Also, in all seriousness, it would be possible to rig up a script to post a prewritten comment as soon as the RSS updates, and Ana is a Patron.
Cholma
Please. Answer is easy-peasy. Ana is Russian hacker using 1337 code with spyware hooks into Willis’ network. She sees everything before he even does anything. NO COLLUSION.
Adding more shiny spots makes them look like they’re watering a little. Plus you can hint at their shape through facial expression (brows and cheek lines).
This hurts, but I definitely do enjoy seeing this moment of Walky caring about Sal. ‘Cause like… of COURSE he does, she’s his sister, but it’s nice to see it here even though this revelation has gotta hurt like hell.
Yeah, that’s very interesting. A fight between Amber and Sal NOW, he assumes Sal is at fault, but the convenience store situation, he’s on Sal’s side. That’s kind of the opposite of what I’d expect from him, since he has to have had the Linda-approved version of the robbery pounded into his brain.
BBCC
I mean, even if he’s not necessarily ‘on Sal’s side’ wrt the robbery, he just got told ‘I stabbed your sister’. There’s…not a ton of ways to shrug it off without being a massive, massive asshole and a shitty brother.
Nikol Geier
Walky’s been thinking a lot about that stuff, I think. I think the gas station in particular is really eating at him of late—it’s something he’s outright harassed Sal about, and now that he’s starting to recognize the racism Sal has dealt with that he hasn’t, he’s starting to think more about how his sister always wears gloves now.
BBCC
Yes, this too.
Yotomoe
I don’t want to call out the story or nuthin’ but this plot point always bugged me. I dunno as someone black it’s frustrating to see a “Oh he’s black but he’s treated nicer than someone who looks/acts a bit blacker”. As if there’s now guilt associated with not being black enough. It’s the reason the mulatto dynamic exists where both black people AND white people shunned half black people. Especially in the context of having a twin sister sister who shares the same parents and skin tone and the only noticeable difference is the kinky hair. I find it’d be…reasonable for Walky to assume the favoritism didn’t have much to do with race. I’d almost assume his mom was SEXIST before I assumed it was a race issue.
BBCC
Maybe I’m missing something, as I’m not black, so feel free to correct me if I’m wrong, but I don’t think there needs to be guilt associated with being whiter and being treated better for it. Like, colourism is a big problem, and people who assimilate better are usually better treated than people who don’t/can’t/won’t. That doesn’t make it a bad thing to be whiter or assimilating more, but it is a problem that happens and deserves to be talked about.
Well, Walky’s recognizing Sal’s been treated very badly in comparison to him, and he never did anything to stop that from happening. I would guess that’s one reason for his guilt.
BBCC
Sure, but that’s a compassionate reaction, not one based on it being inherently bad that he’s whiter. To go with Yomotoe’s sexism example, if Walky were favoured for being a boy and he felt bad about it, it would be because he’s feeling compassionate towards his sister because she’s treated badly, not because being a boy is a bad thing.
HeySo
“and the only noticeable difference is the kinky hair”
Sal has consistantly been shaded two shades darker than her brother, and has been indicated to be “black” on appearance, while her brother has been indicated to be “caramel” on appearance. If your problem (and I’m confused how this is a thing if the parents are in a relationship to begin with) is with black skin tones, then a more middle-eastern shade is likely going to be easier to tolerate.
So yes, there has been a clear basis for Sal’s interpretation of things.
That said, if we look through the flashbacks, there didn’t seem to be a clear dynamic of difference until their mother chose Walky over Sal for a casting role. After that, Sal seems to have acted more and more against her mother’s rigid, prejudiced middle-class thinking, while Walky was always easy-going, non-confrontational, and obliging to his parents.
So the issue likely wasn’t due to skin color, at all.
