Know damn well
Posted on September 15, 2025 by David M Willis


Tags: dorothy, hank, joyce
read tomorrow's strip early??? and oh hey, Makeship's TRICERAHOODIE DINA PLUSHIE preorders end Tuesday at noon!  That means you got about one more day! Thanks to everyone who came to see me at SPX!  Next time I really gotta bring more Book 1s, and I already brought a buttload!

253 thoughts on “Know damn well”

  1. NGPZ

    ah, i see how it gonna go

    the same kinda good cop bad cop shit as with Charles and Linda (-_-)

    smh

    i need a joint

    1. Embe13

      i just did 3 bowls and i’m out

      1. NGPZ

        fume cuatro porros!!! XD ^-^

        1. Clif

          I think it’s less good cop, bad cop and more distracting cop, deer in the headlights cop.

  2. Cassie

    Ope hank’s getting all the fun new info today huh

    1. Decidedly Orthogonal

      Hey Hank, people’s medication is precisely *none* of your damn business.

      1. Adeptus

        That one will be hard for a dad with their youngest who just left home. Only girl too (as far as he knows).

      2. Nymph

        To be fair, all he’s done is notice something is out on the side in a small room. It’s not like he’s meddling or judging (yet).

        1. zee

          He makes up 50% of Joyce. He’s gonna notice something unexpected and say something about it without thinking it through. Where’d y’all think she gets it from?

        2. zee

          Remember the bear with the nice set of tits?

        3. Nymph

          I think she gets it from autism tbh, but that’s got a strong genetic component, so no argument there.

      3. S.R.

        Observing that a family member is on an unexpected medication, particularly when one hasn’t exactly done the observing on purpose, is fine though. And he kinda seems prone to just saying things without necessarily thinking about them.

  3. Sirksome

    I’ll say it this time to see what happens. Don’t trust birth control.

    1. RassilonTDavros

      I mean I’ll admit that I personally have no expertise on its effectiveness as a contraceptive, but that’s not actually why Joyce is taking it anyway. Like yeah, Hank doesn’t know that, but we do.

      1. anon

        i mean considering joyce is taking it more for ‘pain’ than antipregnancy i’d hope it’d have an effect on her (has she commented about it other than it being a pain to drink/chugging it all with sierra mist?)

      2. anon

        i mean considering joyce is taking it more for ‘pain’ than antipregnancy i’d hope it’d have an effect on her (has she commented about it other than it being a pain to drink/chugging it all with sierra mist?)

    2. Kimi

      Birth control implants (that go in the arm) are more effective than pills, but even those have a small rate of failure. How effective they are for Joyce’s issues, I don’t know. I haven’t tried with my similar pain issues due to the inability to easily stop it if you have bad side effects or if it doesn’t help, unlike the pills. I have been burned enough with bad side effects and no pain help with the pills often enough (especially with random generic changes that the pharmacy does that you can’t reverse), that I am highly suspicious of trying anything new.

    3. Bogeywoman

      I don’t trust birth control (legitimately). I mean, in my case it wouldn’t be for birth control, but have you SEEN the side effects? “This might reduce the excruciating cramping and PMDD symptoms OR it could make them ten times worse and trigger the first psychotic episode in years”

      1. The Queer Agenda [frog memes]

        It can definitely range from quite good for some, to absolutely horrible for others. Even for the same person, one formulation might be awesome while another tries to kill you. Most doctors seem to have zero awareness of that fact. I wish they’d fucking talk to patients about the variety of options, differences between them, and possible side effects.

        Doctors also are worthless when it comes to screening for other health problems that can cause menstrual symptoms. (I have just a tad bit resentment about having to pay to argue with some jackass to confirm a diagnosis I had to make myself, after years of cycling through docs and being blown off, while my entire life derailed. Just burn your worthless medical diplomas in shame if a patient needs to explain shit that’s so basic, you could have looked it up on wikipedia.)

        1. Bogeywoman

          Bad doctors are a plague. It took me ages to find my regular clinic which is usually great (specialise in LGBT health, have specialists for sexual health and gender affirmative care). My GP is a gay man and not helpful with menstrual-related topcis, but the sexual health nurse is a great advocate. Unfortunately my options are either -take a bunch of medicines to counter all the PMDD symptoms and accept the dysphoria, or shell out the rebate for an oophorectomy and go through menopause at 33. I want the latter, but they have to “explore alternatives” first and it’s friggen expensive.

        2. Li

          It’s the medical misogyny /nodnod

        3. Kimi

          It is scary the misogyny in medicine, especially with testing for effectiveness and side effects in pharmaceuticals. Those scary, always changing female hormones that research scientists don’t want to deal with since it “adds an extra variable” to the study, even though at least half will probably be on the drug. As someone with a science degree, it makes me ashamed.

        4. Kimi

          I had a doctor that my cramps would get better when I got older, and I was in my thirties. Same talking point that they used when I was a teenager and they didn’t want to actually do anything to help the problem.
          Not to mention the primary care doctor that insisted that I didn’t have asthma and instead that my breathing issues were caused by acid reflux. Ignoring that I was actually diagnosed with asthma by my allergy doctor (after I had covid, who said it wasn’t unusual), and that my asthma gets triggered by things like breathing smoke, stress and strenuous physical exercise. I wouldn’t have minded as much if the doctor had just thought it was only a factor, but to outright deny that I have asthma when I have trouble breathing when there is forest fire smoke in the air is just crazy. Finding a good doctor is so hard.

      2. yet_one_more_idiot

        My sister was prescribed birth control to control her period cramps. It once accidentally caused a stroke that landed her in hospital for a week. She’s now prescribed a different brand that does not have that particular side-effect….

      3. zee

        Depends person to person, mine saved me from monthly internal bleeding with minimal side effects. I got angrier instead of my usual sadness and a little more assertive when I started on them, which I frankly consider an improvement. My hormones are worse off than on. The first brand I tried DID give me the worst agony of my life and a month long period tho so, again. Varies.

