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Miscreants
Posted on April 25, 2024 by David M Willis
My Peer Group's Smoochy Chart Is Basically Now An Ouroboros will collect "Year Thirteen," spanning the four storylines that start on August 22, 2022, and complete on August 15, 2023. This includes new commentary, behind-the-scenes artwork, and new character designs into a 218-page tome with luxurious glossy paper all bound up into a sturdy, full-color presentation.   They're fancy!   Includes new commentary, behind-the-scenes artwork, and new character designs into a 218-page tome with luxurious glossy paper all bound up into a sturdy, full-color presentation. There's 24 new Patreon bonus strips collected!  And, as always, there's a buncha character magnets you can grab along the way. Pledge today!

207 thoughts on “Miscreants”

  1. NGPZ

    ???

    *plays “Hanezeve Caradhina” from Made in Abyss OST on hacked muzak*

  2. Karla Jean

    Chicken.

  3. JA

    Baby steps, sometimes you just have to take baby steps.

  4. Sirksome

    Was that really her secret? We readers have known that so long it feels underwhelming.

    1. Thag Simmons

      That third panel combined with the alt text mean it almost certainly is not the only secret.

      1. True Survivor

        I suspect the last one is that she is a lizard-person, and one that doesn’t want to be at Yale or seize the presidency at that! Great goodness, what will her parents think?

        1. butting

          Ha! A likely story.

          Lizard people eat their parents when they hatch. She’s worried about what her broodmates will think.

        2. Pergola

          She is a renegade who has betrayed lizard-kind!

        3. Lysbeth

          And didn’t even finish her meal! Her parents are still alive!

      2. Carl Muckenhoupt

        So what you’re saying is that there’s still a chance that Dorothy killed Mike.

      3. Decidedly Orthogonal

        What else is there?

    2. Jamie

      Yeah, but it’s been a sword of Damascus that she believes has been hanging over her friendships for a good long while in-universe.

      1. Jamie

        DAMOCLES GODDAMMIT I FORGOT

        1. Golden Yak

          Hey, maybe that one was made of Damascus steel. Aw, that would be so good.

        2. eh, whatever

          Anachronistic.

        3. Decidedly Orthogonal

          No that’s Golden Yak. Ana Chronistic is the person who gets first post a lot. ?

        4. Decidedly Orthogonal

          Hey, you caught it before someone else. Be gentle with yourself.

        5. David DeLaney

          asherslipshinesolo.jpg

        6. ktbear

          Damascus steel swords are pretty af though.

      2. Steve

        Dorothy’s at the start of a pretty big downer.

        1. morleuca

          Great scott!

        2. Decidedly Orthogonal

          Is there something wrong with the Earth’s gravity?

        3. thejeff

          It sucks.

    3. Jeremiah

      It was a secret to Joyce.

    4. RassilonTDavros

      I think we all know the truth.

      Qbebgul unf frpergyl orra Fcvqre-Pne gur jubyr gvzr.

      1. StClair

        ah, rot13. that takes me back.

        1. David DeLaney

          rendered unto Caesar and all that

      2. jflb96

        Fcvqre-Pne? Abg Fcvqre Jbzna be Hygen-Pne?

        1. John Campbell

          Should it scare me that I can read these without tool assistance?

        2. Decidedly Orthogonal

          Depends. I’m _decoding_ them without assistance. But if you’re flat out **reading** them without assistance, that’s impressive.

        3. John Campbell

          A little of both. It’s like reading a half-finished Cryptoquote. I’ve got enough of the letters that I can fill in between them.

      3. keithcurtis

        Apparently Google Translate thinks rot-13 is Welsh.

        1. David DeLaney

          side burn: both of them 😎

    5. Erk

      She’s shaving off a chunk of her big block-o-secrets

    6. Zaxares

      It’s part of the truth. I think the REAL secret is that ever since the kidnapping Dorothy’s been nursing some PTSD and it’s manifested in a desire to keep her friends (especially Joyce, as indicated by that fever dream she had) safe. This new goal, coupled with her old dream of becoming President, was simply too much stress for her to handle and she was dangerously close to a nervous breakdown. I think that, deep down, Dorothy is afraid that if she tried to soldier on as she did, she might reach a point where she would crack and throw blame on her friends that “YOU’RE holding me back! I can’t go to Yale and become Prez because I need to stay here and protect you, so YOU’RE the reason I can’t be President!” So she decided to cut that off early by deciding to give up on her dream of being Prez, which was also supported by things like being influenced by Roz’s cynicism about the whole political process, and more mundane things like her realizing that she really misses Walky and what’s the point of being President if it means you’re always overworked, underappreciated and can never be with the person you want to be with?

