Hi Dad, where the fuck have you been for the last 26 years?
Casi
They ran out of smokes at the corner store, so i had to walk down to St. Louis.
vitalProximity
…from TOKYO??
Wow. Like… I was gonna be mad, because, you know, abandonment, quarter century of festering daddy issues and therapy bills, yada-yada. But like… Maybe we should proclaim you a messiah and found a church together??
Or we could go the Forrest Gump route, that’d be cool too. We can probably get you some Nike sponsorships or something. The point is, you owe it to me to let me in on the profits. I want at least 60% of the movie deal – think of it as belated child support. Hey, at least I already paid for college!
I would think you’d be proud of your Mom for her business acumen.
vitalProximity
I am incredibly proud. She taught me everything I know. I, personally, charge at least a dime per customer, and I could never have gotten there without her invaluable tutelage.
God damnit, why do these bad guys have to have some level of intelligence. This is nothing like a comic book. Damn you Willis and your (somewhat) grounded sense of realism.
Amazi-Girl is a little slow in realizing that. Really, this strip is a perfect example of the perils of trying to help someone who thinks they know everything.
I am increasingly becoming obsessed with this building and its old-school fire escape which is so old-school that the stairs go all the way to the ground.
I know the moment I express doubt, Willis will post the reference photo on twitter. But it’s odd that some administrator or other hasn’t said “holy hell, this is a lawsuit waiting to happen” and replaced at least the last ten feet with a drop ladder.
Anyway, I haven’t yet found it on google maps, neither street view nor satellite view.
Rotunda
Google Street View doesn’t have the spot: it’s the rear of Kirkwood Hall along South Woodlawn Ave., visible on Bing Maps and maybe elsewhere. Definitely real.
Marsh Maryrose
Google Maps satellite view 3D has it too. I was just looking at too many places from too high up.
I’m still amazed that the university administration hasn’t done some safety mitigation on it, especially considering IU has pumped over a billion dollars into renovations in the last few years.
Khno
Sorry, euro here. How is a stair going all the way to the ground dangerous? We only have this kind here.
It makes it so only people leaving the building can use it by dropping the ladder, but people can’t use it to enter the building.
Khno
Oh, thank you for clarifying this point for me.
Well that means we will see that implemented here in a few years. Can’t wait for more paranoia barging in.
Like these fences in preschools that have to be closed at *any* time because of potential terrorists /that wouldn’t be able to climb a *yard*/.
They could build hahas in front of these fences or stairs, now that I think of it. Maybe put gators in them. Or sharks. And give an hypodermic syringe inside the building so only the ones inside can swim though them.
Ughhhh I don’t want that to be true, because I want to believe that Mike has never been intentionally fucking with her head (to the point of triggering her, at least) – he just has a shitty sense of boundaries that no one’s ever tried to help him with, because he made sure they thought it was always on purpose (so he didn’t have to admit he was bad at something so seemingly basic despite being incredibly intelligent)… so he didn’t fully realize when he crossed the line from Asshole to Seriously Not Okay.
But. I recognize that may be a little unrealistically optimistic, and also… unfortunately, what you said might actually work. I don’t know if he’s intentionally PLANNING that or not, but if it ends up occurring as a side effect, it might be the only way they both make it out alive. :\
WaywardLynx
I’m more on the “he’s self-harming through Heroic Sacrifice” camp, and so sure he’s trying to draw Blaine’s attention to him to make him falter (since AG seems to be at a disadvantage Amber wouldn’t be allowing) I’ll be upset if that’s not the case.
Don’t think he’s planning to draw Amber out through triggering a hostage situation. He knows how well that worked out for her when it was Ethan. And you might be right that if it happens as a side effect, it’s because there was no other option.
vitalProximity
Oh thank goodness, I was looking for a reason to not believe he was doing the other thing, and I already thought he was self-harming through Heroic Sacrifice, and furthermore you’re absolutely right he would know how much the Ethan thing fucked Amber up, so I’m hoping he would also consider that a poor choice strategically as well as ethically.