    4. Rectilinear Propagation

      I’d argue the problem is more with doctors and the general discourse around birth control (and women’s health in general) than birth control itself.

    5. S.R.

      Well, yes, it’s not 100% effective at preventing pregnancy and people should know that, but stopping one’s menstrual cycle with hormonal birth control is an important part of treating endometriosis. Not only to stop them being in severe pain every month, but because every cycle means more inflammation, more damage, and spreading adhesions, so continuing to menstruate can not just make the pain worse, but can wind up causing infertility and organ damage.

      And yes, estrogen-based birth control has some risks, but given that the risks of endometriosis (aside from the stress caused by the pain and the very real trauma that can result from being in severe, unstoppable pain on a regular basis) include intestinal perforation, it’s still worth considering. And there’s a progesterone-only birth control that, though less effective at preventing pregnancy, is much safer and equally as effective. There are also implants and IUDs (and in some countries a sort of rubber ring that goes, ah, into the same portion of one’s reproductive anatomy where tampons go), which have fewer side effects, especially the ones that are directly applied to the reproductive anatomy. So someone with endometriosis really should be on /some/ form of birth control unless they’re actively trying to birth.

      1. thejeff

        While it’s not 100% effective at preventing pregnancy it’s pretty damn effective. Certainly more than just relying on condoms – even better if combined with condoms.

        And while side effects are possible, as they are with most medications, they’re pretty rare and the solution is usually just to switch to a different variant.

  4. C.T Phipps

    I bet Hank would be fine about Joyce having those but Joyce would never believe it.

    And both would completely ignore they’re not for sex.

    Because their brains are so locked in “birth control=for sex.”

    1. Ray Radlein

      “Where we’re going, Dorothy, we won’t need it for sex” — Joyce

    2. bubba0077

      I mean, it is right in the name.

      1. Deanatay

        Maybe “ovary control pills”?

    3. anon

      shame there’s not an alternate name for it because if you told girls “hey take this and you don’t have to worry about a period anymore” when they first hit puberty i’d think 90+ % of them would agree

      tho i remember some girls saying ‘yeah i use it for acne’ not sure if it was like an ‘excuse’ or so/not admitting to be sexually active during class/near a teacher but wonder if there’d be stuff in that you can just put in cleanser (be hilarious if it was a side effect ‘use this cleanser for your pores AND hook up with someone tonight with no worries/less tedious than a condom’ or whatever bs commercial)

      1. Cimorene

        As an AFAB that had a parent that was of the mind, “Being a woman isn’t a disability and suck up your cycle pain.” getting on birth control was absolutely “for acne”. I wound up having endometriosis and for a few years wondered if birth control caused it, but I think it actually treated it.

        And even on birth control condoms are bare minimum to prevent STIs.

      2. Li

        Just shoring up Cimorene’s reply: yes, the pill we typically mean when we talk about hormonal birth control , which contains estrogen, is a legitimate treatment for acne.

        Can’t speak to whether the specific girls who told you they were taking it for that were being entirely truthful, but I do enjoy the idea that you could ever put enough of ANYTHING in a cleanser for it to be a significant treatment for… literally ANYTHING. Cleansers are on your skin for less than a minute! That is not enough time to sink in.

        (This is why “moisturizing” “anti aging” whatever else on a cleanser is a waste of money, by the by. If your cleanser is too stripping, get something marketed for sensitive skin, and put on moisturizer right after.)

        Additional fun facts: acne is partly hormonal. Which is why you’ll hear folks who take testosterone talk about worsening acne as a possible side effect, and folks who take estrogen talk about the opposite.

        1. Cimorene

          I’m almost 40 and testosterone improved my skin, but the “oil cleansing method” was better than anything for my skin. I still get cystic acne from time to time, but that is just my body.

      3. thejeff

        In a way it’s a shame, but at the same time, preventing unwanted pregnancies is a big deal and should just be a normal part of health care. It is the main purpose of the pill and it really shouldn’t be a source of shame for girls.
        I get it. If a different name and a different labelled purpose made it more acceptable for more girls to take it – for acne or for bad periods or whatever, that’s great, but I hate that we pretend that birth control isn’t health care and that it shouldn’t just be normal and available, even if you’re not planning on having sex.

    4. thejeff

      If he was fine with it, he wouldn’t be commenting on it.

      I mean, he might come around, especially if he learned she started them for the period pain, but the initial reaction of people who are fine with birth control isn’t to point them out.

      1. Nymph

        He might be fine with it, but confused why he didn’t know about it. I doubt Joyce has made many medical decisions without his input up to this point (if any).

        I don’t totally believe he’s fine with it, but commenting doesn’t mean judgement really.

        1. Dot

          I think he’s just a little startled. He’s a medical professional himself, he probably has some awareness of the medical benefits of birth control unrelated to sex.

        2. Nymph

          That’s fair. I totally agree about his awareness of birth control, and that there’s a chance he’s just surprised.

          I think there’s an even chance he’s still following some of the beliefs he indoctrinated into his children and those might also be at play. He might get judgy, I’m just encouraging waiting and finding out rather than trying to guess his whole philosophy from one line. (Not a comment on you, just my motives)

    5. Wizard

      Would discussing his daughter’s “feminine problems” be any less awkward?

    6. furubatsu

      It kinda reminds me of when my Devoutly Catholic mother found a condom wrapper stuck inside my jacket, my blood went cold in anticipation of her reaction but it was basically “If I was going to know this is happening, I’m happy I found out this way instead of you being pregnant”

  5. Dot

    “Yep! I’m a friend of Joyce! And Joyce is a friend of Dororthy!”

    1. StClair

      always has been

    2. Ray Radlein

      GDI I was going to make that exact joke (again)

    3. Proxiehunter

      The biggest!

      1. deliverything

        If you look up “friend of Dorothy” in the dictionary, you’d find her picture!

  6. mindbleach

    Breaking: entire narrative hit by five ton truck on Medicare.

  7. AbacusWizard

    holy crow, the kissing/consequences poll is genuinely tied at this moment

    1. Patrick

      i voted kissing this morning and it’s still ONE ahead, you’re welcome everyone

      1. Lumino

        I balanced you out.

