The education system. Sometimes getting good grades just means that person is good at remembering a bunch of trivia for just as long as they need to to pass the test.
Mkvenner
Or they cheated.
Yotomoe
Cheaters never win….except when they win.
Aizat
Life sucks if you think about it.
james
and then you die.
TheBothering
This string of comments sounds like it should be a Mike quote.
fatemaster1
Unless you’re immortal, then you have to deal with it forever.
They’d probably still be more qualified for jobs in their fields than people who couldn’t pass the class.
Aizat
True, but the thing is it’s not about how much you know, it’s about how often do you utilize what you know. Everyone knows how to cut up a person but only few knows how to do it correctly and do just that.
Mkvenner
Theory and aplication can two completely different things.
lightsabermario
Yes they can.
Rex Hondo
*nods* However, application is near impossible without the facts upon which to base it. To extend the surgery example, it doesn’t matter how deft a hand you are with a scalpel. If you don’t know human anatomy, you’re still going to be a piss-poor surgeon.
Just for kix
Oh he was talking about surgery … I see … *erases the dexter joke*
DudeMyDadOwnsADealership
But you’ve also got to measure how hard she convinces herself shes trying against how much energy goes into this fist-waving drama involving blaming others, making this SO about her and her self-esteem, her less than loving parents, how said parents liked her brother best, and last but not least, how mind-blowing it is that her manchild-wannabe brother is having more sex than her just because it was brought up in passing.
What if all that energy WASN’T wasted on making excuses, blaming society and all that Dawson’s Creek shit? Probably would’ve thought twice before writing ‘Blah blah blah blah blah’ when taking notes for math aptitude evaluation in a University setting. Bet she was expecting an enraged Professor to do the “See me after class” number, huh?
begbert2
Huh? Are you reading a different comic?
Sal hasn’t been making excuses and she hasn’t been complaining about her oh-so-horrid home life. And her talk about her sex life was before Jason even got the books out.
DudeMyDadOwnsADealership
Whining is whining. Plus, check the past strips for this month and December that have anything to do with what Sal and Jason’s current venture.
Rote and memorization of trivia don’t work for MATH.
It’s all about learning and applying skills.
And I say this as someone who’s shit at math.
Tim
Jason is a dick. I hope he doesn’t stay this judgemental all the way through.
LaurelRaven
Jason’s being provoked…not really the best time to judge him on dickishness. I really don’t blame him.
Honestly, I’m kind of sick of the attitude that “I tried hard, I should get a passing grade”. Did you learn the subject to a point of proficiency matching or exceeding the average? If the answer is no, then you should not get a passing grade.
Led
Sometimes, getting good grades simply means that the teacher likes you… Seen enough people trying to take advantage of that.
fatemaster1
My teachers only liked me because I got good grades.
Saru
I went to a community college before transferring to my current top-ranked school. I prefer the community college by a long-shot, because while I have made straight ‘A’s at both schools, I actually learned things and furthered my understanding at the community college. I still crack up when I get a class like Genetics, where I know more about basic biology after 1 course than any of the non-transfer students do after 2.
Yeeeah. Jason is like the worst TA ever here. He should be trying to set her up with whatever version of Academic Services or tutoring IU offers – at the very least, giving her the phone number for them. That is literally part of his job.
Well, it’s in Indiana. Everything is kind of terrible in Indiana.
…I say this as a current resident of the state of Indiana.
Rex Hondo
Well, maybe not everything. I am rather fond of the sushi place down the street from me.
Once you get outside of the major metropolitan areas, though… Yeah, pretty awful.
Khrene Cleaver
Ohhhh… *wipes nosebleed* I’ve never seen a certain magical miss with glasses. Sorry bout that Plasma… I’ll be on ym way now.
Seriously, he’s complaining cause she’s failing his class but trying to get help from the TA? From my experience, more than half the class in any freshman-level class is failing because they just don’t care and don’t even bother trying to get help for the class. ^=__=^ Worst. TA. EvAr. And I’ve had a TA that was convinced that all of his students were conspiring with Facebook and Twitter to let the Chinese and “Indians” (not sure if he meant Native Americans or people from India but either way, makes no sense~) to take over America and make Americans their slaves.
