I’m curious why they ever dated in the first place, and the events leading to their break up. I know we were never really supposed to think too hard about it, but since Dorothy’s become one of the main characters it’d be cool to see it elaborated on.
Granted, five years after it happened is probably too late for exposition.
We know why they broke up. Dorothy was concerned he was only following her without any of his own goals in mind and Danny sacrificed going to a better school just to stay close to her, and of course the infamous “maybe you’ll like it here” which angered Dorothy enough to finally cut it off.
But what we actually have, introducing them going to college and seeming to voice these concerns for the first time, feels kind of abrupt and unlike Dorothy. Danny I can believe was just so stupidly in love that he thought they’d be together forever, but you’d think Dorothy would have ended things beforehand.
Somehow, some way, I am going to use that line in a conversation.
3Xp4t
That joke goes back at least half a century. Not that it’s a bad joke … but something to keep in mind when you dust it off. With a feather duster. Oh. I’ll bet everyone reading this is too young to know what an actual feather duster is …
It … it’s kinky. When used correctly.
“Kinky is the difference between using a peacock feather, or using the entire peacock.” is how I recall first hearing it.
fogel
See! The Internets: preserving our cultural heritage.
Tan
Not only do I know what a feather duster is, but I have in fact held one in my hand.
For non-prurient purposes.
That seemed worth clarifying.
Rich
I can remember seeing a similar joke translated out of Renaissance Italian. There is nothing new under the sun.
Feather dusters are not the retro-tech you think they are. Still see them for sale at dollar stores, many home supply places, and some grocery stores. The more modern synthetic dusters are better at actually cleaning things, and some styles are fair at erotic applications. Very different sensation, though.
The earliest written version I read was credited to Groucho Marx.
Yet_One_More_Idiot
I wouldn’t be at all surprised if you could find something very similar graffiti’d on the walls of Pompeii. Srsly. Apparently while they were doing excavations of the city of Pompeii, they came across some examples of graffiti that translated as dick jokes, and others saying things like “For a good time, see .
Whatever dirty thing you can think of, it’s been done. Over and over. And over and over and over again. And again. 😛
Depends on where you are in history, there have been a few innovations over the years. First ever vibrator was in 1734, and they don’t really become recognizable in the modern form until the 1960s. Next thing down the pike will probably involve surgery. Just a matter of time before some rich kinkster pays a Frankenstein to give someone a creatively-placed set of extra genitalia.
I think Dorothy might blindside us by rejecting male bisexuality as a thing. Since she’s the last person you’d expect to do this it would really raise the issue of bi-erasure.
As horrifying as that idea is I actually kinda hope it happens. I mean cause Dotty is the only character I can think of in this comic without any major flaws…she needs something to be wrong. Does she even have minor flaws?
I can easily think of something wrong with every other major character (excluding The Great Faz of course as we all know he is the he we both deserve and need) but I can’t really think of something for her.
She’s a workaholic. Her self-worth seems to be really wrapped up in her academic success and career. That hasn’t been a problem yet because both of those are going fine, but it’s still not healthy.
MeghanTheWorldEater
Okay that’s a fair point. But even still she seems like she manages to relax enough, but maybe it’ll be a larger problem later on.
I suppose she and Walky have trouble expressing how they feel about their relationship but what new couple doesn’t? (Also that’s both of their problems not just her problem. Although you could argue they share all problems now I suppose.)
Just wait until she realize her grade fell off.. ^^;
Spencer
I wouldn’t even say that. Dorothy was able to pretty easily communicate some heavy stuff yesterday about how their relationship might become more serious but it will ultimately have to end and how she does love Walky.
That’s kind of my problem with her, to be honest. She’s boring. Any time she has a problem she makes all the reasonable choices possible and deals with it as maturely as possible. She doesn’t really have any major, character defining flaws, and even her occasional bouts of immaturity or jerkish behaviour just happen without comment.
