Or the D&D causes suicides, as opposed to people with certain mental issues need help, treatment and should avoid hobbies that can rely on knowing the difference between fantasy and reality….
Paint
Holy crap, I can’t believe I’m remembering this, but I think your avatar there is an MtG card, yes? Prodigal Sorceror or some such, 1/1 creature, tap to deal 1 damage…
MeHael
There are those who call me…
Tim.
Deanatay
Thanks. I would have had to post that, if you hadn’t.
sjmcc13
No link? 🙁
Kryss LaBryn
Wanna know the best part about that “D&D causes suicides” thing? The suicide rate amongst D&D players is actually lower than average. They’d have to start killing themselves more than they do to even reach the national US average.
Panicky anti-D&Ders are idiots.
Jalathas
I imagine part of that is because a D&D group (at least a good one) is a circle of friends who spend time together on a regular basis. That’s both a functional support system and something to continue to look forward to, both extremely important things in mental illness and suicide prevention.
(Don’t quote me on that, though, it is just an educated guess and I’m sure there’s plenty of other factors)
sjmcc13
In quite a few of these cases where “someone” is accusing a hobby of causing problems, the statistics actually indicate that it reduces those problems instead of increasing them. IIRC Games making kids violent has similar data (gamers being less violent due to having an outlet to release frustration safety).
Almost as if they are picking a hobby they do not like, something they can claim is universally objectionable, and claiming the hoby increases the objectionable action/lifestyle/effect/etc, and never actually doing the research to verify it is true.
Of course there is also scapegoating to pretend you are not at fault, and “forgetting” that correlation causation…
DarkVeghetta
If games have thought me anything, is that just PUNCHING someone of lower level then myself can kill them, instantly. I hence try to avoid punching people.
I have one I “rescued” from the mall that I was gonna mail to a friend who likes laughing at them… “OH THE TITANIC HIT AN ICEBERG I HOPE THAT UNBELIEVER REPENTED BEFORE HE DROWNED”
yeah, kinda flat after the D&D one… there was one I had but lost that I think was about a dog that found God…?? (friend read it for me, I preferred to save brain cells)
Chick tracks are so funny that I actually thought they were a parody the first time I’ve seem them. It took quite a while before learning they were not.
Steven
I remember reading somwhere that because the author doesn’t talk much there is actually something of a debate still going on about if they are parodies or not.
Gordon
Jack Chick may not make public appearances, but he has relatively(given its niche market) large publishing company and has been writing for over 50 years. He distributes his…beliefs worldwide in a surprising number of different languages.
He’s not quiet and there’s no ambiguity to what he actually believes.
Disloyal Subject
I’ll take your word for it, but there will probably always be those who suspect it all to be an elaborate joke regardless of what he says, anyway.
The rest of us can carry on laughing at the Tracts and not giving a shit about the guy’s beliefs.
The D&D one was called ‘Dark Dungeons’ and recently, someone made a fully accurate movie of it with Jack’s permission, with him not realizing they were making fun of it.
I’ve always kind of wanted to send Jack Chick an email congratulating him for undermining faith in god. Just a short, “I know what you’re doing and good on ‘ya”. You know, to encourage him to keep doing what he actually does.
Deanatay
Is there an anti-Poe’s Law? Something that says, “Any serious criticism, done stupidly enough, will be mistaken for parody?” ‘Cuz I could see that, for Chick Tracts.
Deanatay
Huh. According to TVTropes, Poe’s Law contains its opposite. So, this is Poe’s Law, too.
The one that stood out in my mind was when the little girl (Lisa) was being molested by the father who in turn let the neighbour join in, the mother was physically abusive towards her and the father gave her an std
the doctor instead of reporting him to the police got him to repent his sins and find god instead…
and apparantly they all lived happily ever after because everything was forgiven
Apparently the reason behind that one is that Chick Tract are designed to appeal to different groups of people that they wished to convert (children, people who live in poor inner city areas, fans of rock and roll etc.), so the reason WHY they thought that it’d be a good idea to make a strip saying that a serial child abuser just needs to accept Jesus into their lives and everything will be FINE is… well…
…It was designed to convert monsterous child abusers in prison, making them replace any guilt or responsibility they might fill with religion. Which, yeah…
There was another one which had an atheist who spent their entire life doing charity and being a good person going to hell when they died because they didn’t believe in God/try to convert others to Christianity, while a multiple murderer gets into Heaven because they converted at the last minute.