I mean anything is possible with our beloved Damn You Willis, but… I think this is as reassured as it’s possible for me to be with regards to this particular possibility, so thanks.
thejeff
He explicitly said yesterday that he’d been “poking Amber’s bear” for years in the context of her being multiple timebombs and pointing her at Blaine. He’s been deliberately making her worse.
ego
number one, mike didn’t exactly didn’t manufacture amber’s inner rage. number two, the alternative to rage-y amber in a crisis is probably pathologically timid amber… which i doubt is better for The Good Guys.
given Mike’s talents, he could have been the best possible alternative to professional therapy for for Amber, from Way Back When. Given his apparent goodwill for Amber, I’m appalled he declined to employ those talents. but Amber the Mangler (of Ryan) would be pretty well-suited to the current set of circumstances, and some kind of eventual physical confrontation between Amber and Blaine was probably pretty easy to anticipate.
thejeff
He not only “declined to employ those talents”, but claims to have been using them to make her worse.
And frankly, trying to make a friend into more of a rage monster just in case she has to get into a fight with her abusive dad (who no longer has custody or access) is not exactly good strategy. I agree he didn’t cause it, but he’s been trying to ramp it up. That anyone here is thinking this is a good thing is creepy as hell.
vitalProximity
I’m… gonna play devil’s advocate here. Just because Mike is clearly intelligent and good at reading people doesn’t mean he has a good understanding of mental health or healthy coping mechanisms; in fact, I’d argue it’s pretty clear that he doesn’t. He clearly copes with his own repressed emotions through various forms of aggression (albeit not as physical as Amber/AG’s), and possibly believes that it’s working just fine for him. Hell, until very recently, as far as we know, there may have been zero evidence for him that there were any major issues with this strategy. (I mean, besides the complete lack of any emotional intimacy, even of a platonic nature, but I’m pretty sure he’s convinced himself he doesn’t really need that and just takes it for granted by this point.)
I guess what I’m getting at is… If he truly believes the best way to handle past hurt by someone is some cathartic vengeance, then – *from his perspective* – and, as someone who sees it as his personal duty to interfere in his friends’ lives (looking at you too, Dirk Strider) …wouldn’t it be the mark of a bad friend to let her enter that eventual confrontation as a timid and “helpless” emotional wreck who is likely to continue to fall prey to Blaine’s emotional hold on her (thus creating yet more trauma and not breaking the cycle of control), rather than a strong, ragemonster emotional wreck who is likely to kick his ass and realize Blaine doesn’t actually have that much power over her anymore, and begin the long process of healing from all the childhood turmoil?
…Listen, I’m not saying what he did is okay. But I am saying… I think he maybe genuinely wouldn’t see the issue with his course of action without someone pointing it out to him. He may genuinely believe he’s helping her by “toughening her up” (another Dirk Strider nod here; for any Homestuck fans, this is arguably also the entire foundation of caliginous romance/kismeses, since troll culture is a bloodthirsty, survival of the fittest kind of deal).
Additionally, as you mentioned, I would like to point out that Mike has supposedly been “poking Amber’s bear for years,” and they just got to college, what, like a month or two ago at the most? So, the custody/access thing doesn’t really make sense; when Mike first met Amber, she was living with and being actively traumatized by Blaine. She responded by retreating into her shell; he may have been trying to encourage her to fight back, instead. Also, he was like 12 or 13 at the most when they met? Pretty sure no one at that age understands like 90% of things about people, even if they’re crazy skilled at manipulation.
Once again, I am not condoning Mike’s actions. But I am pointing out that, skilled and intelligent as he is, he is still only an 18-year-old human being. It’s one hundred percent possible he genuinely thought he was helping her become more independent and confident in herself. He went about it in WAY the wrong way, but I’m not sure he had any way of realizing that.
My question now would be, if someone sat him down and explained to him why his actions were actually rather cruel in their effect, would his reaction be A)”…Eh, oh well. She’ll be fine. It’ll be worth it to see her smash Blaine’s skull in,” or B) “…Shit. I didn’t… I mean, yes, I do intend to be an asshole pretty often, but only when it’s on purpose, or at least a minor, happy accident. This was major, and not calculated. I thought I was helping her – you know, a little tough love to strengthen her up. How the hell am I supposed to fix this??”
If A, then yeah, he’s an unredeemable dickwad, and even I, who find him weirdly sympathetic, would lose a LOT of fondness, respect, and sympathy for him. Like, basically all of it, honestly. But if B… then I’d be like, “Oh look, he’s human after all, and capable of actually fucking things up like the rest of us. Looks like he’s remorseful and willing to learn from his mistakes; yay, character development! …Also, yeah, Mike, how the hell are you going to fix this? Cuz you have seriously wronged one of the few people you apparently care about. Indescribably not cool, dude.”
thejeff
He said 5 years. They’ve only been in school for a couple months, but Amber’s parents are divorced and she hadn’t seen him for 3 years at the start of the year. Thus the lack of custody/access – for most of the time Mike was poking her.