I mean, not every character can be a depressed alcoholic or a rage driven superhero, but she’s the most vanilla member of the cast. It’s hard to be invested in her story when more interesting things are happening to more interesting characters.
MeghanTheWorldEater
I know and that’s why I think it’d be great!
I’m kinda a horrible person so I love the idea of taking a character who you think is great and then just sorta suddenly goin “Eh they’re actually kinda messed up.”
I know it’s unlikely as all hell but I can hope right.
(It’s a good think she’s fictional otherwise I’d be a pretty terrible person for wanting her to have some major flaws.)
Spencer
I think it’d be cool if it did, because bi-erasure is a really ingrained thing and even people we assume to be totally on the level can say really stupid things, but I can’t see Dorothy ever saying it, which is why she kind of bores me. I can’t ever imagine her saying anything objectionable.
Thanks, I'll Have Another!
I agree. I don’t really mind Dorothy as a character per se, but I do think she operates as the voice of reason most of the time for the rest of this crazy-ass cast of characters. I, too, would like to see her say or do something objectionable, if only to leaven her character a bit.
Kryss LaBryn
Meh, I like her. It’s nice to have one character somewhere who, while compassionate, actually thinks things out with their head in advance instead of just reacting with their gut all the time. I find it refreshing to have someone who actually can make good decisions on a regular basis. Not every person in every cast needs to be a wacky screwball.
Also she’s a good contrast with both Walky (nice guy but otherwise her antithesis: slobby, lazy, talks without thinking, complete lack of drive or ambition); and she’s like the flip side of Roz. Or rather, she’s Roz (in that she is progressive with her ideas about gender and sexuality), but without the jerky, in-your-face-cuz-I’m-right-and-you’re-WRONG aspect of it.
Everyone seems to find her boring and uninteresting in this thread; I wanted to chime in with an opposing viewpoint to say that I do find her an interesting character (although I can see your guys’s point and I totally understand why people in universe would also find her bland).
We’ve already got plenty of drama because people are awful or otherwise flawed in some way. Yay for a bit of rationality and calm! I’m looking forward to her reaction, and if it’s bi-erasure, I will be very disappointed in her.
At least no one can claim that Willis himself doesn’t grok the concept of bi. 🙂
hoboshoe
just email each other essays already!
Kaiden
Having been married to a workoholic, I can attest that this can be a very serious flaw. It’s all sunshine and roses until you get stuck in a week-long roadtrip with someone who JUST CAN”T STOP WORKING OR THEY”LL EXPLODE.
Oh, and the neglect of the relationship in favor of work. That kinda sucks too.
Spencer
I think Dorothy is certainly driven to excel and she primarily puts her effort towards that, but I don’t know if I’d call her a workaholic. She uses her free time wisely, and even recently kind of chilled out at the prospect of needing to be there for every single class. Like she said, the world didn’t end.
Her ambition/lack of realistic goals, primarily. Having to go to IU should have forced her to reassess, instead she doubled-down. She also avoids pushing uncomfortable issues with her friends, even when it is absolutely necessary.
That said, I like that we have one character who’s not a trainwreck or on the way to becoming one. It gives me a nice calm center I can focus on when Joyce is exploding and Billie is imploding.
MeghanTheWorldEater
Well Joyce is becoming not a train wreck slowly but surely so now we can have Dotty go the opposite path.
…I just want the drama >.>
But what’s wrong with being committed even if your goals are a bit unrealistic? I mean if you don’t try you’ll fail for sure, may as well at least give it shot.
Incomitatus
You don’t *have* to go to an Ivy League to become President.
Of course, she’s much too nice a person to claw her way into high office. That’ll be her point of failure, not her academics.
Dorje Sylas
Depends how ya get there and circumstance. Look at Jimmy Carter one term. He ousted Gerald Ford (a man who was never elected to either position in the executive). Carter won mainly by being “the nice guy outside who was’t going to lie to the people.” Let him survive one whole term. Of course it took a major government shacking scandal.