      2. AbacusWizard

        Yes… ha ha ha… yes!

    2. Thag Simmons

      A roughly 50/50 balance feels extremely correct for that.

      1. Embe13

        i havent seen it more that the 60 votes that the difference is currently

    3. Madock345

      Really needed a “Both” option XD

      1. Freemage

        Seriously. I want to form a new contingent–Sicko Paladins, who demand more kisses, of increasing intimacy, but always matched by ever-more-dramatic consequences. Frenching causes hurricanes like butterfly wings on steroids; boob-nuzzles cause wildfires of record proportions, one of them going down on the other produces city-leveling tsunamis, and 69 triggers the Yellowstone supervolcano, creating an ash bed that reaches the westernmost border of Indiana.

        1. Bogeywoman

          When they finally have sex (after being constantly interrupted by consequences) it marks the change in comic from comedic slice-of-life to apocalyptic action-horror

      2. Tan

        CONSEQISSES

        1. Nymph

          This. This is what I want.

    4. Sirksome

      Where’s the “I don’t care as long as everyone becomes worse.” option?

      1. BYM!

        Wait 22 hours and the next strip button should be available

      2. Bogeywoman

        – Mike Warner, 2020

    5. Cimorene

      I showed my partner the poll and he agrees with the “Why not both?” I feel.

      “Knowing Willis it’s going to wind up being both.”-partner
      “God I hope so!”-me

      “Are you a relationship paladin or a sicko?”-me
      “What?!”-partner

    6. 3oranges

      I guess Hank might be a win for the consequences side, but I doubt it’s really what either side was going for.

    7. Sharizard

      I usually just enjoy the ride of this strip but i admit i’m getting a little flustered over what kind of consequences people are insisting happen at this point. Other than Joyce’s mum and the eventual awkwardness that may be Dorothy assuming Joyce has broken up with Joe, i’m struggling to think what else could be happening consequence-wise that hasn’t yet.

    8. Needfuldoer

      I’m doing my part!

  8. Patrick

    you know what they say

    a friend of joyce is a friend of dorothy

  9. Synnerman

    Hank said “damn!” Y’all are in really trouble now!

  10. QueenofSodor

    “Friend of Joyce” is like being a Friend of Dorothy but with far more disastrous implications

  11. Amara

    The way Hank immediately says you know who tf I mean makes me think he’s actually aware of Jocelyn’s transition, at least to an extent, but is not supportive? Either that or he’s just grouchy that he’s been lied to and he can’t get ahold of his 3rd child.

    1. EpochFlame

      iirc hank was concerned jocelyn was spotted at the protest and most likely is concerned for his children’s safety (without knowing anything else that is going on)

    2. Minivet

      We don’t need to read between the lines for that, no? He sent Joyce that text with the photo.

      1. Minivet

        Oh, for some reason I remembered the photo he sent as showing Jocelyn in femme presentation, but in fact it seems ambiguous: https://www.dumbingofage.com/2025/comic/book-15/04-the-only-exception/pervasively/

        1. deliverything

          Well, that’s understandable. As I understand it, many transgirls are just so feminine they struggle to present as their assigned gender.

          (And yet some people still manage not to get it.)

    3. Envy

      Eh, I think Hank just thinks Joyce is covering for Jocelyne being at the protest

    4. Lars

      Or he doesn’t like that Jocelyne protests protests against America arming Bulmeria.

    5. Myra V

      My guess is that he knows about Jocelyne transitioning (after all, she started off by telling Joyce that she needed to tell her something before Joyce heard it from their dad), but didn’t think that Joyce knew yet – which, given how attentive Joyce has been to what’s been going on with her family otherwise is rather a safe assumption to make. Of course, at this point I think he’s cottoned on to the fact that Joyce knows about Jocelyne, and he’s grumpy about Joyce having lied to him about Jocelyne being there.

      We’ll have to see how things go going forward, since there’s not much we can draw about what family drama is about to blow up currently. But, one way or the other, it’s probably going to be spicy (and I’m hoping for a tag team between all the girls (Joyce, Becky, Jocelyne, Becky, and Dorothy) helping him to understand the whole gender and sexuality thing (and Jocelyne working with Becky to work through the issues she’s having with potentially having her sexuality shift as well).

  12. ProfNekko

    ok Dorothy you’re jumping the lead there… But I suppose that’s her typical behavior

  13. Dread Pirate Robin

    And how exactly does Hank know what birth control pills look like *insert doakes meme*

    1. Cassie

      They tend to come in very distinctive packaging, and I would not be surprised if pictures were circulated among parents just in case.

      1. Thag Simmons

        Also, Hank works in a medical field. Dentist not doctor, but still, it’s the sort of job that demands at least a bit of pharmaceutical knowledge.

        1. Slartibeast Button, BIA

          Yes because he has to be aware of how medications he prescribes might interact with others the patient might be taking.

      2. Strain Of Thought

        I think the joke is that with Hank having so many kids, Carol can’t have been using birth control.

    2. RassilonTDavros

      My guess is that he and Carol weren’t quite as far up the fundy rabbit hole forty years ago, and got up to far more premarital hanky-panky than their present-day selves would like to admit.

      1. Astariel

        I agree. I strongly suspect John showing up caused a hasty wedding, and given what seems to be at least a 10 year age gap between John and Jocelyne, I wouldn’t be surprised if Hank and Carol were using birth control back then.

  14. Boh No

    top tier faces tonight. Everyone in peak form.

  15. Jeff K!

    Dorothy, the answer is “Yes, they regulate Joyce’s incredibly painful periods so she can function four weeks of the month instead of three.”

  16. reddslym

    Wait Hank can be a nickname for “Harry”?

    1. Twinsword

      Indeed! Also, Hal, as in Prince Hal, of England!

    2. Casi

      Yup, Hank is believed to come from the Dutch “Henk” which is short for “Hendrik” which is related to Harry, Harvey, and Henry

    3. John Campbell

      Well, they’re both nicknames for “Henry”, so…

    4. Taffy

      Basically, if your name starts with H, you can be Hank.