One of the oddest fanfic crossovers I’ve seen is Left Behind crossed with Stargate: SG1. I can’t bring myself to read it to found out how they reconcile the young earth creationism of LaHaye and Jenkins with Stargate’s timeline including events that happened millions of years ago.
omg thank you for telling me about that D&D thing that was so hilarious it made my night. I couldn’t even take it all in one go i was laughing so much.
i thought the left behind series was actually a pretty good piece of fiction honestly… but i look at things like that as pure works of fiction not… i dunno… biblical fiction? could have made a good 14-part miniseries, or else a decent hbo original imho. id have watched it.
Rutee
What. How did you arrive at Left Behind as good fiction? It’s terrible. I don’t just mean its theology (which is pretty evil!) I mean as fiction, it is bad. It engages in the authors’ pseudofetishes, and the characters are monsters (Not for their beliefs, although their beliefs are terrible, but because of their sheer inability to behave like people). And I don’t just mean the villains, or the… protagonists (I can’t use heroes for people who know about widespread nuclear devastation, and sit on their ass). Random people have totally forgotten that the children of the world are GONE. There is no cries for blood from their parents, and they don’t seem to really care. And it’s not a commentary on how people who aren’t saved are terrible – the protags are just as awful.
Personally I feel like the Left Behind books are less preachy than the Chick-tracts. Yes they are a literal interpretation of what’s in (some) parts of the bible, but I feel Jack Chick went further and layered his own bias on top of that.
The books (if I recall) involved themes like second chances and redemption. The tracts are more like “if you haven’t been living my personal brand of Christianity for your entire life, then you can go straight to hell this moment”.
Overall I still only rate them a B, because I think they go on for to long, but I can at least read them without getting a headache.
I had a fundie type quite excited when I expressed happiness at being given a Chick tract, when I told her I didn’t have that one yet. Then she got quite insulted when I informed her that I collected them to make fun of them.
It really is bad how anti-knowledge fundies are after getting, considering that so much of the foundations of modern science were laid and preserved by deeply religious and spiritual people.
It is not even a case of them not being able to co-exist, you just need to accept the limits of both science and religion, and accept that no “holy” book should be taken as 100% divine truth, and your beliefs could be proven wrong.
The way I see it, some people can’t follow the trend of civilisation forward (things go to fast and they can’t adapt), and take a purposely ultra conservative stance to cope.
From an European’s point of view, the USA are pretty much going toward a religious dark age.
To say, creationnism only has been gaining traction in the US and radicalising (passing anti abortion/contraception/etc laws) in the last decade or so.
So please, guys, let’s get Harper and his cronies out of parliament before he makes this place even more ignorant.
zoomer296
Pfft, when the second crusade comes around, just tell them that all the “godless heathens” are in some place inhospitable (The arctic tundra perhaps?), and they will all die while searching for them.
sjmcc13
Hey, the Inuit survived in the arctic unaided for millennia…
I’ll concur that it’s damn scary for Americans too. I live in a very red section of Texas. We all know that’s saying something.
I’m an atheist and in general have to hide that or at the very least simply not mention it. If I do I run the risk of becoming a pariah, being spat upon, having CPS called on me, and of having people try to surreptitiously convert my young son.
I mean, we all know that atheists have no morals at all because there is no higher power telling them right from wrong. So obviously neighbors should avoid me and my son must be protected because I’m obviously abusing him even if there is absolutely no evidence of this.
I’m just thankful I live in an area that’s just as Catholic as it is evangelical/fundamentalist. In general the Catholics tend to have a more rational and realistic view of non-believers than the Fundies. I don’t know if I’d be able to keep from going crazy if I lived in one of the counties that’s something like 80-90% evangelical fundy.
Arianod
I’m scared to ask what CPS is.
TPman
Google says Canadian Paediatric Society. ???
Wiki says Child Protection Services. Ouch.
Rheinman
Hate to say it, but compared to Texas 30 years ago we live in a golden age of secular humanism.
I would disagree as I remember my childhood being much less influenced by fundamentalism than now, but I think that comes down to where in Texas you live. I grew up in a very diverse area of San Antonio and spent a lot of time in Austin as well.
I now live in a small city that is more-or-less isolated from the major cities in the state. So of course the small, insular city and it’s surrounding minute ranch towns are going to be far less secular and have more of the good ol’ boy politics than a fairly large multicultural city.