You could be right about his motivations, though I’m not convinced there’s strong evidence for it. It still leaves him in about the same moral position as the abusive parent who’s “just trying to toughen them up”.
Without the actual parental power advantage, but I think the concept still holds. A friend doing that is still a bad friend, even if they think they’re helping.
vitalProximity
Fair enough. I’ve often thought he seems like the type of person who acts like a dick because they’re not entirely sure how to have a genuine relationship with others without completely changing who they are as a person, so they decide to intentionally act like a dick all the time to cover up for the times when they do it on accident. (i.e., “At least if they think I’m a dick, they won’t feel sorry for me instead. I’d rather be hated than pitied.”)
That said, you’re right, it certainly doesn’t give him much of a moral high ground even if he really didn’t know any better. It certainly doesn’t make him a good friend.
Long story short, I really, REALLY hope that “triggering Amber into joining the fight” is NOT his plan. I don’t necessarily think it is, but at this point I don’t think we’ve seen Mike in any similar circumstances in DoA and therefore I think we have to collectively admit at this point that we just have insufficient data to be able to accurately predict his plans, motivations, or actions in this context… So, it also totally COULD be his intention. I think this is legitimately a defining moment for all four characters here – it’s time to decide whether they will continue on their previous trajectories or drastically change course, and each of their decisions will have far-reaching consequences.
Blaine, I’m pretty sure is locked into this course for good, and happy to be there. The other three… it really could go any way at this point. Ross is looking less and less likely to have a change of heart at this point, but it could still happen. And who even knows what’s going on with Mike or Amazi-Girl (and/or Amber, lurking somewhere behind the scenes).
I just hope everyone makes the best choices they can here, and escapes in good enough shape to seriously reconsider their past choices, and hopefully work for some personal growth.
How is there no one else around? You would think Mike shouting out for a vigilante while on his scooter would have attracted some attention. And he got hit by a car. No one called the police?
There’s solid evidence the Kitty Genovese “Bystander Effect” thing was more of a “Cops Didn’t Care About Queer Girl From Queens” effect and grossly exaggerated by the press because of confirmation bias, tho. Just putting that out there :’3
Help might arrive yet.
vitalProximity
Okay, thanks again, I just looked into that more thoroughly and saw more recent info than was presented to me when I learned about it in college. That… makes me feel a lot better about humanity, frankly.
I mean, not the whole “Cops don’t care about queer girl” thing, that makes me feel shitty. But the fact that there are several different fairly reputable links suggesting the Bystander Effect as a whole may have been at least partially debunked.
vitalProximity
…Okay, wow, looked AGAIN, and most of those articles are literally from 2019. I feel a little better about not hearing about that yet.
miri
Me too, since I learnt about that in 2000 or 2001 and the idea of ~30 people just watching and not doing anything seemed horrific…
vitalProximity
Yeah, we literally learned about it in my psych classes in my psychology major in like 2013-2015ish time frame. Furthermore, my honors psych project (where I conducted a full study with the supervision/guidance of a professor and a grad student) was literally all about prosocial behavior (helping, sharing, generosity, etc.), as were all the other studies in the lab I worked in for over a year. Admittedly, our field was social cognitive development, so much of the research we both read and conducted was concentrated on the 10-and-under crowd. But… still. Anyway, one of the biggest ongoing debates in research of prosocial behavior is “Does altruism actually exist? Moreso, what would even be its operational definition?” So… I, like you, was horrified when I heard that story. It made a pretty big impact on me. It was probably in Psych 101, before I got into the major or my research, and in retrospect may have even shaped my interest in, essentially, proving that humans do have good in them, and also trying to figure out what circumstances draw that out versus suppress it.
I am… SO relieved by this info. Like, I have no words. I’ll have to actually go read a couple of those articles, now that I’m actually awake finally.
