Joe said he would be bi if he got to bang more chick’s. With Joyce he was ready to be completely monogamous. By agreeing to be in a four way with Walky and Dorothy he will be bi and by doing so bang twice as many chick’s as before.
It wasn’t serious, but it was still gross. Even on its own, but even more as a deflection from not treating Carla as a woman and “not being mean” about Jocelyne.
Kind of hope we circle back to that at some point.
GreyICE
It was what?
My god the delicate flowers in these comments sections.
Sirksome
The story itself doesn’t frame Joe’s joking as a good thing. The reason we even like Joe now is because he developed as a character. Dismissing his flaws undercuts that. Like you can choose to ignore what the story is telling you I guess? But don’t fault if other’s comment because they might understand more than you.
Taffy
Like you, snowflake? Your username could use better capitalization, btw.
GreyICE
Gee, called a snowflake by someone who never read Neuromancer.
Does mommy know you’re reading webcomics with bad words in them?
Tan
As are we all. Serious people discussing the serious issues of the day.
Cooler heads failed yesterday. Today they MUST succeed at holding back from eachother until the relationship issue is sorted!Joyce IS aware that she’s cheating on Joe. If she can’t face that and fess up things are going to get so much worse.
Joyce STILL seems unwilling to give the situation the weight it deserves. She begrudging accepts to stop stabbing Joe in the back, after Dorothy bullies her into it.
If even Sarah couldn’t get through to her, I’m not sure who else could. I doubt Dorothy is up to the task.
I think Joyce, probably very reasonably, doesn’t feel like stroking Dorothy’s cheek is “stabbing Joe in the back.”
Elf grrl
Joyce making out with Dorothy and them trying to be all hush hush about it is cheating. Its a betrayal towards their already committed partners. Sarah aptly said it, the secrecy and tip toeing around the affair makes it much worse. The two even feel guilt from their new developing relationship.
Annaphylaxis
Oh, thanks, I didn’t realize that anyone was cheating, before now.
Soncnikralj
Well, yes! Welcome to the Comments Section, Grasshopper!
PumpkinCake
In a vacuum, Joyce stroking Dorothy’s cheek is not cheating.
But this isn’t happening in a vacuum. Joyce and Dorothy just cheated, and every bit of affection they display is a continuation of that cheating. Everything more they do makes it a bit more severe.
Dorothy correctly clocks that they need to pause. What’s done is done, but they can stop making it worse.
zee
I mean Joyce continuing to act like dots girlfriend while being Joe’s girlfriend is kinda stabbing him in the back yeah
God damn it I don’t even really give a shit about cheating. It’s bad and I’ll say damn fuck that dude if you tell me about it, but i roll my eyes when people say it’s the worst thing you can do to a partner without any qualifiers (eg. Worst non violent thing you can do). I didn’t care when my own ex cheated on me, it’s like the least bad thing he did to me. It’s just, really annoying when people insist on calling a spade a club or diamond when it’s so clearly a spade.
Tequila Mockingbird
I imagine for some, being cheated on is either the worst thing that has happened to them, or the worst thing they can imagine. The stuff that gets even worse I suspect people folks try to avoid thinking about… which isn’t really an option for folks who are fully aware of how bad it can get through first or second-hand experience.
thejeff
It’s not the worst thing you can do (and what they’ve done so far is far from the worst cheating can be), but it’s not far from the worst thing that you’re going to see in this kind of context. That doesn’t turn the character into an outright villain in most people’s eyes. That gets a large (majority?) portion of the commentariat excusing or condoning it.
That arguably is being portrayed positively and/or romantically in the comic itself.
Nymph
I disagree that it’s being portrayed positively given the instant pushback they’ve gotten from Sarah and Danny’s pontification on how you’d have to be an awful terrible person to ever do this.
I think Willis is portraying that Dorothy and Joyce both think this is positive, which makes sense, but I’m not seeing a lot of it outside their opinions (other than the framing of the original kiss, which I think was just always going to be dramatic and romantic no matter what).
thejeff
I said “arguably”, but I’m not really interested in arguing it.
Some people see it that way. Others, like you, obviously don’t.
Nymph
Wasn’t an argument, just discussing opinions in the opinion discussing forum?
I very much read it as Joyce being partially swept up in the honeymoon phase of a new relationship and partially Joyce avoiding thinking about the situation seriously because the moment she really DOES let herself face the reality of it she’s gonna collapse like a house of cards, girl is currently running on honeymoon phase and inertia, and the moment she stops and processes things she’s NOT gonna be in a good place about everything
Of course I’m only speculating, but Joyce doesn’t really seem to think Joe is going to really be upset. Maybe not even surprised. She’s probably assuming they’ll easily come to some sort of arrangement.