    7. Matthew

      In a lot of ways, her biggest secret. It was the bottleneck for others. Especially to tell Joyce. She loves how Joyce sees her, but I think this might help get them closer to equal.

    8. Mturtle7

      It…it’s called dramatic irony?

      Just because we, the readers, know about something, doesn’t mean it isn’t a big secret to some or all of the characters involved.

      This was a HUGE friggin moment for both Joyce and Dotty, and I don’t feel underwhelmed in the slightest. Different reading perspectives, I guess!

      1. Decidedly Orthogonal

        It’s dramatic, but not ironic. Dramatic irony is when it’s ironic, but only the audience knows.

        Agreed 100% though that this *is* huge, and us knowing it in advance doesn’t diminish the importance of the moment.

  5. Jo_cubstar

    Aww I’m so glad she got it out and Joyce accepted her anyways

    1. Thag Simmons

      Hard to imagine her not accepting it.

  6. HueSatLight

    not all the secrets, but it’s progress. Both telling Joyce and saying it out loud.

    Anyways, I hope he manages not to say it, but Danny was right.

    1. NGPZ

      Hava nagila!!!

      1. Ray

        Hava nagila
        Have to nagila
        Have three nagila!
        (They are very small…)

        1. NGPZ

          Hava nagila!
          Hava nagila!
          Hava nagila ve-nismeha!!!

          Hava neranenah!
          Hava neranenah!
          Hava neranenah ve-nismeha!

          (Let us re-Joyce, sing and be happy!) ^^

    2. Thag Simmons

      Of course, if she and Danny had kept dating she almost certainly would not have come to like it here.

    3. Decidedly Orthogonal

      That’s not really true. She’s become disillusioned of her dream, not fallen in love with Indiana.

      1. BarerMender

        I think there’s something holding her at IU. Maybe some new understanding of herself? Could she have tried to get back with Walky because… she had something to prove?

    4. Sirksome

      There’s some irony that Danny was right about problems both his exes had and they both broke up with him for it. I hope he doesn’t tell Sal she should quit smoking or something like that.

      1. Needfuldoer

        I can’t imagine current Danny doing that. Very early Danny maybe, but he’s done some growing-up of his own since Dorothy broke up with him.

      2. morleuca

        I thought she had quit and was only carrying them around for the “tactile-ness” of them.

        1. BBCC

          Sal has smoked since almost her first strip. She has never quit. In the strip she says she just likes having them in her mouth, they were indoors. Sal doesn’t smoke inside.

      3. Bash

        Was he right that Dorothy would fall out of love with her dream, or was he hoping that things would work out for them long-term because he wanted that? Dorothy is mad in this moment because he isn’t supporting her.

  7. Nono

    If Joyce says “I love Dorothy” one more time, Beckyjuice will spawn from behind her.

    1. vjlobel

      or beckyjuice will spawn from her….nevermind

    2. RassilonTDavros

      …if I had drawing utensils on me I would draw the shit out of that.

      …maybe I’ll Photoshop a character model

    3. True Survivor

      Now I am imagining a hybrid of those two would look like … and now I need to go throw up.

      1. Thag Simmons

        She’s like halfway to having the hair for it.

        1. StClair

          and she would definitely rock the stripes.

    4. Coatl

      Beckyjuice: muahahahahaha…it’s show time!!

    5. GreyICE

      This is certainly the storyline that’s launching a thousand ships.

      Or perhaps just one, really, REALLY hard. This ship has wings. Poly Joyce relationship?

  8. Regalli

    Progress!

    There’s definitely a lot more – including WHY Dorothy’s decided against it, which is a mix of things including “realizing she doesn’t want to be the kind of politically-cutthroat person who could leverage the kidnapping” and “her concerns about Joyce” and any feelings she has about being the Mom Friend to Joyce as a form of safety net – but this is a very good first step!

    1. Rotunda

      They can talk about the details later, now that the main thrust is revealed.

      1. Chris

        I thought the main thrust happened in the laundry room? ba dah dum, pish.

        1. David DeLaney

          that was MUCH more of a quiver

          –Dave, if your dryer is thrusting, YOU’D BETTER GO CHASE IT MA’AM

    2. Coatl

      There is still a long way to go for Dorothy, but the fact that she finally told the truth is already a big step for her evolution.

    3. C.T. Phipps

      Dorothy is also repulsed by violence and managing military conflict is a central part of the Presidency.

    4. DashWallkick

      Admitting is the first step.