That said, it makes total sense for Sal to believe that that was the cause-
After all, if you’re a child who feels victimized, and still wants the approval of their parent, are you more likely to try and determine what’s wrong with yourself, or with your parent? Given a choice between “There’s something wrong with me, and the only visible thing is my skin color, could I just not be the way my mother wants me to be” and “my mother is a selfish, self-centered jerk who worries more about appearances than me being her daughter”, it could end up being easier to choose the first option, especially since it’s both one that’s easier to excuse your own actions with and one that’s presumably easier to change your parent’s mind about.
In summary, race probably isn’t the issue, but the plot point itself is completely reasonable.
HeySo
As a counter-argument, we could consider why Linda picked Walky over Sal. Maybe it was about skin shade (after all, Linda is all about appearances- and that’s the underlying factor to her emphasizing that Sal’s kinky hair should be straightened as well, which itself is another bit of fuel for Sal’s [or this counter-argument]’s take on things), and Sal picked up on that to some degree, and that’s what started everything. Maybe it was a subconcious thing at first, but maybe it turned into something that Linda actually does hold on to. One thing we do know is that Linda is apparently overly obsessed with Sal keeping her hair straight, and that could be interpreted for either argument [Linda being obssesed about appearances alone, or Linda being obssessed with appearances and factoring race into that].
BBCC
It’s actually Charles who insults Sal’s natural hair to her face, not Linda. I mean, I’m sure Linda would co-sign that sentiment if she were speaking to Sal, but that was on her dad, not her mom.
thejeff
Near as I can tell, their skin is actually the same shade. For example here, where there are closeups for both of them in the same light. That said, skin color isn’t the only marker that we commonly associate with being “black”. Hair is the most obvious and the one called out blatantly in this comic, but there are also facial features that might not come across clearly in this art style. Our first hint at any of this was Walky’s description of Sal as “black” and himself as “generically beige”. Despite having the same skin color. I take that as a reflection of how they were seen in the family.
As for the flashbacks: Are there any earlier than the casting bit? The only candidate might be the first meeting with Marcie. I’m not sure which one they looked older in. In both scenes though, Linda yells at Sal and/or favors Walky.
Linda’s racism is pretty obvious in her dealings with Sal over Marcie as well, so it’s not at all unreasonable to expect it elsewhere.
AntJ
I forget where it was but I remember Walky saying “she’s black, I’m beige”
thejeff
Yup. That was the first hint.
Because they’re the same color.
Clif
At the time I took it to be a matter of self identification he was describing, but I dunno.
thejeff
At the time I did since we didn’t have any other information then, but in light of the later emphasis on the difference in how they were treated and the claimed racism behind it, it’s hard not to see it as tied in.
Sal claims their parents treated her worse because they saw her as blacker.
Walky jokes about her being black and him not being black.
Sal has consistantly been shaded two shades darker than her brother
What??
Sal has consistently exactly the same skin-color as her brother since the start of the comic, confirmed by word of god!
thejeff
ah, thank you. I vaguely remembered such, but didn’t know where to look.
Chris (the other one)
To be pedantic, the word of God says that they’re “the exact same colors they’ve always been since the begining” … which is not the same as they’re the “exact same colors.”
Jhon
Yep. Save an image with the two and look at it with a program that will display RGB values. I’ve done this myself.
@Chris (not the one, but the other one):
See Jhon’s approach: You can test it yourself!
ischemgeek
Intersectionality being a thing, who says it’s not both?
By which I mean: it is possible that both racism and sexism have informed Linda’s mistreatment of Sal and that Sal only picked up the race part cuz she gets that elsewhere and Linda is better at camouflaging her sexism.
thejeff
It’s possible. But I don’t think we’ve seen any signs of it the text.
BBCC
Maybe, but we haven’t seen any that I recall. We HAVE seen Linda broadcast classism and ableism loud and clear though, and she hates that Sal associates with the ‘wrong people’ (i.e. Marcie).
regina phalange
Well, while Linda is clearly a crap parent and willing to put blame on Sal for the strife in the world, Sal is still her child, and she still very much cares about how the family looks. I’d assume she played up how Sal was a victim of “some crazy stabby girl” as much as possible to everyone, but meanwhile also sent her away because, privately, “it was after all entirely her fault, let’s send her away so it won’t happen again.” Walky would have seen both sides of that.