After all, she saw how Dorothy and Walky got back together even after Dorothy already broke up with him once. So why couldn’t she and Joe remain good friends?
I think that might be her mindset.
Big Z
See, I don’t even know that I think Joyce is thinking it through that hard — most of what she’s doing seems to be following the same basic script of “well, we’re in Twue Wuv, so that makes anything we do all right”, whether consciously or unconsciously.
Erica
I don’t think she’s even thinking about Joe, other than the moment yesterday when she in the room with him.
Lumino
Joyce is struggling with object permanence.
Adeptus
Object permanence is exactly right. She has turned into an impulse driven baby.
I think it’s more that she’s still hopped up on romcom brain and averting her gaze from the issue. I think I drew the comparison before but it’s like how in sinbad, Sinbad fucks his best friend’s wife and the dude is just written to be chill with it bc true love. Joyce thinks she’s in Sinbad, she’s not.
Big Z
Amplified, possibly, by legacy fundie brainworms — the only relationships one is allowed to be in are ones with the express purpose of going directly to marriage, do not pass go, do not date around. A surprisingly large number of ex-fundies of my acquaintance seem to have that change into “whatever relationship I’m currently in now is my only valid relationship ever, and I will go full steam ahead in it”.
Nah, they don’t have to do anything. And how is it going to make things worse? Are Joe and Walky going to be cool with everything they did yesterday and last night, but emotionally wrecked by some cheek stroking this morning? That die is cast, one way or another, and a little extra affection between these two isn’t going to make a difference.
Your position appears to be that Dorothy and Joyce hold no obligation whatsoever to act considerately towards the people in their lives that they care about. That’s a position one can hold, but it’s not one likely to endear them to anyone.
Big Z
I’m reading it as more of “it doesn’t matter how much more they do, nothing will make it worse than the initial cheating” — which isn’t a completely invalid position, even if I don’t really agree with it. I think a decent number of people will consider “I did something wrong, and then immediately fessed up” is less bad than dragging out not admitting the malfeasance, especially in the case of “cheating” and “engaging in body fluid exchange with more than one person in quick succession” or “acting like we’re still dating including physical affection, when you knew damn well that’s not how YOU felt”.
To answer Astariel’s question: right now, this won’t make it much worse (one can make the case that sustaining the deception incrementally makes it worse, though). Engaging in activities with Joe yesterday without telling him DID make it worse, and doing so again (should that happen) would also make it worse.
Dot
I’m basing my post on this user’s additional and repeated assertion that Sarah was wrong, should have butted out, and was not worth listening to
Yeah, the meme was the funniest thing about this whole mess. It’s just people taking it too far who are the problem.
Shakes
I mean I get it, people get attached to characters.
Personally I also think some perspective is needed, and consideration that we’re a year behind Willis on all this. I know the laundry comic caused an uproar at the time but context for what the characters are doing and thinking gets provided in the long run.
eskimolos
Real talk, but also it seems that Willis has scrapped and redone a lot of the buffer based on feedback to the recent storylines, so not sure how far ahead we legitimately are now, I suppose we should be grateful we have a proprietor so benevolent and prolific.
zee
Tbh people just need to get comfortable with the idea of their woobies doing things that are wrong sometimes. That applies to like 90% of the arguments here. Both sides.
God damn it you made me a centrist. I’ve become what I sought to destory
Rimwalker55
Yes! I live in fear of the buffer! 🙂 Deep inside I’m saying “Don’t you hurt [insert name]”, but the story arcs have pretty much been worked out for a year ahead. Still Mr. Willis has been a good writer and should continue. He must be good if people are so invested in the happiness of fictional characters. LOL
I was going to ask the same thing… I am not a part of any of the other socials surrounding this comic, so if it’s not here, chances are I never see it unless someone else references it here.
what exactly is she repressing since birth that makes lust worse?
Li
Everything.
She’s spent her entire life repressing everything because of how she was raised.
Annaphylaxis
The… homosexuality? The queer awakening that has been coming for Joyce like a freight train down the tracks for every moment this comic has existed? It, uh, tends to be pretty overwhelming, when it hits a gal!
Leorale
Also, knowing what any of her desires are, and having the agency to act on them. Any sexuality at all that isn’t about raising Christian babies for Jesus, but it’s about what she wants. The fact that it’s powerful forbidden Atheist lady-lust is just extra spiffy.