  9. DailyBrad

    I know we know it’s not the full story, but I am really proud of Dorothy here. This is a big deal for her, and I do hope that it’s going to cut down on how much this has been festering inside of her.

    1. Coatl

      This is the first big step for Dorothy, it will be difficult but the fact that she finally said it is already more than enough for a better arc.

    2. Mark

      There’s no need now to keep a secret that is no longer secret, but it’ll take time to unclench and talk freely about the details. There are habits to dismantle.

  10. elfroyalty

    this strip really made my heart warm and full 🙂 and we get a mazi cameo!

  11. Puppeteer Nessus

    Well done Joyce!

  12. V

    Kinda surprised this wasn’t Storyline Over, tbh. Woulda been a nice note to end on, I’m curious to see what else needs to be resolved in this arc before we all call it a night.

    1. Nono

      Sarah with Jacob and/or Ethan, maybe?

    2. Mark

      There’s still Secret Joyce Secrets to be offered in trade. Like Tristan, then and now. Like worries about how she wants her relationship with Joe to evolve.

      These two could spend the next five RL years just listening to each other.

      1. Mark

        She’s never really talked heart-to-heart about her crisis of faith, either.

  13. Coatl

    She said it…she finally said it!!!

    And as expected, Joyce was perplexed (panels 4 and 5 give her away) and is processing it, but she is right about one thing, Dorothy is a wonderful girl and whatever she decides from now on will be the best, but this once more clearly and free of heavy and unnecessary burdens.

    However, Joyce’s reaction may be hiding something (yes, I know many are going to call me a killjoy and I’m jumping the gun), because she may be trying to get Dorothy to reconsider things (in her own way), if that’s the case. If so, a lesson may emerge for Joyce and she may learn to respect Dorothy’s future decisions.

    1. Needfuldoer

      I think Joyce is going to be instrumental in helping Dorothy navigate her disillusionment without giving up on herself.

  14. Animedingo

    I still thimk dorothy is misguided about yale

    These ivy league schools look for more than just grades. They want life experiences that define who the applicants are. Its not a pity acceptance, its the factor of her life she was missing.

    1. NGPZ

      She’d be bumping shoulders with bigoted dumbasses who got in on account of their surnames being on campus buildings.

    2. miz

      she never thought that it was a pity acceptance, though? she said she didn’t like that she’d be using everyone’s trauma to get ahead.

      1. C.T. Phipps

        Which really does show she’s not fit for campaigning, which requires every dirty trick in the book to get elected.

      2. justin8448

        Especially given that she still has her own trauma over the kidnapping that is absolutely still festering.

        Being at Yale would mean being reminded everyday of that traumatizing event. And Dorothy is no where near ready for that.

    3. Bash

      The life experience isn’t something that she initiated, it was literally forced on her and her friends. She’s going to have all sorts of complicated feelings about it.

      1. Animedingo

        Life isn’t always initiated. It happens.

  15. HueSatLight

    Panel 5 is Joyce coming up with an entire alternate storyline for Future President Doris.

    1. Coatl

      True, I forgot that Joyce has a comic…let’s hope she doesn’t have the nerve to want to use her comic as hints to get Dorothy to reconsider.

    2. John Campbell

      Eh, the slice-of-life college storyline is going to get hijacked by weird SF stuff where the characters all become superheros long before Doris is old enough to run for President, anyway, and then it’s going to go off onto a tangent where definitely-not-Becky-and-Dina (I forget if they have comic versions) work at a toy store and not-Becky becomes a Senator, and then after a brief excursion through Doris being pregnant with their twin daughters, Joyce is going to reboot the whole thing and start drawing another slice-of-life college comic without all the weird SF stuff that follows a naïve fundamentalist boy losing his religion. And also a bunch of porn.

  16. Esha

    Can’t wait to see the existential crisis that is Joyce’ next dream.

    1. NGPZ

      *starts taking notes*

  17. BBCC

    Ah, dammit, I was hoping Joyce could talk her into going. Well, I guess there’s still time for that. Or I could hope Walky can.

    It’ll probably be Joyce though.

    And in seriousness, this is sweet and it’d be the right thing to say if this were real life, but GAH I want Dorothy to go to Yale and become President. I hate this storyline for her.

    1. Bash

      What interests you about that storyline?