Chris Phoenix
I don’t know if it’s real or retconning, but I read an investigation a few years ago that said:
1) The attack took place out of sight
2) Before that, several people did call the cops
3) The whole “everyone watched” was basically 100% made up.
vitalProximity
What I remember hearing when we learned about it in my class was that it took place in the alley next to a (her?) apartment building, right below several stories of windows, and when they interviewed people later, they confirmed they had heard her screaming for help but all just “assumed someone else would call.” However, as mentioned, I haven’t had a chance to read the “debunking” articles yet, so whatever you read could be 100% accurate. Also, now that you mention it, your item number 2 is very, VERY softly ringing some quiet bells, which makes me wonder if they were in the initial phases of such an investigation when we discussed it in class, and the professor maybe mentioned that they had already found that part out.
thejeff
Yeah, I don’t remember when I first learned that, but it was awhile back now. Poking around wikipedia, it seems that, while it was accepted for a long time, there was NYT retrospective that raised questions in 2004 and a scholarly piece in American Psychology in 2007 that basically tore it apart.
Yep. Operation “I just ignore Amazi-Girl, turn my back on her, and walk off to do evil” doesn’t seem terribly promising, tactically speaking. I’m not saying that I’d rather go in against a Sicilian when death is on the line, but it’s not one of the best plans I’ve heard.
This. Now that Blaine’s back is turned to her, it’s the perfect time to hit him. Just make sure to aim for his head this time. Or the crotch if he wasn’t smart enough to wear a cup.
Also to be fair Mike, you kinda outed yourself with that whole thing. You could have just told her to mind her own business and kept the plan going. So let us say it is 50/50 fault ok?
No, Mike just made the decision to lure one away, then felt the need to explain when Amber asked (this is when/why he labels the plan), which has now wrecked his plan because now they’re just both going for him.
This is Mike. He knows better than to out information unless it’s part of his plan. Yes, he’s not superhuman, but he at least has enough sense to not monologue about how he is manipulating people
Khyrin
It is absolutely part of his plan. Now they’re BOTH focused on him, and just turned his back on Amazi-Girl/Amber.
Mike, you could have just said, “I know what I’m doing – focus on Dick Luther”. You didn’t need to to explain the entire plan. This one’s on you, buddy, not AG
Can we also give Ross credit here though for being apparently 0% interested in taking offense at Mike’s snide comments? Like, he literally has not even twitched an eyebrow as far as I can tell.
Don’t rule out “Too stupid to know when he’s being insulted.”
vitalProximity
Also possible, although Mike DID literally say, twice, “insult his mustache” when describing his “operation” to AG. Although, Toedad actually looks a little incredulous (or possibly just pissed) in panel 4 between Mike saying he should be easy to outmaneuver and his epic “Have you seen his neck” burn. It’s hard to tell, though – see above, re: sack of wet cheese.
vitalProximity
Thank you, Deanatay, that made me cackle loud enough to wake up my poor dog. ?
(Even if that’s true though… he hasn’t even [visibly] faltered. Dang.)
156 thoughts on “Lure”
Ana Chronistic
hi from MAGFest I’m tired
Author X
hi tired, I’m from MAGFest.
FacelessDeviant
Hi Tired and From MAGFest, I’m Dad.
Delicious Taffy
Hi Dad, where the fuck have you been for the last 26 years?
Casi
They ran out of smokes at the corner store, so i had to walk down to St. Louis.
vitalProximity
…from TOKYO??
Wow. Like… I was gonna be mad, because, you know, abandonment, quarter century of festering daddy issues and therapy bills, yada-yada. But like… Maybe we should proclaim you a messiah and found a church together??
Or we could go the Forrest Gump route, that’d be cool too. We can probably get you some Nike sponsorships or something. The point is, you owe it to me to let me in on the profits. I want at least 60% of the movie deal – think of it as belated child support. Hey, at least I already paid for college!
Doctor_Who
Good: Someone besides me makes the bat joke.
Bad: It’s Mike. I now have something in common with Mike. You know, besides that thing with your mom.
vitalProximity
Don’t forget about your mom.
You and Mike have something very important in common: You’ve both been inside her.
Deanatay
O hai I herd u mom liek nickles so I gots her nickles
AND THEN I FUCKED HER.
vitalProximity
Multiple nickels? Dude, you overpayed. That fine, fine woman fleeced you, good sir/madam/gentlebeing. I hope it was worth it.
DSL
I would think you’d be proud of your Mom for her business acumen.
vitalProximity
I am incredibly proud. She taught me everything I know. I, personally, charge at least a dime per customer, and I could never have gotten there without her invaluable tutelage.
Kyrik Michalowski
God damnit, why do these bad guys have to have some level of intelligence. This is nothing like a comic book. Damn you Willis and your (somewhat) grounded sense of realism.