Deepbluediver
What’s scary? That we as a society have decided to believe that our society would be better off if it followed slightly different rules?
Do you think that we on this side of the pond are less scared by some of the decisions you’ve made?
(also, I feel like the US has almost as many divisions culturally as some of the various European countries; lumping 300 million people together is almost as problematic as lumping the 1 billion or so Europeans all in the same basket)
AFAIK, very few, if any states are trying to limit birth control in the sense of pills, condoms, and other stuff that like that prevents conception. Certain places ARE trying to limit access to abortion (the Supreme Court ruling is fairly clear that we can’t outlaw it entirely) because the pro-life side of that argument sees it as honest-to-goodness killing. So to someone on the other side of the argument your comment comes across as “those hicks in the states are trying to stop murder! And that’s terrible!”
You don’t have to agree with me, but I would have you can at least understand where a different perspective comes from.
Rutee
‘slightly different rules’. Totally ignoring reality in creating educational curricula is a wildly different rule – an important one, although itself only a single rule.
“also, I feel like the US has almost as many divisions culturally as some of the various European countries,”
You can feel that all you want – it ain’t true. Meriken are insular and fairly homogenous. That you think the occasional passive-aggressive swipe at northerners or flyover country equates to the difference that the French (or basically anyone else) feels from every other neighbor they have, shows how little you know about what actual cultural differences look like. There’s often tensions that date back /millenia/, underscored by multiple wars between ethnic groups. The USA just doesn’t have separate cultures in the same way. It’s probably better thought of as an umbrella for extremely similar subcultures. There’s a bigger divide between urban and rural, but hey, the same exists in most european countries – with extremely different ideas of what that entails, even!
People know the damn pro-life argument. Of course they claim it’s murder – they just only do it when it’s pregnant women, and not anyone else who could provide life-saving organs with invasive-but-survivable medical care. Given that ‘pro-life’ people never push for this shit in general, it is a fucking lie – they just don’t consider the bodily autonomy of women relevant. When straight white men have to give up their actual, factual livers, we’ll talk about how ‘pro-life’ is a genuine belief that is sincerely held.
drs
At the risk of playing “but you”, European elites currently approach economics the way Creationists approach biology. The austerity fetish is about as intellectually respectable as anti-vaccine people.
Gamaran Sepudomyn
Yeah, but that’s also something the US seems to be getting.
N0083rP00F
The austerity fetish is in response to the government will do it all but I wont pay taxes or do anything for the community.
I’m talking about the Greeks who stayed in Greece as opposed to the ones who left to do that culturally subversive thing called a work ethic.
GamaranSepudomyn
I’m not sure I understand what you’re saying. How exactly are people who are jobless, have no money and are forced to live in small rooms with ten other people or more supposed to pay for Greece’s debts?
370 thoughts on “Strata”
Ana Chronistic
You mean science is more than just Jack Chick drawings making fun of strawman scientists?? CRAZINESS
Nightsbridge
Not possible.
Inkblot
If you think of it as satire, it becomes much more amusing– but then you take Poe’s Law into account, and everything sucks again.
Steven
Chick tracts are the funniest thing ever.
Did you read the one where D&D actually give you real powers and are a wiccan propaganda tool
Ooh or the one where you can be the best person on earth but if you don’t get on your knees and suck holy you still go to hell.
Reading the Left Behind novels is like reading on big long Tract.
gkheyf
if d&d imbued such powers, then surely there would’ve been much less virginity present at my last campaign
Plasma Mongoose
But if you don’t have virgins, how can you possibly make proper human sacrifices?
Steven
With the babies of course
Tucker
Best icon for a comment ever.
sjmcc13
Or the D&D causes suicides, as opposed to people with certain mental issues need help, treatment and should avoid hobbies that can rely on knowing the difference between fantasy and reality….
Paint
Holy crap, I can’t believe I’m remembering this, but I think your avatar there is an MtG card, yes? Prodigal Sorceror or some such, 1/1 creature, tap to deal 1 damage…
MeHael
There are those who call me…
Tim.
Deanatay
Thanks. I would have had to post that, if you hadn’t.
sjmcc13
No link? 🙁
Kryss LaBryn
Wanna know the best part about that “D&D causes suicides” thing? The suicide rate amongst D&D players is actually lower than average. They’d have to start killing themselves more than they do to even reach the national US average.
Panicky anti-D&Ders are idiots.