      1. BBCC

        It’s not so much that her wanting to be President is particularly interesting (though it would be to see her rediscover why she wanted to be President and set out with a clearer eye on what that path will entail now that this has been brought up) so much as I am. So tired of ambitious women in stories not getting whatever their ambition is, regardless of the reason why. It’s not that it can’t be well written but there ALWAYS seems to be a ‘well written, understandable in character reason’ for it. The job’s evil, it doesn’t suit her like she thought, she decides to stay for a relationship (be it familial, platonic or romantic), she’s not as good as someone else, etc. I’m over it. Dorothy’s ambition isn’t supposed to be a character flaw. Well, it might not be but ‘she gives up on the super ambitious goals she had’ isn’t really BETTER in that regard.

        1. Regret

          I would say that any ambition to rule over others is very much a character flaw for anyone, regardless of gender or sex. Her underlying goal of solving all the world’s problems is a better super ambitious goal that I want her to stick with.

        2. Coatl

          I even think she could do that in another area of ​​politics, without the need to be president.

        3. Mark

          I would say that ambition to be a servant-leader for one’s group is very much not a character flaw.

          The difficulty is making that work without winding up in the pockets of people who want one to abuse public trust for their private gain.

        4. BBCC

          And I would say that’s unrealistic, childish, and ultimately self defeating. Someone is going to be the head of state. Wanting that isn’t automatically a character flaw and treating it that way only cedes the position to those most likely to not care whether or not they behave ethically.

        5. thejeff

          Absolutely. That’s been a weird shift on the liberal/left side that I think is really damaging for our prospects in the long term.

        6. Coatl

          Yes, it has become very common in these types of stories, but I think that perhaps it is right that Dorothy first relaxes and lets go of all that weight that she has always imposed on herself, but to say that all the efforts she made previously will not be rewarded. I think they will be compensated in something else where their leadership capacity is taken into account. Who knows, that may even help encourage them to enter another area of ​​politics.

        7. BBCC

          I’m not interested in Dorothy getting a different goal. I’m interested in her getting the ambition she had in the first place.

          “Okay, Ambitious Woman doesn’t get her ambition, but she still gets rewarded” does not address my problem.

        8. thejeff

          I’d be happy if she shifted the goal a bit into politics more generally, still with an eye towards the Presidency, like many politicians do, but more direct focus on lower elected office to start with and governor or Congresswoman/Senator for a more reasonable, but still incredibly ambitious career goal. As well as a position for a run for the White House.

        9. Mark

          Well, we haven’t seen her spreadsheet for her political career. She has some years to fill before being eligible for the Presidency, and I can’t imagine her just killing time in some job she doesn’t care about, until then.

        10. BBCC

          ^ That. We know she wanted to be working in a political campaign in a couple years (And then Becky offered to get her ahead of schedule).

        11. thejeff

          That’s kind of the point. She’s never mentioned it. Maybe it’s more plotted out, but other than the bit about volunteering for a campaign, it’s been “Yale, …., President”.

        12. Holly

          It’s early days yet.

          Dorothy’s perfectionism and need for control IS a character flaw, and her resons for wanting to be the President were immaturity and not thinking through whether she really would enjoy or be good at all aspects of the work. And we saw that she was having trouble with some of the social aspect of the work (the popularity contest / charisma side).

          However, it doesn’t mean that she will never be president. Giving up on it might actually be the thing that opens her up to character growth and learning the skills she’s weak at, and after she’s long decided it’s not her goal anymore, her life might turn in that direction and the diversion might lead her to have been better at it.

          That being said, it depends on how real the comic is going to be. There has been no woman presidant in the USA yet so it’d be a little far-fetched, but on the other hand, Amazi-girls knees don’t break when she lands after a 4 metre drop.

        13. milu

          I think i get that, but her sticking to the presidential dream felt very girlboss. I hope Dorothy reassesses and finds another, just as daring and challenging dream, perhaps one with less dazzle and prestige. Maybe less Hilary, more Emma Goldman? idk, that would clearly be a long arc but at least Dorothy *is* somewhat politically active and literate. There’s hope yet

        14. BBCC

          “Less dazzle and prestige” would not, in fact, be an improvement. One of the best things about Dorothy is that she wants the ‘that’s not realistic’ highest ambition she can find. It’s still the same “Ambitious Woman finds Lesser Ambition more satisfying” shit.

        15. BarerMender

          It’ll happen. A woman won the popular vote back in 2016.

        16. BarerMender

          A woman being president, I mean. That’ll happen.

        17. Pergola

          We can have lady veeps now. It could be a case of dead man’s shoes.

        18. BarerMender

          There is that.

        19. thejeff

          Clinton would have won in 2008, if she’d won the primary. The political winds were with Dems that year, as they very much weren’t in 2016.
          Nor do I think a woman that much more of a lift than a black man.