Moe isn’t all about the disgustingly cute. Hell one could argue the character in Plasma’s avatar has moments of moe in her spinoff series, havent seen much of the main show actually, kinda a shame…
I believe that’s the major difference between an individual’s personal idea of moe and so-called moe-anime, the latter slaps on loads of common moe elements in the hopes of attracting hardcore otaku, sometimes to the detriment of the series.
To be fair to Sal, I, myself have problems with maths beyond Year 10 eg: Calculus.
gangler
Never really could do math too well once we hit highschool. In primary school math made sense. In highschool they stopped explaining math. “This is the formula you use to solve this problem.”
“How does that formula work?”
“You don’t need to know that.”
I don’t know why they teach it that way. In any other subject the method would involve the introduction of progressively more complex principles so that by the time you introduced a particular formular we’re capable of understanding why it works the way it does.
For that matter, if we’re talking about useless skills then memorizing formulas is absolutely useless. It’s like memorizing recipes. If I’m in a situation where that’s all I need then I can just write that shit down and memory won’t be an issue. Don’t say “you won’t always have your notes” I do. When was the last time you found yourself locked away somewhere with a desperate need to make a pastry or perform an equation without access to your notes? It’s never happened.
Nobody needs a teacher to teach them recipes. They can read. There are books full of them out there. They need a teacher to teach them how to cook. They need a teacher to teach them how ingredients work. Why the heck are we putting eggs in this cake mix? They are not sweet. Well, student, eggs are a binding agent. They hold everything together. Fan-fucking-tastic. Now I know what to look for if I’m ever looking to bake a cake without any eggs for whatever reason. A binding agent. Let’s learn a little bit about binding agents and their common applications shall we? That sounds like a lecture. Much better than just simply giving me a list of ingredients and then walking off like your job is done.
Deathstalker
I am sorry, you had a shitty math department it sounds like. I could argue, that if they were just doing that they were basically not teaching mathematics, and not respecting you more than a computer.
Math, (One of my degrees is in math, and one of my family members has a PhD in mathematics) should be all about learning why the equations are the way they are, and the proof of why. In doing a proof you have to figure out why something is correct, and without a doubt. In doing so you learn a lot about the equations, and why they are of particular forms. Granted, it is HARD, but rewarding. I would say that probably most of the most brilliant people go into math, because of a reward that no science can provide.
Math, really isn’t like most people think: solving equations. It’s about prooving things, the equations are a tool, and also what gets prooven.
Unfortunately, most people don’t get introduced to proofs until college, and likely after calculus, when it should probably be introduced in middle school, or high school at the latest. It also gives you a good foundation in logic, something else sorely lacking in most people.
begbert2
I feel ya, man. I was excellent at math without even having to study until my second semester of college, when I finally got around to taking Calculus. Which was taught as a pure memorization course with no explanations whatsoever. Forget an F, I got literally a 5% in that class. (There was one short rather-unrelated chapter that actually involved thought/analysis, which I got 100% in, and then it was back to the 0%s.) Shocked me so much I took a year and a half hiatus to recover, and then could never get back into it. No core 1 degree for me!
Slipgate
gangler: Your comment, and your example with recipes and eggs…. AMAZING. I wish I could Like this message or +100 it or something. That’s fantastic.
From a former teacher, who sucks at math. 🙂
Slipgate
Robert Montrose
Because by the time you get to high school math, the equations used are often derived, quite literally, from calculus. Until you take calculus, you just have to use the formulae. Now, Wikipedia often has derivations for equations. Keep in mind that the point of most teaching in high school these days is done with the intent of getting you to pass standardized tests, not for your direct benefit. If you go into a math-heavy major/occupation, you’ll find calculus to be of actual value.
fatemaster1
After all the comments complaining about the difficulty of math here I’m going to get everyone upset at me by saying “I stopped studying for math tests in grade 6, and I still got A’s in math straight through highschool, because I’m just that good.”
Kelly
A friend of mine is very smart and very capable, but they have to study a *huge* amount (like up till 12 – 3 am almost every day, unless there is a test, when it goes longer) to be able to memorize everything. Already bad ADHD + head injury is a bongo.
Nothing Sal says in panel 4 is wrong as such, it’s just that HR departments who do the hiring for any jobs you apply for have their own ideas on what counts in the end.