      1. Tawnee

        MC Hank, Hank the Lovebug, Hank of Troy.

        Yup, checks out.

    5. anon

      i’d imagine you could extrapolate anything

      like ‘how do you get dick from richard’ ‘you ask him nicely’ is that one poist i first thought of

      1. eh, whatever

        Pronounce it in a baby accent.

    6. HueSatLight

      Dorothy might doing the thing where it’s technically true and included in a Wikipedia article or something, but its a lot less likely in practice where they are.

    7. Oz

      I was thinking the same thing, how tf is Hank a nickname for Henry or Harry?? English language nicknames make absolutely no sense

      1. Invisible Bard

        I don’t think they’re actually stranger than nicknames in a lot of other languages! Russian is an obvious example, with Alexander turned into Sasha, Vladimir turned into Vova, and so on, but just about every language has some less-than-intuitive diminutives for various names. German turns Heinrich (the direct analogue of Henry) into Heinz and Ludwig into Lutz. Spanish turns Francisco into Paco and José into Pepe. Italian turns Francesco (and Federico, and Enrico) into Chicco and Giuseppe into everything from Beppino to Peppenuzzo. There are reasons for all of those based on the origins of the names in question, how they evolved over time, and how diminutives are structured in each language, but they’re all likely to puzzle non-native speakers.

        (tl;dr names are weird and language is fun.)

  17. gnoka

    So from this strip I don’t think he knows about the kiss or we’d have a reaction.

    So did he see the newspaper and notice Jocelyne, but not recognize the back of Joyce’s head?

    1. Wraithy2773

      In fairness, the birth control can simply be explained as “its medicine she needs to prevent her ovary from putting her in debilitating pain every other month”, and most fathers would go stonefaced and accept it on sight.

      1. Wraithy2773

        Gah, this was supposed to be a new comment…

        1. gnoka

          hi welcome to my comment chain its nice to have u 🙂

      2. Thing 2

        Is that really how USA fathers are?

        1. Taffy

          Some of them, yes. I imagine other countries have menstruation and men who are uncomfortable discussing it in detail.

        2. Thing 2

          Yeah, we have menstruation. People talk about it. I dare say *some* people are uncomfortable talking about it. The comment said most fathers. Not the same as some fathers. Therefore the seeking of clarification.

        3. Taffy

          People often use the word “most” in a hyperbolic way. It’s not always meant to be taken as a literal statistical description of reality.

        4. Wraithy2773

          Saying “most” was probably overkill.

          I think a large number of fathers like Hank, who grew up and lives in a very Christian area but aren’t complete dicks, would just kinda go stonefaced and accept that this is something they don’t know about but will just accept that the ladies know what’s going on there.

          But yeah, there’s also just a general culture of discomfort towards aspects of menstruation among American men. Not universal or as simple as “that’s women’s problems that I don’t want no part of”, but still just a general cultural unwillingness to really be open about it.

    2. Dedlok

      I think the newspaper Hank saw Jocelyne in was a regular newspaper. And the kiss was in the Campus Newspaper. Which is only distributed on campuse, which Dorthy and Joyce grabbed a bunch of already to try to lessen the chance of people seeing it while wandering the campus.

      1. HueSatLight

        The student paper does a daily newsletter email, and Joyce guesses he reads that.

      2. butting

        Turning the lights on definitely and absolutely lessens the chance of Hank seeing the giant stack of campus newspapers right beside him.

        1. deliverything

          For anyone wondering about the exact location of that stack:
          https://www.dumbingofage.com/2025/comic/book-16/01-not-so-smooth-criminals/knowdamnwell/

        2. butting

          would you believe

          https://www.dumbingofage.com/2025/comic/book-16/01-not-so-smooth-criminals/fifffteeenlol/

        3. deliverything

          …oops. Thank you. How did I paste the current page’s link?

    3. Stormtide Leviathan

      He might not have seen the newspaper at all. Remember that the entire reason joyce and dorothy went out there to the protest was cause of a text from hank asking about jocelyn; there were other pictures of her getting out already

    4. Alongcameaspider

      I mean its entirely possible he hasn’t seen the newspaper, it was publisher today and he was likely preoccupied driving to the college to check

      All we know that he knows at this moment is Jocylene was at the protest, likely from a picture from a newspaper earlier in the week, the police used force to break it up, and there are birth control pills in Joyce’s dorm room

    5. Kyulen

      He might not have seen today’s newspaper, but he did see a picture of Jocelyne at the protest previously. And Joyce told him she didn’t see her “brother” in response back then. I would include a link to the strip where that happened but this site is loading really slow right now and I don’t even know if this comment will go through. It was when Joyce and Dorothy went to do laundry before going to the protest.

    6. Thing 2

      Cue Hank: Oh hey, student newspaper! What’s on the front page?

    7. Summer

      I doubt he’s seen today’s student paper because he’s been busy driving out there this morning to come check on Jocelyne.

      1. Thing 2

        Sorry, I should have reminded about the pile of papers just inside the door…

  18. EpochFlame

    hank is having a wild day

  19. Dawn

    That might be my favourite Joyce Face in the whole comic.

  20. Sirksome

    How much of where this goes depends on Hank giving a damn about IU news?

  21. Shakes

    Odds on them simply telling the truth the pills are for medicinal purposes vs concocting an elaborate lie that will end up causing more problems?

    1. Taffy

      “I started fucking Dorothy, and since you and Mom were dogshit at teaching me sex ed, I got worried she might get me girl-pregnant. Gregnant, if you will.”

      1. Proxiehunter

        Last time I got Gregnant it was because I’d been messing around with a Luigi board.

      2. BarerMender

        “Here cock is quite large, you know. I don’t know if that matters.”

        1. Sajuuk-Khar

          Hank: “I went to IU, Joyce, I know how big the cock is around here. You don’t have to brief me on the anacondas.”