Cholma
Yeah, WTF? The GOOD guys are monologue-ing instead of the bad guys!
bodmans
The “GOOD” guys. Might as well be the lesser of 2 evils
Hugo Bedward
I don’t think it’s that intelligent considering Blaine’s gonna have his back turned to Amazi-Girl.
DSL
Amazi-Girl is a little slow in realizing that. Really, this strip is a perfect example of the perils of trying to help someone who thinks they know everything.
Stephen Bierce
Like I said, the real twist is coming. I bet it’s hiding in plain sight.
Agemegos
Yeah, I don’t think that Mike picked the stairway at random.
Besides: still waiting for the Asher shoe to drop.
Marsh Maryrose
I am increasingly becoming obsessed with this building and its old-school fire escape which is so old-school that the stairs go all the way to the ground.
I know the moment I express doubt, Willis will post the reference photo on twitter. But it’s odd that some administrator or other hasn’t said “holy hell, this is a lawsuit waiting to happen” and replaced at least the last ten feet with a drop ladder.
Anyway, I haven’t yet found it on google maps, neither street view nor satellite view.
Rotunda
Google Street View doesn’t have the spot: it’s the rear of Kirkwood Hall along South Woodlawn Ave., visible on Bing Maps and maybe elsewhere. Definitely real.
Marsh Maryrose
Google Maps satellite view 3D has it too. I was just looking at too many places from too high up.
I’m still amazed that the university administration hasn’t done some safety mitigation on it, especially considering IU has pumped over a billion dollars into renovations in the last few years.
Khno
Sorry, euro here. How is a stair going all the way to the ground dangerous? We only have this kind here.
Stephen Bierce
CRIME.
Shade
It makes it so only people leaving the building can use it by dropping the ladder, but people can’t use it to enter the building.
Khno
Oh, thank you for clarifying this point for me.
Well that means we will see that implemented here in a few years. Can’t wait for more paranoia barging in.
Like these fences in preschools that have to be closed at *any* time because of potential terrorists /that wouldn’t be able to climb a *yard*/.
They could build hahas in front of these fences or stairs, now that I think of it. Maybe put gators in them. Or sharks. And give an hypodermic syringe inside the building so only the ones inside can swim though them.
Lark
I’m guessing that Mike’s plan is to trigger Amber into joining the fight by endangering himself.
vitalProximity
Ughhhh I don’t want that to be true, because I want to believe that Mike has never been intentionally fucking with her head (to the point of triggering her, at least) – he just has a shitty sense of boundaries that no one’s ever tried to help him with, because he made sure they thought it was always on purpose (so he didn’t have to admit he was bad at something so seemingly basic despite being incredibly intelligent)… so he didn’t fully realize when he crossed the line from Asshole to Seriously Not Okay.
But. I recognize that may be a little unrealistically optimistic, and also… unfortunately, what you said might actually work. I don’t know if he’s intentionally PLANNING that or not, but if it ends up occurring as a side effect, it might be the only way they both make it out alive. :\
WaywardLynx
I’m more on the “he’s self-harming through Heroic Sacrifice” camp, and so sure he’s trying to draw Blaine’s attention to him to make him falter (since AG seems to be at a disadvantage Amber wouldn’t be allowing) I’ll be upset if that’s not the case.
Don’t think he’s planning to draw Amber out through triggering a hostage situation. He knows how well that worked out for her when it was Ethan.
And you might be right that if it happens as a side effect, it’s because there was no other option.vitalProximity
Oh thank goodness, I was looking for a reason to not believe he was doing the other thing, and I already thought he was self-harming through Heroic Sacrifice, and furthermore you’re absolutely right he would know how much the Ethan thing fucked Amber up, so I’m hoping he would also consider that a poor choice strategically as well as ethically.
I mean anything is possible with our beloved Damn You Willis, but… I think this is as reassured as it’s possible for me to be with regards to this particular possibility, so thanks.
thejeff
He explicitly said yesterday that he’d been “poking Amber’s bear” for years in the context of her being multiple timebombs and pointing her at Blaine. He’s been deliberately making her worse.
ego
number one, mike didn’t exactly didn’t manufacture amber’s inner rage. number two, the alternative to rage-y amber in a crisis is probably pathologically timid amber… which i doubt is better for The Good Guys.
given Mike’s talents, he could have been the best possible alternative to professional therapy for for Amber, from Way Back When. Given his apparent goodwill for Amber, I’m appalled he declined to employ those talents. but Amber the Mangler (of Ryan) would be pretty well-suited to the current set of circumstances, and some kind of eventual physical confrontation between Amber and Blaine was probably pretty easy to anticipate.
thejeff
He not only “declined to employ those talents”, but claims to have been using them to make her worse.