BBCC
I imagine that Sal being stabbed is how she got the option to pick a boarding school over juvie. The Walkertons strike me as capable of maneuvering the officer’s incompetence into that sort of option.
regina phalange
Oh definitely. I can also see them, or Linda rather, righteously throwing around her white privilege “for good”, totally oblivious to her own issues. “How dare you threaten juvie! She was stabbed! Is this because she’s not as white as that psycho? If the races were switched, SHE’d be behind bars by now and WE’d be filing a suit for our daughter’s hospital bills! We should sue for discrimination!”
BBCC
I can actually see it and I hate it. As if I didn’t want to slap her enough already. 😛
Drunk Mike
Knowing what I know about our correctional facilities, I feel like Amber may have done Sal a favor. That might be the most fucked up part about this whole comic.
Well as bad as it is to assume the assumption that she instigated that confrontation at that moment of time wasn’t necessarily wrong and yeah I know Amber is still at fault a bit too because she was more than eager to butt heads with her but still. I think Walky was probably going in with the knowledge about what he already knows, half the time Sal can be confrontational and as far he knew what was probably Sal getting in his new girlfriend’s face and telling her to stay away from her brother out of disapproval. Other than that he couldn’t have thought of any other reason why they would be at odds until Amber opened up about the stabbing.
BBCC
Sal and Amber both agreed they wanted to fight. If Sal wanting to fight makes it her fault, Amber wanting to fight makes it also her fault.
As for Walky, if that’s what he was thinking, I think he needs to rewind that night because Sal’s disapproval was directed at HIM for going from miserable about being broken up with by someone he loved to making out with someone else in two days. Like, there’s nothing wrong with him moving on, but let’s not pretend that disapproval wasn’t pointed at Walky. That would require him to fundamentally misunderstand what Sal was disapproving of.
thejeff
It was, but it’s not unreasonable to think it was about him, since as far as he knew, that was the only point of contact they had. That’s the only thing it made any sense for them to fight about and Sal was the aggressor there while Amber cowered and slunk away, even though that aggression was directed at Walky.
Yeah, it’s a jump, but it’s not that wild of a leap.
Emily
It’s a pretty wild leap to go from “That was pretty quick Walky” to “A literal fistfight with his new girlfriend.”
thejeff
But it’s the only thing he’s got.
Otherwise it’s “literal fistfight” for no particular reason.
258 thoughts on “Shoulda”
Ana Chronistic
“NOW what do I do for her birthday!”
…
“I–I MEAN I was gonna be her punching bag to make up for all the brotherly neglect over the years but YOU RUINED THE SENTIMENT”
MatthewTheLucky
Nice try, Willis, we know you’re in league!
MatthewTheLucky
Also, in all seriousness, it would be possible to rig up a script to post a prewritten comment as soon as the RSS updates, and Ana is a Patron.
Cholma
Please. Answer is easy-peasy. Ana is Russian hacker using 1337 code with spyware hooks into Willis’ network. She sees everything before he even does anything. NO COLLUSION.
Foxhack
insert that Hackerman gif only it’s Ana and it says Hackerlass
(unless Ana is a dude, then you can use the normal Hackerman gif)
MatthewTheLucky
Ana only ever hacks the right amount of time.
Kravis
MAGIC
Commodore Counterintuitive
time magic, it has to be
3oranges
I mean, I assume that’s what “chronistic” is.
Keulen
Ana is a Time Lord obviously.
Some1
She secretly has access to The World?
BBCC
Ana is actual magic.
JR
Either the comment service has an open API or Ana’s a quick refresher.
Commodore Counterintuitive
No, neither of those answers can be right, they don’t involve magic and/or Stand abilities
jeffepp
She only beat me by seconds, and I was busy with your four reissues.
Tacos
Quantum mechanics.