“This feels like a Love Story, and as I am the Protagonist of my story, anything I do in service of finding my True Love is narratively justified”.
Not literally, obviously, but I suspect two of Joyce’s residual “very religious upbringing” brain worms are “Everything will go the way it’s supposed to go, there is a Plan and you can know you are following It” and “I am allowed to center my own immediate feelings and impulses, even though I no longer believe they are the Spirit moving me”
Speaking as a “Paladin,” as this point the thing about the cheating storyline I like the least is the commenters losing their minds over it. Yes, Cheating is Bad ™ but sometimes good people do bad things. Calling out your friend when they’re doing something bad doesn’t make you judgmental, and it doesn’t mean your friend needs to commit seppuku either.
Whatever happened to “the strip isn’t called SmartingOfAge, amiright?” I know this attitude isn’t limited to this storyline; it’s been a reoccurring problem basically since the beginning. It just makes me want to skip reading comments entirely.
632 thoughts on “Hands off”
Morrison
Joe said he would be bi if he got to bang more chick’s. With Joyce he was ready to be completely monogamous. By agreeing to be in a four way with Walky and Dorothy he will be bi and by doing so bang twice as many chick’s as before.
Morrison
chicks. I meant chicks. ? ?
eh, whatever
Where did he say that?
Sirksome
This ya’lls GOAT?
https://www.dumbingofage.com/2021/comic/book-12/01-sister-christian/taptap/
Tan
He has also since determined that he is retroactively bi for banging Malaya (who came out as nonbinary afterward): https://www.dumbingofage.com/2025/comic/book-15/02-the-one-where-jocelyne-returns/bestow/
GreyICE
Oh yes, that was extremely serious.
thejeff
It wasn’t serious, but it was still gross. Even on its own, but even more as a deflection from not treating Carla as a woman and “not being mean” about Jocelyne.
Kind of hope we circle back to that at some point.
GreyICE
It was what?
My god the delicate flowers in these comments sections.
Sirksome
The story itself doesn’t frame Joe’s joking as a good thing. The reason we even like Joe now is because he developed as a character. Dismissing his flaws undercuts that. Like you can choose to ignore what the story is telling you I guess? But don’t fault if other’s comment because they might understand more than you.
Taffy
Like you, snowflake? Your username could use better capitalization, btw.
GreyICE
Gee, called a snowflake by someone who never read Neuromancer.
Does mommy know you’re reading webcomics with bad words in them?
Tan
As are we all. Serious people discussing the serious issues of the day.
Tessea
Cooler heads failed yesterday. Today they MUST succeed at holding back from eachother until the relationship issue is sorted!Joyce IS aware that she’s cheating on Joe. If she can’t face that and fess up things are going to get so much worse.
Lumino
Joyce STILL seems unwilling to give the situation the weight it deserves. She begrudging accepts to stop stabbing Joe in the back, after Dorothy bullies her into it.
If even Sarah couldn’t get through to her, I’m not sure who else could. I doubt Dorothy is up to the task.
Nadamás
“Bullies her into it” are you using a different definition of that word that the usual one! Otherwise i don’t get hiw it applies there.
Annaphylaxis
I think Joyce, probably very reasonably, doesn’t feel like stroking Dorothy’s cheek is “stabbing Joe in the back.”
Elf grrl
Joyce making out with Dorothy and them trying to be all hush hush about it is cheating. Its a betrayal towards their already committed partners. Sarah aptly said it, the secrecy and tip toeing around the affair makes it much worse. The two even feel guilt from their new developing relationship.
Annaphylaxis
Oh, thanks, I didn’t realize that anyone was cheating, before now.
Soncnikralj
Well, yes! Welcome to the Comments Section, Grasshopper!
PumpkinCake
In a vacuum, Joyce stroking Dorothy’s cheek is not cheating.
But this isn’t happening in a vacuum. Joyce and Dorothy just cheated, and every bit of affection they display is a continuation of that cheating. Everything more they do makes it a bit more severe.
Dorothy correctly clocks that they need to pause. What’s done is done, but they can stop making it worse.
zee
I mean Joyce continuing to act like dots girlfriend while being Joe’s girlfriend is kinda stabbing him in the back yeah
God damn it I don’t even really give a shit about cheating. It’s bad and I’ll say damn fuck that dude if you tell me about it, but i roll my eyes when people say it’s the worst thing you can do to a partner without any qualifiers (eg. Worst non violent thing you can do). I didn’t care when my own ex cheated on me, it’s like the least bad thing he did to me. It’s just, really annoying when people insist on calling a spade a club or diamond when it’s so clearly a spade.