Jalathas
I imagine part of that is because a D&D group (at least a good one) is a circle of friends who spend time together on a regular basis. That’s both a functional support system and something to continue to look forward to, both extremely important things in mental illness and suicide prevention.
(Don’t quote me on that, though, it is just an educated guess and I’m sure there’s plenty of other factors)
sjmcc13
In quite a few of these cases where “someone” is accusing a hobby of causing problems, the statistics actually indicate that it reduces those problems instead of increasing them. IIRC Games making kids violent has similar data (gamers being less violent due to having an outlet to release frustration safety).
Almost as if they are picking a hobby they do not like, something they can claim is universally objectionable, and claiming the hoby increases the objectionable action/lifestyle/effect/etc, and never actually doing the research to verify it is true.
Of course there is also scapegoating to pretend you are not at fault, and “forgetting” that correlation causation…
DarkVeghetta
If games have thought me anything, is that just PUNCHING someone of lower level then myself can kill them, instantly. I hence try to avoid punching people.
Scoops
Dungeons & Dragons on 60 Minutes
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LN_nuxOhT2s
Ana Chronistic
I have one I “rescued” from the mall that I was gonna mail to a friend who likes laughing at them… “OH THE TITANIC HIT AN ICEBERG I HOPE THAT UNBELIEVER REPENTED BEFORE HE DROWNED”
yeah, kinda flat after the D&D one… there was one I had but lost that I think was about a dog that found God…?? (friend read it for me, I preferred to save brain cells)
Heatth
Chick tracks are so funny that I actually thought they were a parody the first time I’ve seem them. It took quite a while before learning they were not.
Steven
I remember reading somwhere that because the author doesn’t talk much there is actually something of a debate still going on about if they are parodies or not.
Gordon
Jack Chick may not make public appearances, but he has relatively(given its niche market) large publishing company and has been writing for over 50 years. He distributes his…beliefs worldwide in a surprising number of different languages.
He’s not quiet and there’s no ambiguity to what he actually believes.
Disloyal Subject
I’ll take your word for it, but there will probably always be those who suspect it all to be an elaborate joke regardless of what he says, anyway.
The rest of us can carry on laughing at the Tracts and not giving a shit about the guy’s beliefs.
Treknoid
It’s real
http://www.chick.com/
The D&D one was called ‘Dark Dungeons’ and recently, someone made a fully accurate movie of it with Jack’s permission, with him not realizing they were making fun of it.
http://www.darkdungeonsthemovie.com/
TPman
I’ve always kind of wanted to send Jack Chick an email congratulating him for undermining faith in god. Just a short, “I know what you’re doing and good on ‘ya”. You know, to encourage him to keep doing what he actually does.
Deanatay
Is there an anti-Poe’s Law? Something that says, “Any serious criticism, done stupidly enough, will be mistaken for parody?” ‘Cuz I could see that, for Chick Tracts.
Deanatay
Huh. According to TVTropes, Poe’s Law contains its opposite. So, this is Poe’s Law, too.
chris73
The one that stood out in my mind was when the little girl (Lisa) was being molested by the father who in turn let the neighbour join in, the mother was physically abusive towards her and the father gave her an std
the doctor instead of reporting him to the police got him to repent his sins and find god instead…
and apparantly they all lived happily ever after because everything was forgiven
I wish I was making that up
Opus the Poet
You sure that wasn’t a documentary about the Duggar family?
espanolbot
Apparently the reason behind that one is that Chick Tract are designed to appeal to different groups of people that they wished to convert (children, people who live in poor inner city areas, fans of rock and roll etc.), so the reason WHY they thought that it’d be a good idea to make a strip saying that a serial child abuser just needs to accept Jesus into their lives and everything will be FINE is… well…
…It was designed to convert monsterous child abusers in prison, making them replace any guilt or responsibility they might fill with religion. Which, yeah…
There was another one which had an atheist who spent their entire life doing charity and being a good person going to hell when they died because they didn’t believe in God/try to convert others to Christianity, while a multiple murderer gets into Heaven because they converted at the last minute.
espanolbot
Man there are a lot of typos I missed there.
sun tzu
To be fair, this is the one tract that even Chick (or his audience) thought was going too far, and stopped distributing.
tim gueguen
One of the oddest fanfic crossovers I’ve seen is Left Behind crossed with Stargate: SG1. I can’t bring myself to read it to found out how they reconcile the young earth creationism of LaHaye and Jenkins with Stargate’s timeline including events that happened millions of years ago.