Dean
Ana went to a crossroads at midnight with a Windows tablet and a black cat bone and the Devil taught them how to get first comment every time.
Deadjolras
Willis works hard but Ana works harder.
TrueVCU
She got what they call the Shine
Yet_One_More_Idiot
Meanwhile, Joyce has come across another slashfic, this one about herself and Dorothy…!
Yet_One_More_Idiot
Joyothy
ShinyNeen
!!!
G-good kickstarter commission. Thank you for sharing!
Ana Chronistic
Y’all should get some Dream Daddies
Deanatay
“I must study this one. VERY CAREFULLY.”
Deanatay
Also, now I kinda want someone to put punching bags with Walky drawn on them in the store. I kinda want to buy this.
jeffepp
“I spent years doing that as my hobby! We’re perfect!”
newllend(henryvolt)
….ooooh I get it.
Yumi
Aw, babies. ;.;
Keulen
To be fair, Sal hurt Amber pretty good as well.
jeffepp
Come on baby, make it hurt so good
Sometimes love don’t feel like it should
Jess
Doo-doo-doo-doo! Doo! Doo!
Clif
Music nerds!
woobie
Normal people reacting to insane situations looks like this.
Nono
“But I never touched Billie? Except for that one time I lifted her away from her tyrannical RA.”
“You mean her girlfriend?”
“…what”
BBCC
“She wasn’t her girlfriend at the time?”
Shiro
How do you manage to pack so much intense emotion into plain dot eyes???
Needfuldoer
Adding more shiny spots makes them look like they’re watering a little. Plus you can hint at their shape through facial expression (brows and cheek lines).
Geneseepaws
Yeah, but still masterfully done.
Clif
However it’s done, it’s very effective.
lilyliv
This hurts, but I definitely do enjoy seeing this moment of Walky caring about Sal. ‘Cause like… of COURSE he does, she’s his sister, but it’s nice to see it here even though this revelation has gotta hurt like hell.
BBCC
Especially when his initial reaction to hearing they had a fight was ‘I need to go scream at my sister now’.
Viktoria
Yeah, that’s very interesting. A fight between Amber and Sal NOW, he assumes Sal is at fault, but the convenience store situation, he’s on Sal’s side. That’s kind of the opposite of what I’d expect from him, since he has to have had the Linda-approved version of the robbery pounded into his brain.
BBCC
I mean, even if he’s not necessarily ‘on Sal’s side’ wrt the robbery, he just got told ‘I stabbed your sister’. There’s…not a ton of ways to shrug it off without being a massive, massive asshole and a shitty brother.
Nikol Geier
Walky’s been thinking a lot about that stuff, I think. I think the gas station in particular is really eating at him of late—it’s something he’s outright harassed Sal about, and now that he’s starting to recognize the racism Sal has dealt with that he hasn’t, he’s starting to think more about how his sister always wears gloves now.
BBCC
Yes, this too.
Yotomoe
I don’t want to call out the story or nuthin’ but this plot point always bugged me. I dunno as someone black it’s frustrating to see a “Oh he’s black but he’s treated nicer than someone who looks/acts a bit blacker”. As if there’s now guilt associated with not being black enough. It’s the reason the mulatto dynamic exists where both black people AND white people shunned half black people. Especially in the context of having a twin sister sister who shares the same parents and skin tone and the only noticeable difference is the kinky hair. I find it’d be…reasonable for Walky to assume the favoritism didn’t have much to do with race. I’d almost assume his mom was SEXIST before I assumed it was a race issue.
BBCC
Maybe I’m missing something, as I’m not black, so feel free to correct me if I’m wrong, but I don’t think there needs to be guilt associated with being whiter and being treated better for it. Like, colourism is a big problem, and people who assimilate better are usually better treated than people who don’t/can’t/won’t. That doesn’t make it a bad thing to be whiter or assimilating more, but it is a problem that happens and deserves to be talked about.
Foxhack
Well, Walky’s recognizing Sal’s been treated very badly in comparison to him, and he never did anything to stop that from happening. I would guess that’s one reason for his guilt.