        2. BarerMender

          Her cock

      3. Big Z

        Intrusive flashback to “HOW IS BABBY FORMED?”

        1. DocHarleen

          WILL IT HURT BABY TOP OF HEAD

        2. Sajuuk-Khar

          They need to DO WAY INSTAIN MOTHER

          who KILL thier babby

          Becaus these babby can’t frigth back?!!

      4. John Campbell

        The term is lesbian pregnant.

  22. Shiro

    Exactly what we needed! A third thing to cause conflict with Joyce’s dad. Maybe if we’re lucky the birth control pills (explainable) will distract him from Jocelyne and the newspaper

  23. DJTsurugi

    I am not liking Hank being possibly transphobic after he was the supportive parent before… I hope we’re just misreading it, maybe he isn’t aware? ~<3

    1. Armadillo

      I feel like he’s probably not aware. Parents usually aren’t the first people to be told about these sorts of things, since bad reactions from them can be much worse due to the power they hold over you. It’s why I knew my sister was bi for years before my parents were told. No matter how much you trust your parents there’s always going to be a safer option.

    2. Dawn

      Hank has been in a cult for so long, it’s going to be way harder for him to deprogram than Joyce. It might take a bit for him to wrap his head around his “son” really being his daughter. I can’t see him ever disowning Jocelyne or no longer loving her, but I CAN see it taking him a lot longer for him to recognize her as a girl. I think he will come around, he’s a good person who loves and respects his kids, but being NOT a bigot is pretty new for him.

    3. Bryy

      I mean, if anything else in this strip is to go by, it’ll be drawn out for max tension.

      1. butting

        Nah, that’s just to do with how slow the site’s running.

      2. Jon

        If it resolves within the next fifteen minutes, that’s about three weeks of strips, so…

    4. ESM

      I can’t believe a parent in Dumbing of Age is an asshole. Truly unprecedented behavior.

    5. 3oranges

      Hank is still the guy who needed to be talked out of insisting that Joyce not associate with atheists. I assume he’s been told even worse lies about trans people, because *gestures at everything*.

  24. BorkBorkBork

    Joyce, if you are forced to choose between deadnaming and outing, please choose the option that keeps your sister safe, not the one that you feel makes you an ally.

    Not that I truly feel Hank is unsafe, but he’s being extremely grumpy here.

    … then again, you could avoid both by just replying, very honestly, that you haven’t seen any of your brothers in months.

    I never really realized just how gendered our language is until I considered just how hard it would be to avoid saying pronouns and thus attracting suspicion, to avoid outing someone. Even the lack of pronouns or gender neutral pronouns would arise suspicion.

    1. Mr D phone posting

      Now imagine Spanish or french, where every single word is gendered! You see that chair? Female. You see that fridge? Male.

      1. BarerMender

        We anglophones got really lucky. Old English was gendered as all get out.

      2. Thing 2

        Mine identifies and a transchaise.

    2. anon

      i mean she could say ‘siblings’ but dont think anyone’s told joyce about htose nuances

    3. thejeff

      “I haven’t seen my brothers in months” is technically honest, but will be seen as deceptive pretty easily. Don’t worry about misgendering or deadnaming her. Don’t even try to dance around using names or pronouns.
      And figure out what you’re trying to cover for. Do you need to hide that Jocelyne was at the protest? Or just the trans part?

      1. Myra V

        Especially since she ALREADY played that card earlier in the arc, and I’m fair certain is a large part of why Hank is cranky here.

      2. BorkBorkBork

        It’s the trans part. Jocylene never asked Joyce to hide the fact that she was in the protest, so any hiding there would be essentially to try to cover up the “technically-not-a-lie” lie by omission from the previous day’s text.

        Jocelyne hasn’t come out to her parents yet. She’s taking HRT, she’s basically out, but she’s out as an adult living on her own in a completely different town than her parents and the rest of her family. She controls how and when and in what manner she interacts with them, and considering just how concerned she was with coming out to Joyce, I’m sure she doesn’t want Joyce to out her, when the consequences of it might be losing that relationship forever.

        I get the feeling that Jocelyne used to feel that both here parents were a lost cause; a relationship that was doomed to end. But Joyce voiced on that telephone call that she thought her dad was more open-minded and accepting, which Joss listened to, and was considering.

        So I don’t think the right thing to do in this case is to blunder into accidently outing her sister while her dad’s already pissed that his kids are lying to him, or to stick her tongue out and go, “No, but did you mean MY SISTER?!” before throwing a smoke bomb and disappearing ninja-style.

        1. thejeff

          Then if there’s no need to hide the protest part, then the response is simple. “Yeah, he was at the protest. I heard from him earlier this morning, he’s fine. Sorry I didn’t let you know earlier, things got crazy after I saw him there. Let me text him and see if he’s still in town or if he got a ride home.”

          Which gives her a chance to let Jocelyne know Hank’s here looking for her and puts the ball in her court for how to handle Hank.

          Outing her is obviously the wrong move of course.

        2. BorkBorkBork

          Still feels icky though.

    4. Josh

      I’d be pretty cranky too honestly if my kids were avoiding me and were both in very dangerous and very provable situations recently. Everything else aside.

  25. Doopyboop

    This strip makes me appreciate that my parents had decided when I was still young “our parents always made sex seem taboo and awful, when our daughter comes of age, we should do our best to be supportive and honest with her regarding sex. We’ve rather she talk with us about guys she is interested in rather than think she needs to hide it from us and wind up in trouble”.

    …Which just makes the irony of the fact that I’m a biromantic sex-repulsed asexual kinda funny, but I appreciate that my parents were trying to be prepared and open.

    1. deliverything

      I’m tempted to joke you were rebelling against your parents. “If they’re cool with sex, I’m gonna hate it! Anything parents like inherently can’t be good!”

  26. Kyulen

    I’m still not sure if Hank knows Jocelyne is trans, or if he doesn’t know and thinks Joyce is lying to him about having seen her “brother” recently.

    1. Needfuldoer

      Or he knows but doesn’t know Joyce knows.