        20. Vanessa

          Again, it bears reminding that both Al Gore and Hilary Clinton did win the national popular vote. She was this close to actually winning the whole thing, even with Putin and Mark Zuckerberg working hard to discourage and misinform voters.

          It’s only the corruption of our slave-state constitution that allows lessor losers to ascend to the presidential mantel and appoint as many Supreme Court Justices as they can steal. Not getting the president that the majority of Americans want, over and over again, is a feature of our system.

        21. BBCC

          I’m open to her finding her way back to her goal. I’m explaining why I’m not enjoying this as it stands currently, which is her giving up.

        22. GreyICE

          Okay, but”President of the United States” is an ambition that’s pretty doomed. Statistically there’s about 3 a generation, you’re vastly more likely to win the lottery. And that’s before all the structural issues.

          It’s honestly a fairly childish “ambition”. I’d be much happier seeing a woman actually think about what she wants, and get that.

        23. Mark

          There’s what? maybe 200 professional basketball players, and a million kids a year thinking they’re gonna be one. Those 200 did make it. Somebody gets the job. Why not you?

          If you want it, or you need it for what you want to do, go for it. Just be sure to keep enough of yourself to live on if you don’t get it.

        24. HueSatLight

          I may have the height of Spud Webb, but I cannot dunk. I cannot even do a layup properly.

        25. HueSatLight

          BTW, 360-450 players at any one time in the NBA, 562 so far this season. There are other leagues. There’s new players every year, not every 4-8 years. So orders of magnitude different than 3 per generation.

          A 19 year old will have a better grasp on if they could be a professional basketball player within a couple of years than a 19 year old would have on if they could be president in 20 years.

        26. BBCC

          And if she thinks about what she wants and decides it’s the presidency?

          Someone is going to get the job. Going “Pfft, there’s only like 3 a generation, you’re doomed” just serves to keep people from even attempting it.

        27. George

          I think it’s the kind of thing that you might consider if you’ve, say, been a successful governor of a state or something.

          You don’t just *start* by shooting for US president (unless you’re Trump, but HIS approach requires, among other things, a billionaire daddy).

        28. BBCC

          You don’t make that your first election bid, but we don’t know what Dorothy’s steps were. We only know her endgame. There’s nothing wrong with deciding what you want your career endgame to be.

        29. HueSatLight

          her steps would have included something like being a shitty attorney general or rep for some state because she would have only been using the office as a springboard for her next office.

          There is absolutely something childishly wrong with what she was doing. “It’s good to have goals” is just the thought stopping cliche she was using to not think about or talk about that.

        30. BBCC

          Why does she have to be shitty at the office she’s in in order to plan to move on? And if she does well at it, who cares if she’s going to aim higher? If you’re going into politics, you have to know how high you want to go. Planning for the long term career you want is better than taking it one election at a time and only planning around then.

          “It’s unrealistic” is a thought stopping cliche to stop people from even trying.

        31. HueSatLight

          lol

        32. BBCC

          Whatever.

        33. thejeff

          Absolutely agreed. I really hope this is a challenge to be overcome arc, not a “it was bad to even try for” kind of arc. Let her come back to her ambition a bit more realistically, with a bit more nuance.

          She’s the only main character with any real defined goal, beyond “this is my major”. That’s common and realistic, but stories don’t have to be realistic. Let it develop into more of a nuanced goal of wanting to be a politician, with an eye towards the Presidency. And a more reasonable path of getting there than “go to Yale, …., become President”. There’s character development available there.

          I think a lot of it – and a lot of the reaction here – is due to changes in how this audience (and probably Willis) perceive the idea of the President since 2010.

        34. David DeLaney

          I didn’t really have Life Goals and a Future Career Planned Out even when I was in grad school (theoretical particle physics, so yeah, there’s some OBVIOUS goals, but mine was a vague “teach somewhere”).

          –Dave, it was in my second postdoc that I figured out a) I was somewhat too distractible for an academic career and b) I didn’t really have any big Next Thing To Work on in physics. … and after that was when my career got _really_ wild

        35. thejeff

          Many people don’t. And many others change and that’s fine,
          But if there’s only one main character with a goal and her arc is to have it shut down, that’s not narratively satisfying for me.

        36. Mark

          Yeah, this. I don’t want to see Dorothy fail satisfactorily and spend the rest of her life telling herself every day “this is fine, it really is, I’m doing worthwhile stuff….”

          Don’t give up your dreams, Dorothy; examine them carefully, understand what you really need to realize them, plan and execute well (as you typically do).