Dorothy could pull a Carter. Yale helps not because of academic rigor, but contacts you can make while there. It’s largely about who know more than what you know in the game of politics.
Leorale
I think it would be REALLY problematic if Dorothy’s ambition was her ‘character flaw’. I don’t think it is, nor do I see a Willis story punishing an ambitious lady for being ambitious. Nope-a-nope.
Instead, story-wise, Dororthy’s the straight man, the rational center surrounded by craziness. She’s a little high-strung, but is otherwise normal — and I’m totally okay with having one main character who sets up others’ jokes by contrast, and who doesn’t see herself as fundamentally broken.
Spencer
Willis has commented on this viewpoint and he’s already stated that Dorothy’s ambition is never to be considered a flaw.
It’s also a really dumb thing to criticize. Ambition is a good thing!
Rich
That depends entirely on the ambition. Being ambitious about getting good grades? Dandy. Being ambitious about practical applications of your personal eugenics theory? See World War 2 for how that worked out.
David M Willis
oh jesus are we godwinning dorothy now
Rich
Nah, Dorothy’s got the good kind of ambition. Unless you think she’ll just turn into another Washington insider on the way to the White House.
Regardless, saying that all ambition is automatically good is absurd. You don’t have ambition unattached to goals, and the goal (and your own POV) defines whether it’s good or not.
Rycan
Problems arise with ambition when your ambitions begin to consume other parts of your life. And this applies to both men and women. But Dorothy doesn’t have that problem – she has steadfast friends that makes time for, and even has a new boyfriend.
So yes, ambition can become a problem in excess, but that isn’t Dorothy.
Dotty is plenty flawed, she’s nowhere near as smart as she thinks she is and she’s kind of arrogant. She’s got that naive “I have all the answers” teenage attitude and it frequently bites her on the ass.
MeghanTheWorldEater
Hmm I guess your right.
Although I don’t really feel like it frequently bites her in the ass.
I mean really aside from the party…which was far worse for Joyce I can’t really think of time when she’s fucked up all that badly.
Majere
I don’t know, not ending things with Danny before he followed her to college was a pretty boneheaded move on her part. That’s not to say that he’s entirely blameless either, but she certainly did not handle the situation terribly well.
249 thoughts on “Confidante”
Jen Aside
but why WOULDN’T you brag about having two women at once tho
[well I guess not ENTIRELY at the same time]
[[this isn’t helping is it]]
Kris
He’s not actually dating Amber, but Amber is Amazi-Girl yet they both have individual tags, but Amazi-girl is…..Oh no I’ve gone cross eyed!
MeghanTheWorldEater
Well dissociative identity disorder is a thing so..
No Name
I don’t think Amber has that.
Yet.
nothri
As in she hasn’t developed that mental disorder or as in you are not convinced at this time that she has that mental disorder?
ICSM
Yes
Yet_One_More_Idiot
That answer is technically correct – the BEST KIND of correct! *approves*
a snow ʍousɐ
“Are you gay or straight?”
ETHAN (et al): Yes.
DANNY (et al): No.
DarkoNeko
You two are adorable.
KingMabel
They should totally date each othe….wait a second…
Cheryl
0_0
Deanatay
Is it wrong that I ship this?
Yes. Yes, it is.
Spencer
I’m curious why they ever dated in the first place, and the events leading to their break up. I know we were never really supposed to think too hard about it, but since Dorothy’s become one of the main characters it’d be cool to see it elaborated on.
Granted, five years after it happened is probably too late for exposition.
DarkoNeko
I assume they broke up because long distance relationships are terrible and I personally wouldn’t recommend them to anyone <_<
DarkoNeko
Well, that and they don’t really see eye to eye.
Roborat
Why would a height difference be a problem?
(blinks innocently)
Spencer
We know why they broke up. Dorothy was concerned he was only following her without any of his own goals in mind and Danny sacrificed going to a better school just to stay close to her, and of course the infamous “maybe you’ll like it here” which angered Dorothy enough to finally cut it off.