BBCC
Sure, but that’s a compassionate reaction, not one based on it being inherently bad that he’s whiter. To go with Yomotoe’s sexism example, if Walky were favoured for being a boy and he felt bad about it, it would be because he’s feeling compassionate towards his sister because she’s treated badly, not because being a boy is a bad thing.
HeySo
“and the only noticeable difference is the kinky hair”
Sal has consistantly been shaded two shades darker than her brother, and has been indicated to be “black” on appearance, while her brother has been indicated to be “caramel” on appearance. If your problem (and I’m confused how this is a thing if the parents are in a relationship to begin with) is with black skin tones, then a more middle-eastern shade is likely going to be easier to tolerate.
So yes, there has been a clear basis for Sal’s interpretation of things.
That said, if we look through the flashbacks, there didn’t seem to be a clear dynamic of difference until their mother chose Walky over Sal for a casting role. After that, Sal seems to have acted more and more against her mother’s rigid, prejudiced middle-class thinking, while Walky was always easy-going, non-confrontational, and obliging to his parents.
So the issue likely wasn’t due to skin color, at all.
That said, it makes total sense for Sal to believe that that was the cause-
After all, if you’re a child who feels victimized, and still wants the approval of their parent, are you more likely to try and determine what’s wrong with yourself, or with your parent? Given a choice between “There’s something wrong with me, and the only visible thing is my skin color, could I just not be the way my mother wants me to be” and “my mother is a selfish, self-centered jerk who worries more about appearances than me being her daughter”, it could end up being easier to choose the first option, especially since it’s both one that’s easier to excuse your own actions with and one that’s presumably easier to change your parent’s mind about.
In summary, race probably isn’t the issue, but the plot point itself is completely reasonable.
HeySo
As a counter-argument, we could consider why Linda picked Walky over Sal. Maybe it was about skin shade (after all, Linda is all about appearances- and that’s the underlying factor to her emphasizing that Sal’s kinky hair should be straightened as well, which itself is another bit of fuel for Sal’s [or this counter-argument]’s take on things), and Sal picked up on that to some degree, and that’s what started everything. Maybe it was a subconcious thing at first, but maybe it turned into something that Linda actually does hold on to. One thing we do know is that Linda is apparently overly obsessed with Sal keeping her hair straight, and that could be interpreted for either argument [Linda being obssesed about appearances alone, or Linda being obssessed with appearances and factoring race into that].
BBCC
It’s actually Charles who insults Sal’s natural hair to her face, not Linda. I mean, I’m sure Linda would co-sign that sentiment if she were speaking to Sal, but that was on her dad, not her mom.
thejeff
Near as I can tell, their skin is actually the same shade. For example here, where there are closeups for both of them in the same light. That said, skin color isn’t the only marker that we commonly associate with being “black”. Hair is the most obvious and the one called out blatantly in this comic, but there are also facial features that might not come across clearly in this art style. Our first hint at any of this was Walky’s description of Sal as “black” and himself as “generically beige”. Despite having the same skin color. I take that as a reflection of how they were seen in the family.
As for the flashbacks: Are there any earlier than the casting bit? The only candidate might be the first meeting with Marcie. I’m not sure which one they looked older in. In both scenes though, Linda yells at Sal and/or favors Walky.
Linda’s racism is pretty obvious in her dealings with Sal over Marcie as well, so it’s not at all unreasonable to expect it elsewhere.
AntJ
I forget where it was but I remember Walky saying “she’s black, I’m beige”
thejeff
Yup. That was the first hint.
Because they’re the same color.
Clif
At the time I took it to be a matter of self identification he was describing, but I dunno.
thejeff
At the time I did since we didn’t have any other information then, but in light of the later emphasis on the difference in how they were treated and the claimed racism behind it, it’s hard not to see it as tied in.
Sal claims their parents treated her worse because they saw her as blacker.
Walky jokes about her being black and him not being black.