And frankly, trying to make a friend into more of a rage monster just in case she has to get into a fight with her abusive dad (who no longer has custody or access) is not exactly good strategy. I agree he didn’t cause it, but he’s been trying to ramp it up. That anyone here is thinking this is a good thing is creepy as hell.
vitalProximity
I’m… gonna play devil’s advocate here. Just because Mike is clearly intelligent and good at reading people doesn’t mean he has a good understanding of mental health or healthy coping mechanisms; in fact, I’d argue it’s pretty clear that he doesn’t. He clearly copes with his own repressed emotions through various forms of aggression (albeit not as physical as Amber/AG’s), and possibly believes that it’s working just fine for him. Hell, until very recently, as far as we know, there may have been zero evidence for him that there were any major issues with this strategy. (I mean, besides the complete lack of any emotional intimacy, even of a platonic nature, but I’m pretty sure he’s convinced himself he doesn’t really need that and just takes it for granted by this point.)
I guess what I’m getting at is… If he truly believes the best way to handle past hurt by someone is some cathartic vengeance, then – *from his perspective* – and, as someone who sees it as his personal duty to interfere in his friends’ lives (looking at you too, Dirk Strider) …wouldn’t it be the mark of a bad friend to let her enter that eventual confrontation as a timid and “helpless” emotional wreck who is likely to continue to fall prey to Blaine’s emotional hold on her (thus creating yet more trauma and not breaking the cycle of control), rather than a strong, ragemonster emotional wreck who is likely to kick his ass and realize Blaine doesn’t actually have that much power over her anymore, and begin the long process of healing from all the childhood turmoil?
…Listen, I’m not saying what he did is okay. But I am saying… I think he maybe genuinely wouldn’t see the issue with his course of action without someone pointing it out to him. He may genuinely believe he’s helping her by “toughening her up” (another Dirk Strider nod here; for any Homestuck fans, this is arguably also the entire foundation of caliginous romance/kismeses, since troll culture is a bloodthirsty, survival of the fittest kind of deal).
Additionally, as you mentioned, I would like to point out that Mike has supposedly been “poking Amber’s bear for years,” and they just got to college, what, like a month or two ago at the most? So, the custody/access thing doesn’t really make sense; when Mike first met Amber, she was living with and being actively traumatized by Blaine. She responded by retreating into her shell; he may have been trying to encourage her to fight back, instead. Also, he was like 12 or 13 at the most when they met? Pretty sure no one at that age understands like 90% of things about people, even if they’re crazy skilled at manipulation.
Once again, I am not condoning Mike’s actions. But I am pointing out that, skilled and intelligent as he is, he is still only an 18-year-old human being. It’s one hundred percent possible he genuinely thought he was helping her become more independent and confident in herself. He went about it in WAY the wrong way, but I’m not sure he had any way of realizing that.
My question now would be, if someone sat him down and explained to him why his actions were actually rather cruel in their effect, would his reaction be A)”…Eh, oh well. She’ll be fine. It’ll be worth it to see her smash Blaine’s skull in,” or B) “…Shit. I didn’t… I mean, yes, I do intend to be an asshole pretty often, but only when it’s on purpose, or at least a minor, happy accident. This was major, and not calculated. I thought I was helping her – you know, a little tough love to strengthen her up. How the hell am I supposed to fix this??”
If A, then yeah, he’s an unredeemable dickwad, and even I, who find him weirdly sympathetic, would lose a LOT of fondness, respect, and sympathy for him. Like, basically all of it, honestly. But if B… then I’d be like, “Oh look, he’s human after all, and capable of actually fucking things up like the rest of us. Looks like he’s remorseful and willing to learn from his mistakes; yay, character development! …Also, yeah, Mike, how the hell are you going to fix this? Cuz you have seriously wronged one of the few people you apparently care about. Indescribably not cool, dude.”
thejeff
He said 5 years. They’ve only been in school for a couple months, but Amber’s parents are divorced and she hadn’t seen him for 3 years at the start of the year. Thus the lack of custody/access – for most of the time Mike was poking her.