But what we actually have, introducing them going to college and seeming to voice these concerns for the first time, feels kind of abrupt and unlike Dorothy. Danny I can believe was just so stupidly in love that he thought they’d be together forever, but you’d think Dorothy would have ended things beforehand.
Spencer
Amber is into some kinky shit.
Mr k
No Wonder. She shares Genes with Faz.
Plasma Mongoose
Kinky is using a feather, perverted is using the whole chicken.
JustCheetoDust
And just like that, I remember Me, Myself & Irene.
boomwolf
Somehow, some way, I am going to use that line in a conversation.
3Xp4t
That joke goes back at least half a century. Not that it’s a bad joke … but something to keep in mind when you dust it off. With a feather duster. Oh. I’ll bet everyone reading this is too young to know what an actual feather duster is …
It … it’s kinky. When used correctly.
“Kinky is the difference between using a peacock feather, or using the entire peacock.” is how I recall first hearing it.
fogel
See! The Internets: preserving our cultural heritage.
Tan
Not only do I know what a feather duster is, but I have in fact held one in my hand.
For non-prurient purposes.
That seemed worth clarifying.
Rich
I can remember seeing a similar joke translated out of Renaissance Italian. There is nothing new under the sun.
Feather dusters are not the retro-tech you think they are. Still see them for sale at dollar stores, many home supply places, and some grocery stores. The more modern synthetic dusters are better at actually cleaning things, and some styles are fair at erotic applications. Very different sensation, though.
Opus the Poet
The earliest written version I read was credited to Groucho Marx.
Yet_One_More_Idiot
I wouldn’t be at all surprised if you could find something very similar graffiti’d on the walls of Pompeii. Srsly. Apparently while they were doing excavations of the city of Pompeii, they came across some examples of graffiti that translated as dick jokes, and others saying things like “For a good time, see .
Whatever dirty thing you can think of, it’s been done. Over and over. And over and over and over again. And again. 😛
DarkoNeko
Been to Pompeii…
they have uncovered (well, had in 97, anyway) some… seriously well endowed fertility statues there. I think they liked fun a lot ^^
Rich
Over-endowed fertility gods and goddesses have been around since the early Stone Age. The Roman ones are just way better sculpted.
DarkoNeko
I swear the thing was like 70cm long.
Rich
Depends on where you are in history, there have been a few innovations over the years. First ever vibrator was in 1734, and they don’t really become recognizable in the modern form until the 1960s. Next thing down the pike will probably involve surgery. Just a matter of time before some rich kinkster pays a Frankenstein to give someone a creatively-placed set of extra genitalia.
Cynthia
I am so stealing that! 😀
Captain Batson
Don’t be silly, everyone knows that Danny’s dating Amazi-Girl, and everyone knows that Amazi-Girl is Carla.
nothri
Siiiiiiigh.
Machine of Slight Discomfort
FAAAAAAAAAAAACE
SUGauthor
I think Dorothy might blindside us by rejecting male bisexuality as a thing. Since she’s the last person you’d expect to do this it would really raise the issue of bi-erasure.
GoogerGeiger
lol no
Archivist
NO.
Wire Segal
Nah, Willis wouldn’t do that. She’s very knowledgable on current events topics (after all, she wants to be prez!), so she would not reject the idea.
MeghanTheWorldEater
As horrifying as that idea is I actually kinda hope it happens. I mean cause Dotty is the only character I can think of in this comic without any major flaws…she needs something to be wrong. Does she even have minor flaws?
I can easily think of something wrong with every other major character (excluding The Great Faz of course as we all know he is the he we both deserve and need) but I can’t really think of something for her.
Captain Batson
She’s pretty high-strung, I guess.