Tequila Mockingbird
I imagine for some, being cheated on is either the worst thing that has happened to them, or the worst thing they can imagine. The stuff that gets even worse I suspect people folks try to avoid thinking about… which isn’t really an option for folks who are fully aware of how bad it can get through first or second-hand experience.
thejeff
It’s not the worst thing you can do (and what they’ve done so far is far from the worst cheating can be), but it’s not far from the worst thing that you’re going to see in this kind of context. That doesn’t turn the character into an outright villain in most people’s eyes. That gets a large (majority?) portion of the commentariat excusing or condoning it.
That arguably is being portrayed positively and/or romantically in the comic itself.
Nymph
I disagree that it’s being portrayed positively given the instant pushback they’ve gotten from Sarah and Danny’s pontification on how you’d have to be an awful terrible person to ever do this.
I think Willis is portraying that Dorothy and Joyce both think this is positive, which makes sense, but I’m not seeing a lot of it outside their opinions (other than the framing of the original kiss, which I think was just always going to be dramatic and romantic no matter what).
thejeff
I said “arguably”, but I’m not really interested in arguing it.
Some people see it that way. Others, like you, obviously don’t.
Nymph
Wasn’t an argument, just discussing opinions in the opinion discussing forum?
Sillypuppyboy
I very much read it as Joyce being partially swept up in the honeymoon phase of a new relationship and partially Joyce avoiding thinking about the situation seriously because the moment she really DOES let herself face the reality of it she’s gonna collapse like a house of cards, girl is currently running on honeymoon phase and inertia, and the moment she stops and processes things she’s NOT gonna be in a good place about everything
Tessea
Of course I’m only speculating, but Joyce doesn’t really seem to think Joe is going to really be upset. Maybe not even surprised. She’s probably assuming they’ll easily come to some sort of arrangement.
After all, she saw how Dorothy and Walky got back together even after Dorothy already broke up with him once. So why couldn’t she and Joe remain good friends?
I think that might be her mindset.
Big Z
See, I don’t even know that I think Joyce is thinking it through that hard — most of what she’s doing seems to be following the same basic script of “well, we’re in Twue Wuv, so that makes anything we do all right”, whether consciously or unconsciously.
Erica
I don’t think she’s even thinking about Joe, other than the moment yesterday when she in the room with him.
Lumino
Joyce is struggling with object permanence.
Adeptus
Object permanence is exactly right. She has turned into an impulse driven baby.
zee
I think it’s more that she’s still hopped up on romcom brain and averting her gaze from the issue. I think I drew the comparison before but it’s like how in sinbad, Sinbad fucks his best friend’s wife and the dude is just written to be chill with it bc true love. Joyce thinks she’s in Sinbad, she’s not.
Big Z
Amplified, possibly, by legacy fundie brainworms — the only relationships one is allowed to be in are ones with the express purpose of going directly to marriage, do not pass go, do not date around. A surprisingly large number of ex-fundies of my acquaintance seem to have that change into “whatever relationship I’m currently in now is my only valid relationship ever, and I will go full steam ahead in it”.
Pocky
no plan survives contact with the enemy
methinks Joyce is going to want her cake, and eat it too.
Adeptus
I hope so. That is much more interesting than the alternative.
PhyrexianRogue
“Things are going to get so much worse” might as well be an alternative title for the comic.
Yet_One_More_Idiot
Yo, next book title just dropped!
Astariel
Nah, they don’t have to do anything. And how is it going to make things worse? Are Joe and Walky going to be cool with everything they did yesterday and last night, but emotionally wrecked by some cheek stroking this morning? That die is cast, one way or another, and a little extra affection between these two isn’t going to make a difference.
Dot
Your position appears to be that Dorothy and Joyce hold no obligation whatsoever to act considerately towards the people in their lives that they care about. That’s a position one can hold, but it’s not one likely to endear them to anyone.
Big Z
I’m reading it as more of “it doesn’t matter how much more they do, nothing will make it worse than the initial cheating” — which isn’t a completely invalid position, even if I don’t really agree with it. I think a decent number of people will consider “I did something wrong, and then immediately fessed up” is less bad than dragging out not admitting the malfeasance, especially in the case of “cheating” and “engaging in body fluid exchange with more than one person in quick succession” or “acting like we’re still dating including physical affection, when you knew damn well that’s not how YOU felt”.
To answer Astariel’s question: right now, this won’t make it much worse (one can make the case that sustaining the deception incrementally makes it worse, though). Engaging in activities with Joe yesterday without telling him DID make it worse, and doing so again (should that happen) would also make it worse.