    2. Bogeywoman

      I agree it’s a troubling narrative pattern (broadly, not necessarily in DOA) but i also really enjoy how human and developmentally appropriate DW’s stories are, and I think this change is a really great one for Dorothy.

      I want her to find an ambition that aligns with her values and learn that the goals themselves aren’t the best part of her, it’s her passion, dedication, work ethic and moral compass. Personally I think she’d make an incredible social worker (as a social work student). She’d be an amazing advocate, community worker or policy developer.

      1. Holly

        I think part of the reason it’s a narrative pattern is because on some scale it happens to pretty much everyone. Few people get all they hoped and dreamed of, and those that do end up changing and not wanting them somewhere along the line.

        I have seen many instances of people dropping out of degrees with an identity crisis, getting divorced from the marraige and kids they used to want and be excited for, undergo complete changes in career halfway through life, etc. It’s as normal and common as can be. Dorothy is a far more believeable character for this arc.

        1. BBCC

          That’s part of it for sure, but it doesn’t explain why it’s pointed at women’s goals so often, especially women who are ambitious. They even talked about it in this comic where they discuss just how often women give up their dream job for romance.

          This arc might be more believable but it’s also more misogynistic. That’s why I’m not interested in Dorothy finding a new goal, even if she’d be amazing at it.

        2. Taffy

          Misogyny is when a 19-year-old doesn’t go to specifically Yale.

        3. BBCC

          Misogyny is when ambitious women constantly decide to give up their ambitious goals in media, yes.

        4. HueSatLight

          Misogyny is when every teenager who had a childhood dream of being president doesn’t get to be president.

        5. BBCC

          Not every teenager, but as I said “Misogyny is when ambitious women constantly decide to give up their ambitious goals in media, yes.”

          Like, it’s an issue that they discussed in this comic as far back as 2010. It’s not an unknown deal. If it weren’t a thing, this storyline wouldn’t bother me as much. As is, yes, this storyline contributes to a wider pattern of misogyny in media. The fact it’s well written and character driven and pretty realistic does not change that.

          I don’t have a problem with you personally enjoying this storyline. I’m glad you do. I don’t though, as it stands.

    3. Doopyboop

      To be fair, Joyce doesn’t have the full context why Dorothy doesn’t wanna go to Yale. She’s accepting at face value it seems that Dorothy has just changed her mind. I think in her own way Joyce is trying to be supportive of that decision, like “that’s okay, if you really don’t want to go I think that’s the right choice for you then”. Plus, if Dorothy stays, more Joyce-Dorothy time.

      1. BBCC

        Yeah, that’s why I’m not annoyed with Joyce so much as I am the storyline. As I said, if this were real life, it’d be the right thing to say.

    4. Mark

      I want her to stay at IU and then become President. Now she’s aware of the cost, and can begin planning to mitigate it.

      1. Loki

        See, I’m glad I’m not the only person who thought this. She doesn’t have to go to Yale to be President. Sure, it helps, but it’s not the only path.

      2. BBCC

        I want her to go to Yale and become President. I’m not interested in her dropping either of her big ambitions, especially because we’re never gonna see her become President at the rate this story moves (unless there’s a flash forward at the end).

        1. Daibhid C

          We also won’t see her if she goes to Yale. We will stop seeing her if she goes to Yale, and I personally am against that.

        2. BBCC

          I’ll be very surprised if we go beyond freshman year. She’d still be here for that.

    5. Amós Batista

      Same here.

  18. IntangibleMatter

    We’re proud of you, Dorothy, even if you still have a long way to go.

    You also probably should get on some antidepressants

    1. NGPZ

      “Build a better dream;
      a less selfish dream.”

      — Shark Boy and Lava Girl

      1. Amara

        In this case, Dorothy needs to build a MORE selfish dream. One that keeps her with her loved ones.

        1. Arianod

          Seconded.

        2. HueSatLight

          Dorothy has never had a problem with being selfish. She has had a problem mistaking what she’s been selfish for as selflessness.
          “I can’t hang out, I have to spend 100% of my time studying so that in 20 years I can be in charge of everyone,” that’s selfishness.
          “Dating you could keep me from being in charge of everyone in 20 years, so ‘as a kindness to you’ we should break up,” that’s selfishness.

          Sharing time with friends or a significant other is not selfishness.

        3. NGPZ

          ding ding ding! ^^

        4. BBCC

          Neither of those things are what happened. She never said she was being selfless by not hanging out with her friends.