Doctor_Who
The second greatest thing ever is the face he drew on the evil little girl in that one: link
The first greatest thing is the time Willis drew himself with the same face: link
Disloyal Subject
There go my carefully laid plans of sleeping tonight.
Cephalo the Pod
Woah, I’ve never seen this. This is amazing.
tim gueguen
It’s that little girl Tina Yothers?
tim gueguen
Isn’t, not it’s. Boy, I sure am typing poorly on here lately.
Coverfire
omg thank you for telling me about that D&D thing that was so hilarious it made my night. I couldn’t even take it all in one go i was laughing so much.
RedNoBlue
I don’t want to be Elfstar anymore. I want to be Debbie.
seespotbitejane
I was introduced to Chick Tracts freshman year of college when my roommate would just randomly shout that line.
JustcallmeSoul
i thought the left behind series was actually a pretty good piece of fiction honestly… but i look at things like that as pure works of fiction not… i dunno… biblical fiction? could have made a good 14-part miniseries, or else a decent hbo original imho. id have watched it.
Rutee
What. How did you arrive at Left Behind as good fiction? It’s terrible. I don’t just mean its theology (which is pretty evil!) I mean as fiction, it is bad. It engages in the authors’ pseudofetishes, and the characters are monsters (Not for their beliefs, although their beliefs are terrible, but because of their sheer inability to behave like people). And I don’t just mean the villains, or the… protagonists (I can’t use heroes for people who know about widespread nuclear devastation, and sit on their ass). Random people have totally forgotten that the children of the world are GONE. There is no cries for blood from their parents, and they don’t seem to really care. And it’s not a commentary on how people who aren’t saved are terrible – the protags are just as awful.
Pony
Someone bought the rights to “Dark Dungeons” by Jack Chick and made it into a movie.
It’s awesome.
http://www.darkdungeonsthemovie.com/
sjmcc13
I thought that was Mazes and Monsters
Deepbluediver
Personally I feel like the Left Behind books are less preachy than the Chick-tracts. Yes they are a literal interpretation of what’s in (some) parts of the bible, but I feel Jack Chick went further and layered his own bias on top of that.
The books (if I recall) involved themes like second chances and redemption. The tracts are more like “if you haven’t been living my personal brand of Christianity for your entire life, then you can go straight to hell this moment”.
Overall I still only rate them a B, because I think they go on for to long, but I can at least read them without getting a headache.
QD
The DND one was adapted recently into a shortfilm. It is AMAZING.
Roborat
I had a fundie type quite excited when I expressed happiness at being given a Chick tract, when I told her I didn’t have that one yet. Then she got quite insulted when I informed her that I collected them to make fun of them.
MutantSentry
That Track is a movie now, and it is glorious
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LADLv1803Vw&list=PLTtpi7gJO7XOBoFSiLAYjrfR6n9odNG9y
sjmcc13
It really is bad how anti-knowledge fundies are after getting, considering that so much of the foundations of modern science were laid and preserved by deeply religious and spiritual people.
It is not even a case of them not being able to co-exist, you just need to accept the limits of both science and religion, and accept that no “holy” book should be taken as 100% divine truth, and your beliefs could be proven wrong.
Darkoneko
it’s a matter of reaction and counter-reaction.
The way I see it, some people can’t follow the trend of civilisation forward (things go to fast and they can’t adapt), and take a purposely ultra conservative stance to cope.
From an European’s point of view, the USA are pretty much going toward a religious dark age.
Darkoneko
To say, creationnism only has been gaining traction in the US and radicalising (passing anti abortion/contraception/etc laws) in the last decade or so.
Darkoneko
Again, from an european point of view, this is fucking scary.
Ady
From an American point of view, it’s still fucking scary
TPman
From a Canadian point of view, it’s even scarier.
At least you have the ocean to protect you.
sjmcc13
Plus we Canadians see more US media thanks to various things.
Someone
We will hold them here, Canada.
N0083rP00F
We also have a Prime Minister who is all for supporting such views one way or the other and damn the Charter of Rights.
sjmcc13
Note to self: register to vote.
Cephalo the Pod
Well we Canadians have more room to hide.
OmegaDez
So please, guys, let’s get Harper and his cronies out of parliament before he makes this place even more ignorant.
zoomer296
Pfft, when the second crusade comes around, just tell them that all the “godless heathens” are in some place inhospitable (The arctic tundra perhaps?), and they will all die while searching for them.
sjmcc13
Hey, the Inuit survived in the arctic unaided for millennia…
Rutee
This far, no further?