Rich
Unfortunately choice of phrasing given the grappling hook sex jokes elsewhere. 🙂
madock345
She’s a workaholic. Her self-worth seems to be really wrapped up in her academic success and career. That hasn’t been a problem yet because both of those are going fine, but it’s still not healthy.
MeghanTheWorldEater
Okay that’s a fair point. But even still she seems like she manages to relax enough, but maybe it’ll be a larger problem later on.
I suppose she and Walky have trouble expressing how they feel about their relationship but what new couple doesn’t? (Also that’s both of their problems not just her problem. Although you could argue they share all problems now I suppose.)
DarkoNeko
Just wait until she realize her grade fell off.. ^^;
Spencer
I wouldn’t even say that. Dorothy was able to pretty easily communicate some heavy stuff yesterday about how their relationship might become more serious but it will ultimately have to end and how she does love Walky.
That’s kind of my problem with her, to be honest. She’s boring. Any time she has a problem she makes all the reasonable choices possible and deals with it as maturely as possible. She doesn’t really have any major, character defining flaws, and even her occasional bouts of immaturity or jerkish behaviour just happen without comment.
I mean, not every character can be a depressed alcoholic or a rage driven superhero, but she’s the most vanilla member of the cast. It’s hard to be invested in her story when more interesting things are happening to more interesting characters.
MeghanTheWorldEater
I know and that’s why I think it’d be great!
I’m kinda a horrible person so I love the idea of taking a character who you think is great and then just sorta suddenly goin “Eh they’re actually kinda messed up.”
I know it’s unlikely as all hell but I can hope right.
(It’s a good think she’s fictional otherwise I’d be a pretty terrible person for wanting her to have some major flaws.)
Spencer
I think it’d be cool if it did, because bi-erasure is a really ingrained thing and even people we assume to be totally on the level can say really stupid things, but I can’t see Dorothy ever saying it, which is why she kind of bores me. I can’t ever imagine her saying anything objectionable.
Thanks, I'll Have Another!
I agree. I don’t really mind Dorothy as a character per se, but I do think she operates as the voice of reason most of the time for the rest of this crazy-ass cast of characters. I, too, would like to see her say or do something objectionable, if only to leaven her character a bit.
Kryss LaBryn
Meh, I like her. It’s nice to have one character somewhere who, while compassionate, actually thinks things out with their head in advance instead of just reacting with their gut all the time. I find it refreshing to have someone who actually can make good decisions on a regular basis. Not every person in every cast needs to be a wacky screwball.
Also she’s a good contrast with both Walky (nice guy but otherwise her antithesis: slobby, lazy, talks without thinking, complete lack of drive or ambition); and she’s like the flip side of Roz. Or rather, she’s Roz (in that she is progressive with her ideas about gender and sexuality), but without the jerky, in-your-face-cuz-I’m-right-and-you’re-WRONG aspect of it.
Everyone seems to find her boring and uninteresting in this thread; I wanted to chime in with an opposing viewpoint to say that I do find her an interesting character (although I can see your guys’s point and I totally understand why people in universe would also find her bland).
We’ve already got plenty of drama because people are awful or otherwise flawed in some way. Yay for a bit of rationality and calm! I’m looking forward to her reaction, and if it’s bi-erasure, I will be very disappointed in her.
At least no one can claim that Willis himself doesn’t grok the concept of bi. 🙂
hoboshoe
just email each other essays already!
Kaiden
Having been married to a workoholic, I can attest that this can be a very serious flaw. It’s all sunshine and roses until you get stuck in a week-long roadtrip with someone who JUST CAN”T STOP WORKING OR THEY”LL EXPLODE.
Oh, and the neglect of the relationship in favor of work. That kinda sucks too.
Spencer
I think Dorothy is certainly driven to excel and she primarily puts her effort towards that, but I don’t know if I’d call her a workaholic. She uses her free time wisely, and even recently kind of chilled out at the prospect of needing to be there for every single class. Like she said, the world didn’t end.