There might be a link there. 🙂
Amazi-Stool
Sal has consistantly been shaded two shades darker than her brother
What??
Sal has consistently exactly the same skin-color as her brother since the start of the comic, confirmed by word of god!
thejeff
ah, thank you. I vaguely remembered such, but didn’t know where to look.
Chris (the other one)
To be pedantic, the word of God says that they’re “the exact same colors they’ve always been since the begining” … which is not the same as they’re the “exact same colors.”
Jhon
Yep. Save an image with the two and look at it with a program that will display RGB values. I’ve done this myself.
Amazi-Stool
@Chris (not the one, but the other one):
See Jhon’s approach: You can test it yourself!
ischemgeek
Intersectionality being a thing, who says it’s not both?
By which I mean: it is possible that both racism and sexism have informed Linda’s mistreatment of Sal and that Sal only picked up the race part cuz she gets that elsewhere and Linda is better at camouflaging her sexism.
thejeff
It’s possible. But I don’t think we’ve seen any signs of it the text.
BBCC
Maybe, but we haven’t seen any that I recall. We HAVE seen Linda broadcast classism and ableism loud and clear though, and she hates that Sal associates with the ‘wrong people’ (i.e. Marcie).
regina phalange
Well, while Linda is clearly a crap parent and willing to put blame on Sal for the strife in the world, Sal is still her child, and she still very much cares about how the family looks. I’d assume she played up how Sal was a victim of “some crazy stabby girl” as much as possible to everyone, but meanwhile also sent her away because, privately, “it was after all entirely her fault, let’s send her away so it won’t happen again.” Walky would have seen both sides of that.
BBCC
I imagine that Sal being stabbed is how she got the option to pick a boarding school over juvie. The Walkertons strike me as capable of maneuvering the officer’s incompetence into that sort of option.
regina phalange
Oh definitely. I can also see them, or Linda rather, righteously throwing around her white privilege “for good”, totally oblivious to her own issues. “How dare you threaten juvie! She was stabbed! Is this because she’s not as white as that psycho? If the races were switched, SHE’d be behind bars by now and WE’d be filing a suit for our daughter’s hospital bills! We should sue for discrimination!”
BBCC
I can actually see it and I hate it. As if I didn’t want to slap her enough already. 😛
Drunk Mike
Knowing what I know about our correctional facilities, I feel like Amber may have done Sal a favor. That might be the most fucked up part about this whole comic.
newllend(henryvolt)
Well as bad as it is to assume the assumption that she instigated that confrontation at that moment of time wasn’t necessarily wrong and yeah I know Amber is still at fault a bit too because she was more than eager to butt heads with her but still. I think Walky was probably going in with the knowledge about what he already knows, half the time Sal can be confrontational and as far he knew what was probably Sal getting in his new girlfriend’s face and telling her to stay away from her brother out of disapproval. Other than that he couldn’t have thought of any other reason why they would be at odds until Amber opened up about the stabbing.
BBCC
Sal and Amber both agreed they wanted to fight. If Sal wanting to fight makes it her fault, Amber wanting to fight makes it also her fault.
As for Walky, if that’s what he was thinking, I think he needs to rewind that night because Sal’s disapproval was directed at HIM for going from miserable about being broken up with by someone he loved to making out with someone else in two days. Like, there’s nothing wrong with him moving on, but let’s not pretend that disapproval wasn’t pointed at Walky. That would require him to fundamentally misunderstand what Sal was disapproving of.
thejeff
It was, but it’s not unreasonable to think it was about him, since as far as he knew, that was the only point of contact they had. That’s the only thing it made any sense for them to fight about and Sal was the aggressor there while Amber cowered and slunk away, even though that aggression was directed at Walky.
Yeah, it’s a jump, but it’s not that wild of a leap.
Emily
It’s a pretty wild leap to go from “That was pretty quick Walky” to “A literal fistfight with his new girlfriend.”
thejeff
But it’s the only thing he’s got.
Otherwise it’s “literal fistfight” for no particular reason.