          And the “kindness to Walky” was to stop jerking him around about whether they were on pause or not. The selfishness was doing things like having sex with him even though they were supposed to be on pause so she could focus on studying. That’s why she broke up with him.

        5. thejeff

          Yup. And even before that, the whole “this is for fun”, “I love you, but I’m still leaving for Yale” thing was unfair to Walky. I wouldn’t call it selfish really, though she did. She just couldn’t live up to the standards she set for herself. “self-sabotage” she called it from the start.

  19. Opus the Poet

    Another reminder that Dorothy deciding to decline Yale was years ago for us, but just weeks ago in-comic.

    1. thejeff

      And it’s a secret she’s been keeping bottled up that whole time.

      Kind of makes the commentariat reaction of “But what about your real secret? nudge nudge wink wink” irritating. Like this is Dorothy’s main plot arc. I like the shipping/romance stuff as much as anyone, but this has been tearing Dorothy apart for a long time. It’s her biggest struggle.

      1. BBCC

        In their defence, the alt text does imply there’s more, but this is the big one WE knew about and personally I was waiting for her to share so I’m glad she did.

        1. Mark

          The real secret is that she’s actually a field researcher for the Encyclopedia Galactica.

      2. John Campbell

        They’re not different struggles. Her decision not to go to Yale is inextricably interwoven with her feelings for Joyce. (Even if there’s a heterosexual explanation for them.)

  20. Endplanets

    Joyce: Not like those dweebs would let you in or anything.

  21. DorJoJo

    For as much as I tease about my OT3, I do honestly also love that Joyce and Dorothy are allowed to have such affection for each other without it having to be romantic. It is an unfairly-rare dynamic.

    1. Adam Black

      this had me very confused.
      what do volcanos have to do with Dorothy

    2. Jeremiah

      I mean, not really, it is usually how it goes with a lot of same sex “friendships”. We know for a fact this isn’t the case here due of all the other queer characters in this comic, but I could easily call this queer baiting in a lot of other shows.

  22. C.T. Phipps

    We need to see some alternate universes where Dorothy becomes President and they’re all Fallout-esque Wastelands except the ones where she marries Joyce. Then it’s a Star Trek utopia.

    …

    What? Only me?

    1. David DeLaney

      we’ll always have Narbonic

    2. thejeff

      That’s just Joyce’s comic

    3. HueSatLight

      This is an AU. In Dumbiverse 1, which we left after book 10, Dorothy left for Yale. Walky and Lucy started dating when Lucy worked up the courage to tell him how she felt, and he was better at communicating how he felt. The Lucy and Walky pornographique actually happens.

      Since Dorothy wasn’t around to constantly show up to Prof Nicholson’s office hours, he didn’t leave to become a pundit. Robin had to get a different job. Jason gets deported. Ruth and Billie are together at some point when its snowing, so the drawing of them walking in the snow actually happens.

      You can tell we’ve slid to watching an AU because of minor differences, like Jason’s eyebrows, and which direction Lucy’s door swings.

      No idea if Dorothy eventually becomes president in Dumbiverse 1. or this one either. Now that it’s not her singular goal in life, the chance of her becoming president is slightly higher.

  23. Acher4

    I just adore the last panel <3

  24. staszu13

    Yes, Joyce she is. ❤️

  25. Dday

    Yeah, i don’t think i wanna go to Yale either

  26. Bryy

    Good for you, Dorothy. Now on to the next steps.

  27. Needfuldoer

    Now the hard part: she needs to figure out what’s going to replace that presidency-shaped hole in her ambitions.

    1. Mark

      I think the position was only a tool. The ambition is “make the world better for everyone.”

      1. HueSatLight

        That could be where she ends up, but I don’t think she’s re-examined why she wanted to be president in the first place yet.

  28. Holly

    They’re young and they don’t look blackout drunk, so they *should* still remember this in the morning. I hope.

  29. ValdVin

    Joyce’s eyes on Dorothy’s reveal are a very natural reaction. Good stuff.

  30. milu

    You know what’s *really* ambitious, important and dangerous Dorothy? Agitate for Palestine. Now! Nevermind the sliding timescale, this’ll remain as relevant as it has been for 76 years and counting.

    1. Da Boy

      Oh this could be so nicely solved if all the weapons US Army is giving to Israel to bomb Palestinians could be given to Ukraine. Two birds with one long range missile.

    2. HueSatLight

      Remember earlier in the storyline, when the commentary was all, “what if the campus police and administration find out they’ve been drinking?! They’ll be arrested and kicked out of school!”

      Campus police are for cracking down on students protesting war crimes.