      1. Myra V

        That’s my guess, based on what Jocelyne texted to Joyce just before Joyce found out that Jocelyne is trans. I THINK Hank is supportive and accepting based on his appearances previously in the comic, but… Well, he DID go to a deeply conservative Evangelical church, and it’s not at all certain that he hasn’t taken the hate they spread about LGBTQIA+ people to heart…

        1. BorkBorkBork

          Here’s one thing in support of “Hank’s more open-minded than we think.”

          Joyce was basically unable to swear for the longest time. Not just “that’s wrong,” but seriously had some major blocks. I was the same way growing up. Part of it was my faith, but my parents were not fundies (ELCA, which is on the liberal side of Lutheranism, they have openly LGBTQ clergy). But I had gone through my entire childhood without hearing my parents curse once.

          If my parents had done it, it would have normalized it, it would have recontextualized it as “only do this when you’re really upset” or “sometimes adults say this but it’s not for kids,” but they never cursed, period. And fundie churches are so much more rigid.

          So for Hank to just drop “damn well” – not as in talking about damnation, religiously, but simply to embellish the phrase “You know very well who I’m talking about” – signifies that Hank is far more of an outsider to the church than he was early this year. He isn’t caring about keeping up appearances or being clean in his words. Consider how Toedad spoke – always very careful with what he said, sticking to the rules of his faith.

          I guess, TLDR, I’m pretty sure Joyce takes after her dad, and he’s already passed the “I can say fuck” stage.

        2. Needfuldoer

          Joyce: “Yeah, well, [Ross] was an asshole.”
          Hank: “Heh, damn right he was.”

          https://www.dumbingofage.com/occasionally/

  27. IntangibleMatter

    hahahahahaha

    I love how ambiguous everything he’s saying here is and how it’s all deliberately framed to make it unclear if he’s unsupportive or just surprised or what have you

    hahahhaha this is fine

    hahahahaha damn you, Willis

  28. darkoneko

    Hank, stay focused please.

    1. deliverything

      That’s what the glasses are for!

  29. ZombieKyrik

    I hope Hank is trying to not out Jocelyn instead of refusing to accept her for who she is; I hope this just a matter of not wanting his child to be at a protest where she could get hurt.

    I don’t know about anyone else, but it would be really nice to see Hank be infinitely better than carol when it comes to accepting their children for who they are.

    1. RassilonTDavros

      That’s not an impossibility, though I’m not sure that really scans with the “you know damn well” line. Could be he suspects Joss is out to her but isn’t positive?

      1. thejeff

        Even without the whole trans thing, “what brother” is weird. John’s off in India. Jordan’s been no contact for years. Hank texted her asking about Jocelyne yesterday. It’s obvious who he talking about. Joyce’s response is suspicious – because Joyce isn’t a smooth liar and Hank knows that.

    2. Huttj

      I suspect it’s a “lots going on all at once and will process things at other times, don’t get cute with me.”

  30. Just Jim

    There’s nothing wrong with Hank’s eyesight. That may be the only part of Hank with which there is nothing wrong, however.

  31. HueSatLight

    https://www.dumbingofage.com/loft/ When did Hank get glasses?

    1. ZombieKyrik

      It’s possible that he normally wears contacts, or simply doesn’t wear them all the time.

    2. Li

      https://www.dumbingofage.com/2020/comic/book-11/02-look-straight-ahead/contacts/

      Second panel.

    3. anon

      if he drove here maybe he needed glasses for that, tho at that age weirder if he didn’t have glasses

      1. Thing 2

        What age? I only wear glasses for driving. My short sight has improved markedly after I hit 60. But, yes, I do wear glasses to drive, mainly because it is a legal requirement that I do.

    4. HueSatLight

      joke failed to land

      1. Taffy

        What’s the joke?

  32. Icalasari

    Hank. Hank, you’ve been good before. Do NOT become lumped in with your ex wife

    1. esolo

      I don’t think he’s going to go full Carol, but it wouldn’t surprise me if there’s some…backsliding(?) in this storyline. It’s a lot to digest, especially for someone with Hank’s background. I expect he’ll do his best, though, even if his initial reaction is not ideal.

  33. Suet

    you damn well know it’s short for Hankerchief

    Why would Hank say that it’s not good for her eyes to hang out in the dark with–

    1. Thing 2

      …out the lights on

      1. deliverything

        Guess he still believes that “darkness damages your eyes” myth.

        The reading version is myth 6 in https://www.millcreekeye.com/15-eye-myths-everyone-thinks-are-true/

    2. poofdepoof

      Aw, but handkerchief is one of my favorite silent D’s

  34. Dean

    Isn’t Harry also short for Henry, though?

    1. Taffy

      Harry is short for his age.

  35. Ado

    Iconic panel 1 face.

    Funny depiction of how some yesterday discussed Joyce possibly responding.

  36. Reaver

    Why do you know birth control at a glance Hank?

    1. Taffy

      He likes the taste.

      1. Reaver

        It doesn’t taste like anything tho

        1. Taffy

          Well, he is a white Christian in the American Midwest.

        2. Reaver

          Ah, they’d be too spicy for him I understand

    2. Heavensrun

      They tend to have pretty distinct packaging.

      1. Reaver

        Naw, lots of japanese candies also come in a similar blisterpack lol

        1. Taffy

          Okay, what Japanese candies do you think Hank Brown is eating? I guarantee this man has never knowingly interacted with anything Japanese in his entire life.

        2. Reaver

          That’s not true! He’s probably eaten a sushi once-

          Granted a California roll-

        3. Taffy

          I do not believe in that reality. He looks at sushi and thinks it’s full of MSG, which he’s pretty sure stands for Made Strictly Godless.

        4. John Campbell

          Yeah, look back at Joyce’s visit to McAwesome’s and then tell me this is a girl whose family eats a lot of sushi.

        5. deliverything

          I’m now going to headcanon that Hank’s secretly an ardent Sailor Moon fan, which he’ll never admit to anyone.