OK before people started to kill me for my comment, let me explain. The thing that rattled me about grades is that parents would usually force their children to get A’s, which is typically the truth in most, if not all, Asian countries. This pressure causes the children to only memorize the things that they learn for the exams only solely to get good grades rather than utilizing that knowledge in a real world scenario and these children would rather focus on studying above all else until they reach university and/or the workforce, where they were told that they lack the soft skills needed hence why Dumbass McMoron who couldn’t solve 2+2 suddenly gets a job because he works well with others while Smarty McGenius, who got straight A’s in his entire life, got rejected by every employer because of his lack of communication skill. Or that’s the way I see it.
PS: If anyone is offended about the name or anything else, I am sorry if I offended you.
183 thoughts on “Marks”
Kernanator
Well, he has some self-awareness, it would seem.
Yotomoe
He knew this could happen the second he adorned the bowtie. But with great Bowtie, comes great responsibility.
Reboot
But what Sal forgets is that Bow Ties Are Cool.
Someone random
Sal didn’t bring up the bowtie though.
Aisling
The only person who ever made bowties look cool was Dr Who.
John Harmon
Sal does have a point though.
Mkvenner
about the education system or knowledge?
John Harmon
The education system. Sometimes getting good grades just means that person is good at remembering a bunch of trivia for just as long as they need to to pass the test.
Mkvenner
Or they cheated.
Yotomoe
Cheaters never win….except when they win.
Aizat
Life sucks if you think about it.
james
and then you die.
TheBothering
This string of comments sounds like it should be a Mike quote.
fatemaster1
Unless you’re immortal, then you have to deal with it forever.
lord of dance
or predicting what the teacher will ask
Wonder Wig
They’d probably still be more qualified for jobs in their fields than people who couldn’t pass the class.
Aizat
True, but the thing is it’s not about how much you know, it’s about how often do you utilize what you know. Everyone knows how to cut up a person but only few knows how to do it correctly and do just that.
Mkvenner
Theory and aplication can two completely different things.
lightsabermario
Yes they can.
Rex Hondo
*nods* However, application is near impossible without the facts upon which to base it. To extend the surgery example, it doesn’t matter how deft a hand you are with a scalpel. If you don’t know human anatomy, you’re still going to be a piss-poor surgeon.
Just for kix
Oh he was talking about surgery … I see … *erases the dexter joke*
DudeMyDadOwnsADealership
But you’ve also got to measure how hard she convinces herself shes trying against how much energy goes into this fist-waving drama involving blaming others, making this SO about her and her self-esteem, her less than loving parents, how said parents liked her brother best, and last but not least, how mind-blowing it is that her manchild-wannabe brother is having more sex than her just because it was brought up in passing.
What if all that energy WASN’T wasted on making excuses, blaming society and all that Dawson’s Creek shit? Probably would’ve thought twice before writing ‘Blah blah blah blah blah’ when taking notes for math aptitude evaluation in a University setting. Bet she was expecting an enraged Professor to do the “See me after class” number, huh?
begbert2
Huh? Are you reading a different comic?
Sal hasn’t been making excuses and she hasn’t been complaining about her oh-so-horrid home life. And her talk about her sex life was before Jason even got the books out.
DudeMyDadOwnsADealership
Whining is whining. Plus, check the past strips for this month and December that have anything to do with what Sal and Jason’s current venture.
Totz the Plaid
…except, this is MATH.
Rote and memorization of trivia don’t work for MATH.
It’s all about learning and applying skills.
And I say this as someone who’s shit at math.
Tim
Jason is a dick. I hope he doesn’t stay this judgemental all the way through.
LaurelRaven
Jason’s being provoked…not really the best time to judge him on dickishness. I really don’t blame him.
Honestly, I’m kind of sick of the attitude that “I tried hard, I should get a passing grade”. Did you learn the subject to a point of proficiency matching or exceeding the average? If the answer is no, then you should not get a passing grade.
Led
Sometimes, getting good grades simply means that the teacher likes you… Seen enough people trying to take advantage of that.
fatemaster1
My teachers only liked me because I got good grades.
Saru
I went to a community college before transferring to my current top-ranked school. I prefer the community college by a long-shot, because while I have made straight ‘A’s at both schools, I actually learned things and furthered my understanding at the community college. I still crack up when I get a class like Genetics, where I know more about basic biology after 1 course than any of the non-transfer students do after 2.
Trae Dorn
Yeeeah. Jason is like the worst TA ever here. He should be trying to set her up with whatever version of Academic Services or tutoring IU offers – at the very least, giving her the phone number for them. That is literally part of his job.
