel much differently. We’ve all heard plenty of actually offensive comments over our time teaching. I feel like this comment section takes offense to some pretty innocuous statements sometimes when they should save their ire for the comments that are intentionally over the line. I fully expect for people to respond about how offensive my statements just were.
crow
I’m not sure whether people are offended that Sirksome said this, or just saw an opportunity to talk about a long-held pet peeve of theirs.
Clif
I’m offended you would take back the comment.
Well, not really. It’s one of those comments that isn’t really true, but contains enough truth to hurt.
UrsulaDavina
I am sorry if made you feel bad about it. Its not a big deal so don’t feel to bad about it. There doesn’t appear to be any malicious intent here.
Sirksome
It was just a shock. It’s like if I typed “All’s well that ends well” and then someone replied “Well my father died falling into a well! Not everything actually ends well!”. I’d feel kind of bad about that. Like I did for this. But I’m not putting that on you or anyone else. It was just a mistake on my end.
Clif
World War II ended well. Unless your loved one died on the beaches of Normandy or you lived in Hiroshima. There’s being a decent human being who respects others and there’s “screw em if they can’t take a joke.” And there’s also a reasonable course to be laid between the two. There will always people who will take offense at anything you say. There will always be some good people who are hurt be anything you say. Saying nothing is a terrible solution. So accept the fact that you can’t win and move on.
emusam
Robin was a successful politician because she was incompetent. Her supporters were able to prop her up and make her an exciting mouthpiece for their goals. She’s out because she started to care about something other than pleasing her party. She could have continued being bad at politics.
She’s not out because she lost. She’s out because she wanted to vote for her opponent for Becky’s sake.
ReFlex76
Teaching *is* doing.
UrsulaDavina
“Those who know do, those who understand teach”
Aristotle
thejeff
The flip side to that old phrase is that even if you can do it, doesn’t mean you can teach it. I’ve had classes taught by top research professors who obviously knew their shit, but had no idea how to convey even the basics to undergrads.
Some go into university academia because they can’t cut in the real world, I suppose. Some because they do love the teaching side. But for others they’re there for the pure research and teaching is just something they have to do to keep the research position.
Ana Chronistic
I understand a lot of things, but the connections I have to make to understand it myself are impenetrable to anyone else
Teaching is the worst for me, ESPECIALLY bc anxiety ?? but also bc I hate repeating myself and I want to move on to something else
Proto_Eevee