You could be right about his motivations, though I’m not convinced there’s strong evidence for it. It still leaves him in about the same moral position as the abusive parent who’s “just trying to toughen them up”.
Without the actual parental power advantage, but I think the concept still holds. A friend doing that is still a bad friend, even if they think they’re helping.
vitalProximity
Fair enough. I’ve often thought he seems like the type of person who acts like a dick because they’re not entirely sure how to have a genuine relationship with others without completely changing who they are as a person, so they decide to intentionally act like a dick all the time to cover up for the times when they do it on accident. (i.e., “At least if they think I’m a dick, they won’t feel sorry for me instead. I’d rather be hated than pitied.”)
That said, you’re right, it certainly doesn’t give him much of a moral high ground even if he really didn’t know any better. It certainly doesn’t make him a good friend.
Long story short, I really, REALLY hope that “triggering Amber into joining the fight” is NOT his plan. I don’t necessarily think it is, but at this point I don’t think we’ve seen Mike in any similar circumstances in DoA and therefore I think we have to collectively admit at this point that we just have insufficient data to be able to accurately predict his plans, motivations, or actions in this context… So, it also totally COULD be his intention. I think this is legitimately a defining moment for all four characters here – it’s time to decide whether they will continue on their previous trajectories or drastically change course, and each of their decisions will have far-reaching consequences.
Blaine, I’m pretty sure is locked into this course for good, and happy to be there. The other three… it really could go any way at this point. Ross is looking less and less likely to have a change of heart at this point, but it could still happen. And who even knows what’s going on with Mike or Amazi-Girl (and/or Amber, lurking somewhere behind the scenes).
I just hope everyone makes the best choices they can here, and escapes in good enough shape to seriously reconsider their past choices, and hopefully work for some personal growth.
Mra
How is there no one else around? You would think Mike shouting out for a vigilante while on his scooter would have attracted some attention. And he got hit by a car. No one called the police?
BBCC
It’s after midnight. We last saw anybody before he went through the woods. He’s come out the other side.
vitalProximity
Google <a href="https://www.google.com/search?sxsrf=ACYBGNQQiJTv391pec6SyrdVMVMRj2h9jg%3A1578033545265&ei=ieEOXoHmD4Hc-gTehpOYDA&q=kitty+genovese&oq=kitty+genovese&gs_l=psy-ab.3..0i273j0i67j0j0i6 🙁
vitalProximity
Whoops. Google “Kitty Genovese”. 🙁
WaywardLynx
There’s solid evidence the Kitty Genovese “Bystander Effect” thing was more of a “Cops Didn’t Care About Queer Girl From Queens” effect and grossly exaggerated by the press because of confirmation bias, tho. Just putting that out there :’3
Help might arrive yet.
vitalProximity
Okay, thanks again, I just looked into that more thoroughly and saw more recent info than was presented to me when I learned about it in college. That… makes me feel a lot better about humanity, frankly.
I mean, not the whole “Cops don’t care about queer girl” thing, that makes me feel shitty. But the fact that there are several different fairly reputable links suggesting the Bystander Effect as a whole may have been at least partially debunked.
vitalProximity
…Okay, wow, looked AGAIN, and most of those articles are literally from 2019. I feel a little better about not hearing about that yet.
miri
Me too, since I learnt about that in 2000 or 2001 and the idea of ~30 people just watching and not doing anything seemed horrific…
vitalProximity
Yeah, we literally learned about it in my psych classes in my psychology major in like 2013-2015ish time frame. Furthermore, my honors psych project (where I conducted a full study with the supervision/guidance of a professor and a grad student) was literally all about prosocial behavior (helping, sharing, generosity, etc.), as were all the other studies in the lab I worked in for over a year. Admittedly, our field was social cognitive development, so much of the research we both read and conducted was concentrated on the 10-and-under crowd. But… still. Anyway, one of the biggest ongoing debates in research of prosocial behavior is “Does altruism actually exist? Moreso, what would even be its operational definition?” So… I, like you, was horrified when I heard that story. It made a pretty big impact on me. It was probably in Psych 101, before I got into the major or my research, and in retrospect may have even shaped my interest in, essentially, proving that humans do have good in them, and also trying to figure out what circumstances draw that out versus suppress it.
I am… SO relieved by this info. Like, I have no words. I’ll have to actually go read a couple of those articles, now that I’m actually awake finally.