Plasma Mongoose
Between the TAs and RAs in DoA, I say this college sure are bad judges of characters.
Trae Dorn
Well, it’s in Indiana. Everything is kind of terrible in Indiana.
…I say this as a current resident of the state of Indiana.
Rex Hondo
Well, maybe not everything. I am rather fond of the sushi place down the street from me.
Once you get outside of the major metropolitan areas, though… Yeah, pretty awful.
Khrene Cleaver
Ohhhh… *wipes nosebleed* I’ve never seen a certain magical miss with glasses. Sorry bout that Plasma… I’ll be on ym way now.
Plasma Mongoose
I have to admit that glasses for most part are a favourite charm point of mine.
Princesscarlos
Glasses sure are nifty, aren’t they?
Dragon Nataku
Seriously, he’s complaining cause she’s failing his class but trying to get help from the TA? From my experience, more than half the class in any freshman-level class is failing because they just don’t care and don’t even bother trying to get help for the class. ^=__=^ Worst. TA. EvAr. And I’ve had a TA that was convinced that all of his students were conspiring with Facebook and Twitter to let the Chinese and “Indians” (not sure if he meant Native Americans or people from India but either way, makes no sense~) to take over America and make Americans their slaves.
*throws hands up into the air, wanders off*
Josh
She does? I can’t understand a word she’s saying when she’s angry. 😛
Kintrex
She’s sounding exceptionally Applejack in this one.
DaJoshMaster
Bleh, I hate that accent so much! But I don’t remember her swearing quite so much. 😛
David Herbert
U just mad ’cause u losing.
Wonder Wig
Dump Punk is like Steam Punk only with the Three Stooges right?
Plasma Mongoose
Does this make Sal Moe?
Aizat
Moe? NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO……oh wait you mean Moe as in the name, not the Japanese crap thing……this is embarrassing.
Plasma Mongoose
Yes I mean Moe as in the guy with the bowl haircut, not whatever personal characteristics make you go SQUEE!
Khrene Cleaver
Moe isn’t all about the disgustingly cute. Hell one could argue the character in Plasma’s avatar has moments of moe in her spinoff series, havent seen much of the main show actually, kinda a shame…
Plasma Mongoose
I believe that’s the major difference between an individual’s personal idea of moe and so-called moe-anime, the latter slaps on loads of common moe elements in the hopes of attracting hardcore otaku, sometimes to the detriment of the series.
Sensedog
That is one hell of a snarl.
Mkvenner
Why is sal even going to college? She’s obviously more cut out for manuel labor that anything a college education can get her.
Yotomoe
…cuz..not everyone wants to DO manual labor. Just cuz you’re in the physical SHAPE to do it doesn’t mean you have any desire to do it.
Mkvenner
But without knowledge it’s their only option.
Yotomoe
It’s not like she’s not trying. Some people just struggle.
Plasma Mongoose
It’s kinda scary to think that Walky is the one with the brains.
Norah
She’s bad at math, but that doesn’t mean she’s bad at all learning.
Plasma Mongoose
To be fair to Sal, I, myself have problems with maths beyond Year 10 eg: Calculus.
gangler
Never really could do math too well once we hit highschool. In primary school math made sense. In highschool they stopped explaining math. “This is the formula you use to solve this problem.”
“How does that formula work?”
“You don’t need to know that.”
I don’t know why they teach it that way. In any other subject the method would involve the introduction of progressively more complex principles so that by the time you introduced a particular formular we’re capable of understanding why it works the way it does.
For that matter, if we’re talking about useless skills then memorizing formulas is absolutely useless. It’s like memorizing recipes. If I’m in a situation where that’s all I need then I can just write that shit down and memory won’t be an issue. Don’t say “you won’t always have your notes” I do. When was the last time you found yourself locked away somewhere with a desperate need to make a pastry or perform an equation without access to your notes? It’s never happened.
Nobody needs a teacher to teach them recipes. They can read. There are books full of them out there. They need a teacher to teach them how to cook. They need a teacher to teach them how ingredients work. Why the heck are we putting eggs in this cake mix? They are not sweet. Well, student, eggs are a binding agent. They hold everything together. Fan-fucking-tastic. Now I know what to look for if I’m ever looking to bake a cake without any eggs for whatever reason. A binding agent. Let’s learn a little bit about binding agents and their common applications shall we? That sounds like a lecture. Much better than just simply giving me a list of ingredients and then walking off like your job is done.