      1. Asky

        No, no, that’s what the National Guard is for – campus police are for making sure the golf kart industry doesn’t die out during the off-season

        1. HueSatLight

          I am talking about what is actually happening right now. At multiple universities, campus police are cracking down on peaceful protestors.

        2. Needfuldoer

          Tin soldiers and Nixon’s coming
          We’re finally on our own

        3. David DeLaney

          i HAVE noted before that the current set of 40-50 year old feral summer reruns are all ones I’ve lived THROUGH once already, long ago and far away

          –Dave, it’s like the current crop of alt-righters and fundies haven’t actualy learnt anything from fairly-recent historical occurrences

  31. Amós Batista

    Alt text: There’s one more secret, about Dorothy liking Joyce

    1. Dara

      yes ^_^

  32. Nicoleandmaggie

    Indiana does have a top public affairs school, right?

    1. Mark

      You tell me whether it’s “top”, but there is the O’Neill School of Public and Environmental Affairs, including the Public Policy Institute; and the Hamilton Lugar School of Global and International Studies. Dorothy is in a good place to bulk up on the things that senior public servants need to know.

    2. Da Boy

      Key question is, is this even something she’ll want to pursue anymore. She is basically in a limbo of not knowing what to do with her life.

    3. HoopsieDaisy

      Yeah, but the real trick to becoming President is being a mediocre law student and then making a lot of friends over the next 30-40 years.

      1. thejeff

        Also, helps if your Dad was President.

  33. Arianod

    Dumbing Of Age Book 14: Just Kiss Already.

    1. FlamestAndLight

      seconded

  34. Pergola

    Dorothy may think she is done with Yale, but I don’t think Yale is done with her. They really really want a lady President on their alumni roster.

  35. Hof1991

    Since Amber and Dorothy both want to protect their friends, they should team up. Amazi-Girl with Dorothy running the support like Oracle.

  36. Nathan

    Finally!!

  37. Beck

    i don’t ship these two, i see it as more of a leslie knope/anne perkins-style homoflirtatious friendship, but i do need them to kiss. and maybe fuck. just once.

    1. HoopsieDaisy

      I think holding hands during “laundry times” is as close as you’re going to get, but good luck. I mean, I won’t be upset if I’m wrong on this one.

      1. Ilucuthen

        I dunno, it feels like things between the two have been and are still building up to… something. Though I’m only expecting a kiss. I kind of expected it in this storyline, but given that it’s looking like it’s about to end… I dunno. Maybe in 2025 or something lol.

    2. Imogen

      Considering Willis has actively used comics of these two acting like a couple (like the Planned Parenthood fake dating scene) in LGBT-themed comic promotion, I’d be very, very surprised if this isn’t going any further than handholding and accidental flirting. It’s got to lead somewhere. Maybe not to a successful romance, but it’s got to lead *somewhere.*

      I do think Willis has a slightly unhealthy addiction to “shock twists” and misleading the audience for its own sake, so it’s totally possible they’re just trying really hard to make us think it’s turning into a a slow-burn love story of some kind so they can pull the rug later and get that “damn you Willis!” dopamine. That being said, you can only trick or shock your audience so many times before it kind of stops being fun. It’s hard to enjoy the story when you’re constantly unsure what the story’s actually trying to get you to feel, you know?

      I hope it’s going somewhere! I like conflict and I like messy sapphic stories!

      1. Imogen

        This part got clipped off, but–
        And I really want to just enjoy being invested in the slow-burn slow-motion train crash that is Dorothy and Joyce realizing there’s attraction. I want to be invested without having to brace for the rug pull! Fingers crossed!

      2. thejeff

        If it turns into something someday, I’m okay with that. I really don’t want it to now, because we’re just starting to explore Joyce dating Joe and that’s interesting enough without throwing this huge spanner into the works.

        I don’t even particularly ship Joe and Joyce, but if we’re doing it, lets do it.

  38. HoopsieDaisy

    Yeah, I’m sure everyone’s out of secrets now.

  39. help i don't like these

    looks like bliss to me

  40. Yeet

    man
    good response from joyce
    bad holding back from dorothy

    1. Taffy

      What’s she holding back? She said the thing.

      1. BBCC

        The alt text seems to imply there’s more but I don’t know what it could be.

        1. Mark

          Reasons for her change of mind?

  41. Straximus

    ?

  42. Imogen

    can we talk about Amazi-Girl’s extreme paranoia though. like girl there’s three of you, you are not generally a desirable target for Miscreants. Even the two of them were probably in more danger of falling over than getting attacked. She just likes being needed.

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