Rutee
whoops, meant that for the canadians.
Annie
I’ll concur that it’s damn scary for Americans too. I live in a very red section of Texas. We all know that’s saying something.
I’m an atheist and in general have to hide that or at the very least simply not mention it. If I do I run the risk of becoming a pariah, being spat upon, having CPS called on me, and of having people try to surreptitiously convert my young son.
I mean, we all know that atheists have no morals at all because there is no higher power telling them right from wrong. So obviously neighbors should avoid me and my son must be protected because I’m obviously abusing him even if there is absolutely no evidence of this.
I’m just thankful I live in an area that’s just as Catholic as it is evangelical/fundamentalist. In general the Catholics tend to have a more rational and realistic view of non-believers than the Fundies. I don’t know if I’d be able to keep from going crazy if I lived in one of the counties that’s something like 80-90% evangelical fundy.
Arianod
I’m scared to ask what CPS is.
TPman
Google says Canadian Paediatric Society. ???
Wiki says Child Protection Services. Ouch.
Rheinman
Hate to say it, but compared to Texas 30 years ago we live in a golden age of secular humanism.
Annie
I would disagree as I remember my childhood being much less influenced by fundamentalism than now, but I think that comes down to where in Texas you live. I grew up in a very diverse area of San Antonio and spent a lot of time in Austin as well.
I now live in a small city that is more-or-less isolated from the major cities in the state. So of course the small, insular city and it’s surrounding minute ranch towns are going to be far less secular and have more of the good ol’ boy politics than a fairly large multicultural city.
Deepbluediver
What’s scary? That we as a society have decided to believe that our society would be better off if it followed slightly different rules?
Do you think that we on this side of the pond are less scared by some of the decisions you’ve made?
(also, I feel like the US has almost as many divisions culturally as some of the various European countries; lumping 300 million people together is almost as problematic as lumping the 1 billion or so Europeans all in the same basket)
AFAIK, very few, if any states are trying to limit birth control in the sense of pills, condoms, and other stuff that like that prevents conception. Certain places ARE trying to limit access to abortion (the Supreme Court ruling is fairly clear that we can’t outlaw it entirely) because the pro-life side of that argument sees it as honest-to-goodness killing. So to someone on the other side of the argument your comment comes across as “those hicks in the states are trying to stop murder! And that’s terrible!”
You don’t have to agree with me, but I would have you can at least understand where a different perspective comes from.
Rutee
‘slightly different rules’. Totally ignoring reality in creating educational curricula is a wildly different rule – an important one, although itself only a single rule.
“also, I feel like the US has almost as many divisions culturally as some of the various European countries,”
You can feel that all you want – it ain’t true. Meriken are insular and fairly homogenous. That you think the occasional passive-aggressive swipe at northerners or flyover country equates to the difference that the French (or basically anyone else) feels from every other neighbor they have, shows how little you know about what actual cultural differences look like. There’s often tensions that date back /millenia/, underscored by multiple wars between ethnic groups. The USA just doesn’t have separate cultures in the same way. It’s probably better thought of as an umbrella for extremely similar subcultures. There’s a bigger divide between urban and rural, but hey, the same exists in most european countries – with extremely different ideas of what that entails, even!
People know the damn pro-life argument. Of course they claim it’s murder – they just only do it when it’s pregnant women, and not anyone else who could provide life-saving organs with invasive-but-survivable medical care. Given that ‘pro-life’ people never push for this shit in general, it is a fucking lie – they just don’t consider the bodily autonomy of women relevant. When straight white men have to give up their actual, factual livers, we’ll talk about how ‘pro-life’ is a genuine belief that is sincerely held.
drs
At the risk of playing “but you”, European elites currently approach economics the way Creationists approach biology. The austerity fetish is about as intellectually respectable as anti-vaccine people.
Gamaran Sepudomyn
Yeah, but that’s also something the US seems to be getting.
N0083rP00F
The austerity fetish is in response to the government will do it all but I wont pay taxes or do anything for the community.
I’m talking about the Greeks who stayed in Greece as opposed to the ones who left to do that culturally subversive thing called a work ethic.
GamaranSepudomyn
I’m not sure I understand what you’re saying. How exactly are people who are jobless, have no money and are forced to live in small rooms with ten other people or more supposed to pay for Greece’s debts?