          But your guarantee isn’t threatened, because he somehow doesn’t realise it’s Japanese, unlike all that “heathen japanimation”. After all, by his logic, anything he enjoys could never come from a non-Christian country.

          Also, he completely believes Neptune and Uranus are just cousins.

        6. Rogue 7

          Has he ever had a Kit Kat?

          At this point Japan has basically brute-forced them into being “Japanese snacks”

    3. anon

      other than (anti) propaganda he’s prolly had some patients with them before , awkward to take that kinda medicdine in front of your dentist but i can imagine some patients or assitants having them and him not being the kinda dentist that’d refuse service just b/c of that even tho there’s anecdotes of pharamcy stores refusing that

    4. Yumi

      While when I took birth control pills, they came in a standard rectangular blister pack– I’ve also taken antidepressants that were packaged this way, so while it might not be the most common style, it’s not unique to birth control. Joyce’s pills, however, are in circular packaging that absolutely makes them look “distinctly birth control.” Might be other things packaged that way, but I do think birth control is the strongest candidate for that packaging.
      https://www.dumbingofage.com/2024/comic/book-14/04-for-me-it-was-tuesday/wherehaveyoubeen/

    5. HueSatLight

      why wouldn’t he?

  37. BYM!

    New Joyce face just dropped

  38. ESM

    Hank appears to be staring at Dorothy’s boobs when he asks “are those birth control pills” but in a way he’s still right.

    But also does Joyce keep her pills in a box labeled “BIRTH CONTROL PILLS”?

    1. Ray Radlein

      The packaging is usually very distinctive. Not just a typical “While pushing down turn” ” pill bottle

      1. Thing 2

        I’d say they were among the earliest pills to be in bubble packs with days printed on to help you take them regularly, but in my experience, lots of pills come like that now, because the consequences of not knowing if you have taken one or not can be equally dire. Either overdose, or no dose.

        1. The Queer Agenda [frog memes]

          The 4th week is usually a different color than the rest of the pills, so it might still be obvious what it is at a glance.

          I think Joyce did have one of the circular dial style packs in a strip years ago.

        2. Big Z

          Having just had this discussion with my partner and teen, apparently that’s not “usually” anymore for some areas of the world where it’s more common to prescribe the type that just give you a constant dosage rather than the week off.

          They still come in the distinctive blister packs tho. Partner’s latest have little day/week labels so you can keep track even if they’re packaged in a rectangle and all look the same.

        3. Yumi

          Here’s a link showing Joyce’s circular dial pack, since I waded through this slow loading site to dig it up: https://www.dumbingofage.com/2024/comic/book-14/04-for-me-it-was-tuesday/wherehaveyoubeen/

        4. Slartibeast Button, BIA

          I believe in the early days the dosage changed from day to day, gradually increasing until the day it dropped to zero. So taking a specific pill on a specific day was important.

          Some versions then just had you skip taking them for 5 days, but many gave you five inert pills just so you could keep in the habit.

          But this was how birth control pills were 50 years ago. As Big Z notes, things have changed since then. But the packaging style may have stayed the same out of inertia.

        5. Big Z

          Half inertia, half the same reason that you got the inert pills, I bet — easier to keep the habit if it’s nice and pre-labeled for you, especially given that the consequences of skipping a single BC dose can be “whoops, doesn’t work as well for a month” based on the label cautions.

    2. Bemisawa

      On the contrary, I can only imagine Joyce would keep her birth control pills in a box labeled “DEFINITELY NOT BIRTH CONTROL PILLS”.

    3. Invisible Bard

      No, but she keeps them in the packaging they came in, which is a pink, dial-shaped case. I don’t know of any other type of medication that is typically packaged that way, and certainly not of any medication as common as birth control is that is typically packaged that way. It’s honestly pretty equivalent to a box labeled “BIRTH CONTROL PILLS.”

      To be fair, I also don’t actually know offhand of any modern-day birth control that’s still packaged that way (thought there may still be some brands that do so), but that was the classic birth control packaging for long enough that it is entirely reasonable for it to be the way someone would depict BC in a visual medium like a comic strip. Most BC today tends to come in blister packs rather than a case (which is a shame; the sturdy cases were nicer), and to be laid out as a 7×4 rectangle of pills rather than as a circle (which is good; most of us are far more used to reading calendars with that shape). Willis choosing to use a “Joyce’s birth control pills unmistakably look like birth control pills” version of the packaging does pretty naturally lead to “characters in-universe are also likely to think that Joyce’s birth control pills look like birth control pills.”

  39. anon

    interesting he can recognize them so easily but that’s one way to distract him

    imagine if she told him “hey i’m dating joe the one that had a sex tape with that politician’s sister who’s know one of our profs!”

  40. BarerMender

    I wouldn’t be surprised if Carol is taking pills for the same reason as Joyce.

    1. Invisible Bard

      Given that I believe Carol is supposed to be in her 60s at this point, I would.

      But it wouldn’t be terribly surprising if she were on HRT, or if she secretly *used* to be on birth control to help with painful periods, even though she apparently taught Joyce that painful periods were a divine punishment for Eve’s sins that women and girls were just supposed to accept.

  41. AK

    …is that an entire stack of newspapers with you two kissing on the front?

  42. Steamweed

    I like panel 1 for non-spoilery previews. Clearly Joyce is a deer in the oncoming headlights. But SO many options for said oncoming headlights.

  43. Zamperla

    Joyce is havin a hell of a day emotional state wise, huh

  44. Yeet

    now I’m wondering whether hank saw becky walk out near to tears

    1. Yeet

      I’m also wondering whether joss actually told her dad about being a girl yet since she said she was telling joyce before she heard it from hank but went to the protest like straight after iirc

      1. Yeet

        also the poll is a false choice the answer is obviously both

  45. Mr. Random

    I do wonder how far back the “friend of Dorothy” line was planted intentionally.

    1. thejeff

      It was used back in the Whiteboard Dingdong Bandit story, so a long time back.

      Whether Joyce was intended to be bi that far back or if it was just a joking reference then is harder to tell.