Deathstalker
I am sorry, you had a shitty math department it sounds like. I could argue, that if they were just doing that they were basically not teaching mathematics, and not respecting you more than a computer.
Math, (One of my degrees is in math, and one of my family members has a PhD in mathematics) should be all about learning why the equations are the way they are, and the proof of why. In doing a proof you have to figure out why something is correct, and without a doubt. In doing so you learn a lot about the equations, and why they are of particular forms. Granted, it is HARD, but rewarding. I would say that probably most of the most brilliant people go into math, because of a reward that no science can provide.
Math, really isn’t like most people think: solving equations. It’s about prooving things, the equations are a tool, and also what gets prooven.
Unfortunately, most people don’t get introduced to proofs until college, and likely after calculus, when it should probably be introduced in middle school, or high school at the latest. It also gives you a good foundation in logic, something else sorely lacking in most people.
begbert2
I feel ya, man. I was excellent at math without even having to study until my second semester of college, when I finally got around to taking Calculus. Which was taught as a pure memorization course with no explanations whatsoever. Forget an F, I got literally a 5% in that class. (There was one short rather-unrelated chapter that actually involved thought/analysis, which I got 100% in, and then it was back to the 0%s.) Shocked me so much I took a year and a half hiatus to recover, and then could never get back into it. No core 1 degree for me!
Slipgate
gangler: Your comment, and your example with recipes and eggs…. AMAZING. I wish I could Like this message or +100 it or something. That’s fantastic.
From a former teacher, who sucks at math. 🙂
Slipgate
Robert Montrose
Because by the time you get to high school math, the equations used are often derived, quite literally, from calculus. Until you take calculus, you just have to use the formulae. Now, Wikipedia often has derivations for equations. Keep in mind that the point of most teaching in high school these days is done with the intent of getting you to pass standardized tests, not for your direct benefit. If you go into a math-heavy major/occupation, you’ll find calculus to be of actual value.
fatemaster1
After all the comments complaining about the difficulty of math here I’m going to get everyone upset at me by saying “I stopped studying for math tests in grade 6, and I still got A’s in math straight through highschool, because I’m just that good.”
Kelly
A friend of mine is very smart and very capable, but they have to study a *huge* amount (like up till 12 – 3 am almost every day, unless there is a test, when it goes longer) to be able to memorize everything. Already bad ADHD + head injury is a bongo.
Zababcd
No, Manuel labour. She could wait tables. But in a restaurant. But in a terrible hotel.
Totz the Plaid
Si, Mr. Fawlty!
DudeMyDadOwnsADealership
The same reason her twin brother is going to college. Mommy and Daddy *made* them.
Plasma Mongoose
Nothing Sal says in panel 4 is wrong as such, it’s just that HR departments who do the hiring for any jobs you apply for have their own ideas on what counts in the end.
Aizat
Sal is right. In the long run, grades doesn’t matter, ALL THOSE ACCOMPLISHMENTS IS FOR NOTHING.
Aizat
OK before people started to kill me for my comment, let me explain. The thing that rattled me about grades is that parents would usually force their children to get A’s, which is typically the truth in most, if not all, Asian countries. This pressure causes the children to only memorize the things that they learn for the exams only solely to get good grades rather than utilizing that knowledge in a real world scenario and these children would rather focus on studying above all else until they reach university and/or the workforce, where they were told that they lack the soft skills needed hence why Dumbass McMoron who couldn’t solve 2+2 suddenly gets a job because he works well with others while Smarty McGenius, who got straight A’s in his entire life, got rejected by every employer because of his lack of communication skill. Or that’s the way I see it.
PS: If anyone is offended about the name or anything else, I am sorry if I offended you.
Aizat
And I just raged pointlessly and explained things that people might not cared about.
Plasma Mongoose
I think you explained yourself quite well, to summarize what you said: Communication skills > Perfect grades at school.
David
I want to hear more stories about Dumbass McMoron and Smarty McGenius. Or, as they’re known in America, Goofus and Gallant.
MrLShade
G&G Is the only reason I go to the dentist or doctor (OK, I’ll admit I like “The Timbertoes”, too).
Jmacq1
I got that! I got that reference….