DarkoNeko
Agian, just wait until she realise her grades are falling 😀
Rich
Too right. Likely to shatter like glass if she can’t get in to Yale. Which is not a given by any means, the competition is fierce.
Doctor_Who
She thinks “Wedding Smashers” is a better episode than “Time’s Short”! The girl needs her head examined!
MeghanTheWorldEater
Oh yeah! Never mind she clearly has more issues than anyone else, can’t believe I forgot that.
Viktoria
Her ambition/lack of realistic goals, primarily. Having to go to IU should have forced her to reassess, instead she doubled-down. She also avoids pushing uncomfortable issues with her friends, even when it is absolutely necessary.
That said, I like that we have one character who’s not a trainwreck or on the way to becoming one. It gives me a nice calm center I can focus on when Joyce is exploding and Billie is imploding.
MeghanTheWorldEater
Well Joyce is becoming not a train wreck slowly but surely so now we can have Dotty go the opposite path.
…I just want the drama >.>
But what’s wrong with being committed even if your goals are a bit unrealistic? I mean if you don’t try you’ll fail for sure, may as well at least give it shot.
Incomitatus
You don’t *have* to go to an Ivy League to become President.
Of course, she’s much too nice a person to claw her way into high office. That’ll be her point of failure, not her academics.
Dorje Sylas
Depends how ya get there and circumstance. Look at Jimmy Carter one term. He ousted Gerald Ford (a man who was never elected to either position in the executive). Carter won mainly by being “the nice guy outside who was’t going to lie to the people.” Let him survive one whole term. Of course it took a major government shacking scandal.
Dorothy could pull a Carter. Yale helps not because of academic rigor, but contacts you can make while there. It’s largely about who know more than what you know in the game of politics.
Leorale
I think it would be REALLY problematic if Dorothy’s ambition was her ‘character flaw’. I don’t think it is, nor do I see a Willis story punishing an ambitious lady for being ambitious. Nope-a-nope.
Instead, story-wise, Dororthy’s the straight man, the rational center surrounded by craziness. She’s a little high-strung, but is otherwise normal — and I’m totally okay with having one main character who sets up others’ jokes by contrast, and who doesn’t see herself as fundamentally broken.
Spencer
Willis has commented on this viewpoint and he’s already stated that Dorothy’s ambition is never to be considered a flaw.
It’s also a really dumb thing to criticize. Ambition is a good thing!
Rich
That depends entirely on the ambition. Being ambitious about getting good grades? Dandy. Being ambitious about practical applications of your personal eugenics theory? See World War 2 for how that worked out.
David M Willis
oh jesus are we godwinning dorothy now
Rich
Nah, Dorothy’s got the good kind of ambition. Unless you think she’ll just turn into another Washington insider on the way to the White House.
Regardless, saying that all ambition is automatically good is absurd. You don’t have ambition unattached to goals, and the goal (and your own POV) defines whether it’s good or not.
Rycan
Problems arise with ambition when your ambitions begin to consume other parts of your life. And this applies to both men and women. But Dorothy doesn’t have that problem – she has steadfast friends that makes time for, and even has a new boyfriend.
So yes, ambition can become a problem in excess, but that isn’t Dorothy.
DarkoNeko
Not yet, anyway.
MeghanTheWorldEater
Ever notice how I can’t spell? I guess Faz has been demoted from hero to he. Oh well.
That Damn Rat
Dotty is plenty flawed, she’s nowhere near as smart as she thinks she is and she’s kind of arrogant. She’s got that naive “I have all the answers” teenage attitude and it frequently bites her on the ass.
MeghanTheWorldEater
Hmm I guess your right.
Although I don’t really feel like it frequently bites her in the ass.
I mean really aside from the party…which was far worse for Joyce I can’t really think of time when she’s fucked up all that badly.
Majere
I don’t know, not ending things with Danny before he followed her to college was a pretty boneheaded move on her part. That’s not to say that he’s entirely blameless either, but she certainly did not handle the situation terribly well.
Kinoko