  46. Dot

    I do think the poll is a false dichotomy. Dorothy and Joyce can kiss all they please, but there should still be more consequences related to the cheating (again, all this stuff with the newspaper and Becky and Hank are not related to the cheating).

    1. HueSatLight

      The last false dichotomy poll fueled a lot of incoherent vindictiveness.

      There’s been very little consequences from the cheating so far, so more consequences doesn’t even make sense. Walky shrugged it off to them, and Joe said it was his plan all along. Sarah was cross with them. that’s been it.

    2. thejeff

      Which isn’t to say the consequences of the kiss (and the new relationship in general) don’t make for interesting story potential, they’re just not actually the consequences for cheating we were looking for.

      1. Dot

        Yes of course.

  47. APW

    I guess I’ve finally managed to pinpoint why I’ve been so disapointed with this comic of late (other than the website loading for ages and disrupting my morning routine – it’s updated ca. 6am here).
    It’s not the cheating. It’s (probably, you never know with these things) not internalized homophobia. It’s the lack of relatability. I used to relate very much to both Joyce and Dorothy in various aspects and other characters’ bad relationship decisions were not that painful to watch. This arc? It’s like seeing (two of) yourself doing things comletely out of character for you and not being able to do anything about it. Frustrating!
    I guess I need to take a break till it blows over or at least it cuts to the other characters.

    1. deliverything

      Your comment reminded me of something from Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas, by Hunter S. Thompson: “This is the main advantage of ether: it makes you behave like the village drunkard in some early Irish novel… total loss of all basic motor skills: blurred vision, no balance, numb tongue – severance of all connection between the body and the brain. Which is interesting, because the brain continues to function more or less normally… you can actually watch yourself behaving in this terrible way, but you can’t controll it.”

      1. Drainiest Drain

        This is the second time someone’s mentioned fear and loathing this arc and I’m loving it

  48. Vulcanodon

    Gee, I think it’s going well. This is fine.

  49. LiterallyJustSomeGuy

    I want Hank to “Nope!” out of the conversation as soon as menstruation is brought up, because I think it would be funny.

  50. Bonesrental

    Astounding how close together that poll is. Only a 30 vote separation at the time of my posting

    1. deliverything

      I suspect people trying for a “both” answer have been attempting to even it out.

  51. Li

    https://www.dumbingofage.com/2020/comic/book-11/02-look-straight-ahead/contacts/

    Hank has always needed vision correction.

    Anyone wondering why he’s suddenly wearing glasses instead of contacts — if I had to guess, I’d say “because of the divorce”. He let Carol have the house, so assuming it was paid off, he’s now dealing with rent. And glasses are cheaper than contacts, especially if he already had a pair, which lots of contact-wearers do have, even if they wear contacts exclusively — though it might not be the most current prescription.

    (Sometimes your eyes are too irritated for contacts — sometimes you’re running just late enough that you don’t have time to put them in — sometimes you lose track of time and don’t get enough contacts — lots of reasons to have a backup pair of glasses!)

    …lots of other things to talk about in this strip, but yeah. Saw this a couple of times! Figured I’d provide a source since I remembered the relevant strip about vision in the Brown family, and I’m also a glasses wearer who used to do contacts “exclusively”.

    (I miss contacts tbh.)

    1. Big Z

      The other thing I was thinking is “if he was in a hurry going out the door”, since contacts add at least a little thought and process to your mornings whereas if he was on the road when he woke up he’d just throw on glasses and go.

    2. Slartibeast Button, BIA

      Or he wore only contacts because Carol liked his looks better that way, which is no longer a priority.

  52. Roe

    someone break Hank’s glasses immediately. eagle eye!

  53. Josh

    Hank is like the only “evil” parent in this comic that’d probably accept an explanation for most everything, or at least he would listen and hear them out at LEAST.

  54. brionl

    She should have said “which” brother, not what brother.

    1. Slartibeast Button, BIA

      She has a witch brother? Is that the Dreadful Secret about Jordan?

  55. thumb

    Hank on finding out his youngest is into women: Oh, I just assumed that’s what happened to everyone at these fancy universities.

    Wrong, but not quite wrong.

  56. Dot

    Oh right I was gonna give you guys an update on how the date went. It was alright, we got along, but she said she didn’t feel a romantic connection so no second date. C’est la vie!

    1. deliverything

      Well, a friend is good too, and there’ll be other possible girlfriends.

  57. mindbleach

    It would be funny as hell if he’s seen the paper and is just like ‘You know what? Later.’

  58. Reb

    Why would you not just say the birth control pills are your roommate’s (someone Hank won’t care about)? I have a feeling Hank’s going to have a reckoning about how his adults kids are going to do what they want to do. That can be really rough for some parents… not that it’s easy on the adult kids at all either.

    1. Doopyboop

      The pills are on Joyce’s desk. It wouldn’t be impossible to come up with a lie on the fly for why that is, but neither Joyce nor Dorothy’s are very good liars.

  59. S.R.

    Y’know, the guy doesn’t seem completely unreasonable, so I’d wager “I have a health condition that causes me serious pain and those are the treatment for it” might go over okay with him. Because that is completely true.

    I know some religious types are against birth control, but given that I imagine he’d prefer she not be having sex at all, and therefore the situation he’d prefer is one where she’s not in any way preventing babby from being formed, that might not be an issue.

    1. a/snow/mous/e

      And as far as Dorothy knows, Joyce won’t be using them for anything else!

    2. a/snow/mous/e

      “Joyce is just using them for menstrual pains. In fact, she doesn’t even have a boyfriend right now.”

      “W-well, we haven’t officially… broken up yet…”

      “…What?”

      “We’re still… in the process… of deciding…?”

      “What.”

  60. Jernacious

    “Are those birth control pills?”

    “… Can I eat some?”

  61. Rectilinear Propagation

    I actually got jump scared by the first panel.

    It’s my fault for having so many windows open, but still.

  62. Bagge

    I love a good ‘friend of dorothy’ joke

  63. foducool

    “it’s short for Hanky Panky”
    “Hank it is, then”

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