Dot
I’m basing my post on this user’s additional and repeated assertion that Sarah was wrong, should have butted out, and was not worth listening to
Shakes
I apologize for what I started.
Nadamás
If it makes you fell better, the comments would still be equally awful, it would just not have those two words
pjeseb
Yeah, the meme was the funniest thing about this whole mess. It’s just people taking it too far who are the problem.
Shakes
I mean I get it, people get attached to characters.
Personally I also think some perspective is needed, and consideration that we’re a year behind Willis on all this. I know the laundry comic caused an uproar at the time but context for what the characters are doing and thinking gets provided in the long run.
eskimolos
Real talk, but also it seems that Willis has scrapped and redone a lot of the buffer based on feedback to the recent storylines, so not sure how far ahead we legitimately are now, I suppose we should be grateful we have a proprietor so benevolent and prolific.
zee
Tbh people just need to get comfortable with the idea of their woobies doing things that are wrong sometimes. That applies to like 90% of the arguments here. Both sides.
God damn it you made me a centrist. I’ve become what I sought to destory
Rimwalker55
Yes! I live in fear of the buffer! 🙂 Deep inside I’m saying “Don’t you hurt [insert name]”, but the story arcs have pretty much been worked out for a year ahead. Still Mr. Willis has been a good writer and should continue. He must be good if people are so invested in the happiness of fictional characters. LOL
QueenofSodor
having your oppenheimer moment now, huh
perpetual summer
Your comment was funny, and it’s not really your fault that Willis thought so too & held a magnifying glass on it.
Sharizard
Apparently i’m out of the loop. What was the comment?
Odditude
Yeah, wanna be looped in
Kyrros
I was going to ask the same thing… I am not a part of any of the other socials surrounding this comic, so if it’s not here, chances are I never see it unless someone else references it here.
deliverything
This one here:
https://www.dumbingofage.com/2025/comic/book-15/04-the-only-exception/almosthappened/#comment-1886937
Sirksome
What is going on in Joyce Brown’s head?
Jon
Lust, mostly. Exacerbated by 19 or so years of repression.
Dante
Something something Ruth Was Right, she’ll bang half the town in a tasmanian devil whirlwind of lust now her repression has broken
lesserlordofweasels
what exactly is she repressing since birth that makes lust worse?
Li
Everything.
She’s spent her entire life repressing everything because of how she was raised.
Annaphylaxis
The… homosexuality? The queer awakening that has been coming for Joyce like a freight train down the tracks for every moment this comic has existed? It, uh, tends to be pretty overwhelming, when it hits a gal!
Leorale
Also, knowing what any of her desires are, and having the agency to act on them. Any sexuality at all that isn’t about raising Christian babies for Jesus, but it’s about what she wants. The fact that it’s powerful forbidden Atheist lady-lust is just extra spiffy.
Thag Simmons
Uh, I think Billie’s “it okay if it’s with your best friend” is running on repeat
Amós Batista
Not even Willis knows.
Big Z
“This feels like a Love Story, and as I am the Protagonist of my story, anything I do in service of finding my True Love is narratively justified”.
Not literally, obviously, but I suspect two of Joyce’s residual “very religious upbringing” brain worms are “Everything will go the way it’s supposed to go, there is a Plan and you can know you are following It” and “I am allowed to center my own immediate feelings and impulses, even though I no longer believe they are the Spirit moving me”
Red
LIGHTSWITCH
AbacusWizard
I for one welcome our new literal sound effect overlords.
Clif
I choose to believe that “lightswitch« is the literal sound it makes due to clever Ruttech engineering.
Sharizard
*starts mentally building an arduino that i could hook up to the lightswitch in my living room*
Tenzhi
If you squint your brain it actually works as an onomatopoeia.
Peter Huppertz
Does anyone remember the “RESLAM” sound effect?
pjeseb
Speaking as a “Paladin,” as this point the thing about the cheating storyline I like the least is the commenters losing their minds over it. Yes, Cheating is Bad ™ but sometimes good people do bad things. Calling out your friend when they’re doing something bad doesn’t make you judgmental, and it doesn’t mean your friend needs to commit seppuku either.
Whatever happened to “the strip isn’t called SmartingOfAge, amiright?” I know this attitude isn’t limited to this storyline; it’s been a reoccurring problem basically since the beginning. It just makes me want to skip reading comments entirely.
Tan
Speaking as a Sicko… Yes… Ha ha ha… Yes!