Chris Phoenix
I don’t know if it’s real or retconning, but I read an investigation a few years ago that said:
1) The attack took place out of sight
2) Before that, several people did call the cops
3) The whole “everyone watched” was basically 100% made up.
vitalProximity
What I remember hearing when we learned about it in my class was that it took place in the alley next to a (her?) apartment building, right below several stories of windows, and when they interviewed people later, they confirmed they had heard her screaming for help but all just “assumed someone else would call.” However, as mentioned, I haven’t had a chance to read the “debunking” articles yet, so whatever you read could be 100% accurate. Also, now that you mention it, your item number 2 is very, VERY softly ringing some quiet bells, which makes me wonder if they were in the initial phases of such an investigation when we discussed it in class, and the professor maybe mentioned that they had already found that part out.
thejeff
Yeah, I don’t remember when I first learned that, but it was awhile back now. Poking around wikipedia, it seems that, while it was accepted for a long time, there was NYT retrospective that raised questions in 2004 and a scholarly piece in American Psychology in 2007 that basically tore it apart.
The myth still exists, of course.
Chaucer59
FFS, AG. Whack Blaine across the back of the head with the scooter and end this b/s.
Agemegos
Yep. Operation “I just ignore Amazi-Girl, turn my back on her, and walk off to do evil” doesn’t seem terribly promising, tactically speaking. I’m not saying that I’d rather go in against a Sicilian when death is on the line, but it’s not one of the best plans I’ve heard.
Keulen
This. Now that Blaine’s back is turned to her, it’s the perfect time to hit him. Just make sure to aim for his head this time. Or the crotch if he wasn’t smart enough to wear a cup.
LauraS
Or his knee. Get him on the ground!
abysswatcher1993
This is why edgy people fail at being heroes… unless they are Batman. Everyone wants to be Batman.
Felian
let’s hope Ross is NOT Batman, despite the dead bat on his face 😛
vitalProximity
This is why edgy people fail at being heroes… unless they are a man dressed like a bat. Everyone wants to be a man dressed like a bat.
Kyrik Michalowski
Also to be fair Mike, you kinda outed yourself with that whole thing. You could have just told her to mind her own business and kept the plan going. So let us say it is 50/50 fault ok?
MK15
True. Unless the reverse (reverse reverse?) psychology is also part of Mike’s plan…
Is anyone in that building or is it just a class hall that would be closed at night?
Alanari
Well, he just made blaine turn his back to ag. And since the back basically is a big blind spot, she has an advantage now. Let’s hope she uses it.
vitalProximity
To be fair, Mike announces his plans all the time, people just usually ignore him.
Woomy
I’m completely lost here. Did Amazigirl and Mike plan this?
Axel
No, Mike just made the decision to lure one away, then felt the need to explain when Amber asked (this is when/why he labels the plan), which has now wrecked his plan because now they’re just both going for him.
Icalasari
This is Mike. He knows better than to out information unless it’s part of his plan. Yes, he’s not superhuman, but he at least has enough sense to not monologue about how he is manipulating people
Khyrin
It is absolutely part of his plan. Now they’re BOTH focused on him, and just turned his back on Amazi-Girl/Amber.
miri
Toedad already bucked that trend by going where he said he was going
TheKelliestKelly
Mike, you could have just said, “I know what I’m doing – focus on Dick Luther”. You didn’t need to to explain the entire plan. This one’s on you, buddy, not AG
DailyBrad
“Have you seen his neck? Me neither” has me in stitches, especially when the bat line already had me cracking up.
vitalProximity
Can we also give Ross credit here though for being apparently 0% interested in taking offense at Mike’s snide comments? Like, he literally has not even twitched an eyebrow as far as I can tell.
Impressive.
Deanatay
It’s less that Ross is unaffected and more that Ross’ face has the expressiveness of a sack of wet cheese.
DSL
Don’t rule out “Too stupid to know when he’s being insulted.”
vitalProximity
Also possible, although Mike DID literally say, twice, “insult his mustache” when describing his “operation” to AG. Although, Toedad actually looks a little incredulous (or possibly just pissed) in panel 4 between Mike saying he should be easy to outmaneuver and his epic “Have you seen his neck” burn. It’s hard to tell, though – see above, re: sack of wet cheese.
vitalProximity
Thank you, Deanatay, that made me cackle loud enough to wake up my poor dog. ?
(Even if that’s true though… he hasn’t even [visibly] faltered. Dang.)